Mike Williams Cut by Raiders

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

More importantly, who CARES about college stats? Explain exactly how those stats are relevant to a league where every CB is so fast that in order to beat him, your QB needs to get the ball out of his hands BEFORE you make your cut?

Williams is a HORRIBLE route runner. Yes he's big. Yes he has good hands. Yes, his speed is solid. But he has proven to be lazy in the NFL; his route-running has not improved one iota. Just like Brandon Lloyd, QBs simply can't count on him to be where he's supposed to be when running a route. In an Al Saunders system based on timing, Williams would be a disaster.

This isn't college. You can't simply go one-on-one like Palmer and Leinart say; you can't just toss the ball up and let him go get it, because safeties will get there. This is the NFL, where speed is paramount.

I didn't think this idea needed any serious analysis, because everybody and their brother knows that Mike Williams has been a disaster at the NFL level (coming to camp way out of shape in Detroit ring a bell??).

But anyway, there you have it, genuine thought. Now can we lock this thread down, because it has entered the realm of the retarded.

I agree with most of what you sadi except that you just can't throw the ball up and let him go get it because this is the NFL. I see this done in the NFL every week. Not saying him but that it is done all the time.

[wilsowilso]

Mike Williams puts the I in immature. He is not a man. He is mentally stunted man child.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Again, chill out peeps.

[MTK]

LOL I'm sorry but this is getting retarded. Call me in 3 years when this guy is out of football completely.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by dgack

This is a good argument, because our "burners" and precise route runners are currently rocking the house in the Al Saunders system based on timing..

Lately, this has more to do with pressure in Campbell's face because of our terrible patchwork offensive line.

Originally Posted by dgack

Another good argument. It's true that the small, fast receiver has really taken the NFL by storm and tall, strong receivers don't succeed at hauling down jump balls anymore.

Size doesn't matter. Steve Smith is doing quite well for himself. Randle-El was having a tremendous season before Rabach got hurt and we became vulnerable up the middle to pressure.

Originally Posted by dgack

Agreed. Detroit and Oakland have some of the better player development records in the league and they are the finer examples of barometers of whether someone can make it in the NFL or not.

I don't understand how taking the trash cast off from two of the crappier teams in the league makes us better. I know there are stories of guys getting cut from one team, and then catching on with another and tearing it up. But honestly, how often does that happen? For every guy who makes it big with a change of scenery, how many simply get cut and never picked up again? Does the fact that he's a former first rounder change the probability that he'll be any good for us? I don't think so.

[calia]

"Cheap and available." Anyone remember the failed Redskins coach for whom that quote applied?

In any event, although I have real doubts about whether MW can do anything to help, we could likely get him for a song and how could it hurt to get him in the mix. NONE OF OUR WRs HAS A TD THIS SEASON! Has that ever happened through 7 games? A big WR will help take the pressure of Campbell because it gives him an option to throw a pass and let a WR go get it -- something we cannot do with the current WR roster of small but speedy guys.

Here are our current reception stats -- a little hard to read, but Cooley has 5 TD catches and Sellers has 1; no one else has one:

Ladell Betts WAS RB 9 84 9.3 12.0 28 0 1 0 4 44.4 0
Chris Cooley WAS TE 23 219 9.5 31.3 28 5 1 0 15 65.2 1
Brandon Lloyd WAS WR 2 14 7.0 2.0 9 0 0 0 0 0.0 0
Keenan McCardell WAS WR 4 69 17.3 23.0 21 0 2 0 3 75.0 0
Santana Moss WAS WR 20 248 12.4 41.3 49 0 2 2 12 60.0 0
Clinton Portis WAS RB 19 156 8.2 22.3 25 0 3 0 9 47.4 0
Antwaan Randle El WAS WR 26 465 17.9 66.4 54 0 7 2 20 76.9 1
Mike Sellers WAS FB 10 61 6.1 8.7 24 1 1 0 3 30.0 1
James Thrash WAS WR 3 16 5.3 2.3 7 0 0 0 0 0.0 0
Todd Yoder WAS TE 5 46 9.2 6.6 18 0 0 0 2 40.0 0

[dgack]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

LOL I'm sorry but this is getting retarded. Call me in 3 years when this guy is out of football completely.

Entirely possible. Call me next year when LLoyd is making D-grade hip-hop videos. I don't understand what's so retarded about signing a guy like Williams for pocket change. Hell, sign him to the practice squad.

Obviously if the dude still thinks he's worth 1st round pick money, it doesn't make sense. But whatever, I was honestly asking a legit question more than anything else and a bunch of people apparently took offense to that.

I'm sure you guys don't necessarily intend it, but there is a really thick air of arrogance that comes down hard on people who post things that are considered "retarded" by whoever sets the conversation bar that week.

Hey, it's your site, do as you like. But speaking frankly and personally, some of the reactions to threads like this make me not want to participate as much, because it's just arbitrary and wrong.

But again, it's your house, you set the rules.

[Rajmahal33]

I disagree strongly that the Tall WR is not as important now with the emergence of the smaller WRs...I think its the direct opposite. The tall WR's are harder to come by and the teams that do have good tall ones are using the hell out them. Reggie Wayne, Randy Moss, TO and Crayton, and Plaxico Burress are on 4 of the top 5 teams in the NFL right now and they are all pretty dominant. In addition if u look at the receiving leaders in the NFL right now 14 out of 15 are taller than 6 feet and most are well over that mark
1. Randy Moss - 6'4"
2. Chad Johnson - 6'1" with excellent leaping ability
3. Braylon Edwards - 6'3"
4. Reggie Wayne - 6'2"
5. Larry Fitzgerald - 6'3"
6. Antonio Gates - 6'4"
7. TJ Housh - 6'1"
8. Wes Welker - 5'9"
9. Jerricho Cotchery - 6'
10. Kevin Curtis - 6'
11. Torry Holt - 6'
12. Plaxico burress - 6'5"
13. Joey Galloway - 6'
14. Terrell Owens - 6'3"
15. Jason Witten - 6'5"


Im not saying that Williams should be signed or would make any difference even if he was, but it would be nice to have a big body to throw to in goal line situations and since JC throws "such a nice long ball".

[MonkFan4Life]

6 feet 5 inches ! Average corner is what about 6 foot ? You throw the ball higher to that receiver he has a better chance of coming down with it. Now of course you have to be able to catch, I'm sure the man hasn't forgotten that. I say bring him in and see what happens. If he doesn't pan out so what. Hell we gave TOD PINKSTON a shot why not this guy? They could try letting Lloyd get on the field for more than 3 plays a game. As far as Williams goes, bring him in and see what happens.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by dgack

Entirely possible. Call me next year when LLoyd is making D-grade hio-hop videos. I don't understand what's so retarded about signing a guy like Williams for pocket change. Hell, sign him to the practice squad.

Obviously if the dude still thinks he's worth 1st round pick money, it doesn't make sense. But whatever, I was honestly asking a legit question more than anything else and a bunch of people apparently took offense to that.

I'm sure you guys don't necessarily intend it, but there is a really thick air of arrogance that comes down hard on people who post things that are considered "retarded" by whoever sets the conversation bar that week.

Hey, it's your site, do as you like. But speaking frankly and personally, some of the reactions to threads like this make me not want to participate as much, because it's just arbitrary and wrong.

But again, it's your house, you set the rules.

Dgack, you're free to call my ideas retarded if you think they are. I think signing Williams is a horrible idea, though. That's the only reason I've jumped on you in this thread. His biggest weakness is route-running, and this is an offense based on timing, which means route-running is priority one for WRs. Unless you want Saunders and Gibbs to totally revamp their scheme, which I can't imagine would possibly be a good idea in the midst of a 4-3 season, Williams just doesn't fit with us.

Williams is also miserable on special teams. I don't like the idea of cutting one of our depth WRs. McCardell has shown he can be valuable this year, picking up a few key first downs because of his ability to run routes and find open holes in the defense. Thrash is still a special teams stalwart. It just doesn't make any sense to me, that's all.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by dgack

Entirely possible. Call me next year when LLoyd is making D-grade hip-hop videos. I don't understand what's so retarded about signing a guy like Williams for pocket change. Hell, sign him to the practice squad.

Obviously if the dude still thinks he's worth 1st round pick money, it doesn't make sense. But whatever, I was honestly asking a legit question more than anything else and a bunch of people apparently took offense to that.

I'm sure you guys don't necessarily intend it, but there is a really thick air of arrogance that comes down hard on people who post things that are considered "retarded" by whoever sets the conversation bar that week.

Hey, it's your site, do as you like. But speaking frankly and personally, some of the reactions to threads like this make me not want to participate as much, because it's just arbitrary and wrong.

But again, it's your house, you set the rules.

I don't care what happens with Lloyd frankly and I don't see where Williams would represent any sort of an improvement over Lloyd either.

Nobody is coming down on you personally, try to understand that some of us just get sick of these threads looking to pick up everyone else's garbage anytime someone gets released.

I mean c'mon, Mike Williams isn't even a good player.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Dgack, you're free to call my ideas retarded if you think they are.

Not my style. But thanks for the offer.

I appreciate the more in-depth analysis in this post, though, it is a lot easier to consider a counter-argument when the person making it isn't insulting you.

[Rajmahal33]

Originally Posted by dgack

Another good argument. It's true that the small, fast receiver has really taken the NFL by storm and tall, strong receivers don't succeed at hauling down jump balls anymore.

I'm sorry but this just isn't true. In addition to the receiving stats i just posted here are some numbers for receiving TD's. The top 5 in this category is as follows:

1. Randy Moss - 6'4"...11 TD's
2. Braylon Edwards - 6'3"...9 TD's
3. TJ Housh - 6'1"...9 TD's
4. Plaxico burress - 6'5"...8 TD's
5. Dallas Clark - 6'3"...6 TD's
and if u look further down the list in the top 40 only Wes Welker, Steve Smith and Laveraneus Coles (5'11") are under 6 feet.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I don't care what happens with Lloyd frankly and I don't see where Williams would represent any sort of an improvement over Lloyd either.

Nobody is coming down on you personally, try to understand that some of us just get sick of these threads looking to pick up everyone else's garbage anytime someone gets released.

I mean c'mon, Mike Williams isn't even a good player.

Like I said, it's your site and you can do as you like. But I think you guys tend to get frustrated with " the same threads over and over" as if everyone should know what are the "acceptable" topics of conversation.

Maybe nobody is coming down personally, but all the "this is retarded" stuff directly implies that those of us asking, "hey, can he really be any worse than our worst current WR" are "retarded" (and I won't even get into how that can be offensive to anybody who is the parent of a disabled child, because I'm not, but know people who are).

Anyway, I just find it interesting that you have no problem coming down on a thread like this when most of the discussion has been trying to do some analysis, but it's totally okay to let a 400+ post thread go that devolved into a discussion that had nothing to do with football for the most part (the Belichick and his class thread)

I was under the impression that this site was the forum for the "Intelligent Redskin fan". Whether or not you agree with someone's opinion, I would think that it would be welcomed and respectfully discussed as long as those opinions are presented with well-reasoned arguments.

"This is retarded" doesn't really meet the definition of "well-reasoned" in my mind, but YMMV.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by Rajmahal33

I'm sorry but this just isn't true. In addition to the receiving stats i just posted here are some numbers for receiving TD's. The top 5 in this category is as follows:

1. Randy Moss - 6'4"...11 TD's
2. Braylon Edwards - 6'3"...9 TD's
3. TJ Housh - 6'1"...9 TD's
4. Plaxico burress - 6'5"...8 TD's
5. Dallas Clark - 6'3"...6 TD's
and if u look further down the list in the top 40 only Wes Welker, Steve Smith and Laveraneus Coles (5'11") are under 6 feet.

I know, I was being sarcastic.