Release Josh Morgan or else....

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

I believe the Shanahans try to spread it out a lot, so 9 targets is a lot, considering other guys are maybe getting 2 or 3 looks. But I think if you drop passes that are hitting your hands as FD has done several times, you don't get featured as much. Now I get the point about some that are easily defended, but he has had the worst case of drops these past two games, and he needs to get past that if he wants to be any sort of go to guy.

No doubt, Davis has disappointed so far. Poop.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by The Goat

No doubt, Davis has disappointed so far. Poop.

Do you think its an issue of speed?

[Monksdown]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Do you think its an issue of speed?

I think we would probably find that most of the pass plays include him as a blocker as they are play action.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Do you think its an issue of speed?

IMO it is not an issue of speed. Freddy has not shown good hands. He also has not been running the best of routes IMO.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Lotus

IMO it is not an issue of speed. Freddy has not shown good hands. He also has not been running the best of routes IMO.

Agreed - appears as if his head isnt even in the game.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Do you think its an issue of speed?

So far as he's not going to outrun DBs and quicker LBs yeah you could say so but it's hard to assess when he's dropping too many opportunities. I don't think we've seen the offense create mismatches for Davis to exploit though much either.

He's a big body though and can break tackles and rumble for YAC, so speed is a lesser concern with Davis. That's kind of the dynamic of downfield targets as I see it. A burner creates opportunity by beating defenders while your big targets create opportunies by hauling in jump balls and rumbling for YAC, even with contact. I wish we had a WR who stood out in either capacity. Garcon is the closest to that, but still just a poor man's Boldin at best, which is why he's never touched Boldin's numbers despite having arguably the best QB of all time throwing to him.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by The Goat

So far as he's not going to outrun DBs and quicker LBs yeah you could say so but it's hard to assess when he's dropping too many opportunities. I don't think we've seen the offense create mismatches for Davis to exploit though much either.

He's a big body though and can break tackles and rumble for YAC, so speed is a lesser concern with Davis. That's kind of the dynamic of downfield targets as I see it. A burner creates opportunity by beating defenders while your big targets create opportunies by hauling in jump balls and rumbling for YAC, even with contact. I wish we had a WR who stood out in either capacity. Garcon is the closest to that, but still just a poor man's Boldin at best, which is why he's never touched Boldin's numbers despite having arguably the best QB of all time throwing to him.

Is there a player fast enough for you Goat?

[DynamiteRave]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Is there a player fast enough for you Goat?

How is speed even a real issue at all?

Ya know, if we had won, nobody would be questioning anyone's athleticism.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Is there a player fast enough for you Goat?

Again, speed isn't real important when you're talking about the big, dominant pass-catchers who rip the pigskin out of the air and rumble on for yardage. Think Megatron, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitz for WRs, though all have wheels too and especially the younger guys. Graham, Gronk and Hernandez for TEs.

And you have guys with extraordinary ability to create space and make plays. Rice is the paradigm. Roddy White and Julio Jones are there. A younger Steve Smith (Carolina) definitely fits that mold. Tana was in his younger days too, and while he still is our best WR at getting open he doesn't get the YAC anymore.

What's frustrating to me about our WR corp is we don't have that guy who is dominant on either end of the spectrum so to speak. No real burner, and no big target. It's a disappointment in the regime really. The great organizations find these guys, and quite honestly do so pretty often. Think the Patriots, Steelers, Saints and now the Falcons (2012 NFC Champ?). I know there's still a lot of hype and hope for Garcon but he's a poor man's Boldin at best. Garcon never broke 1000 with arguably the greatest QB in history throwing to him. Boldin went for 1300+ yards in his first or second season.

You can go down the list of guys but the bottom line is we still don't have that big time down-field threat, and at least a few have been available to draft or sign, but we seem to prioritize roster positions at less than ideal times.

On the other hand, the Giants have won two SBs now with very good WRs who don't quite fit the bill as really dominant WRs. But...NY does have a sick (dominant) defensive front seven, along with an elite QB (hate admitting that btw).

I just look at the current regime and don't see winners (present and future tenses), and I think it's more evident now than ever. I agree with Tripp that the defense is likely to be closer to the bottom of the league again this year. Basically, the regime gave us RGIII. He's amazing. The best we've had in decades. But you need more than a superstar QB to be a real contender (otherwise P Manning would have multiple rings, right?), and outside QB I really, honestly, don't think Mike and co have made this team any better than the one they inherited. Younger? Sure. Better? Hmmm c'mon now. The defense is...different...but certainly not better and statistically it's worse. The offense would be pitiful w/o RGIII.

In a sentence, I think RGIII's talent and time are probably wasted under Shanahan and co. Already looking ahead to the next regime and hoping it builds a real contender. Danny boy matured as an owner over the last few years. Here's to continued maturity and the next great GM/coach on the horizon.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by The Goat

Again, speed isn't real important when you're talking about the big, dominant pass-catchers who rip the pigskin out of the air and rumble on for yardage. Think Megatron, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitz for WRs, though all have wheels too and especially the younger guys. Graham, Gronk and Hernandez for TEs.

And you have guys with extraordinary ability to create space and make plays. Rice is the paradigm. Roddy White and Julio Jones are there. A younger Steve Smith (Carolina) definitely fits that mold. Tana was in his younger days too, and while he still is our best WR at getting open he doesn't get the YAC anymore.

What's frustrating to me about our WR corp is we don't have that guy who is dominant on either end of the spectrum so to speak. No real burner, and no big target. It's a disappointment in the regime really. The great organizations find these guys, and quite honestly do so pretty often. Think the Patriots, Steelers, Saints and now the Falcons (2012 NFC Champ?). I know there's still a lot of hype and hope for Garcon but he's a poor man's Boldin at best. Garcon never broke 1000 with arguably the greatest QB in history throwing to him. Boldin went for 1300+ yards in his first or second season.

You can go down the list of guys but the bottom line is we still don't have that big time down-field threat, and at least a few have been available to draft or sign, but we seem to prioritize roster positions at less than ideal times.

On the other hand, the Giants have won two SBs now with very good WRs who don't quite fit the bill as really dominant WRs. But...NY does have a sick (dominant) defensive front seven, along with an elite QB (hate admitting that btw).

I just look at the current regime and don't see winners (present and future tenses), and I think it's more evident now than ever. I agree with Tripp that the defense is likely to be closer to the bottom of the league again this year. Basically, the regime gave us RGIII. He's amazing. The best we've had in decades. But you need more than a superstar QB to be a real contender (otherwise P Manning would have multiple rings, right?), and outside QB I really, honestly, don't think Mike and co have made this team any better than the one they inherited. Younger? Sure. Better? Hmmm c'mon now. The defense is...different...but certainly not better and statistically it's worse. The offense would be pitiful w/o RGIII.

In a sentence, I think RGIII's talent and time are probably wasted under Shanahan and co. Already looking ahead to the next regime and hoping it builds a real contender. Danny boy matured as an owner over the last few years. Here's to continued maturity and the next great GM/coach on the horizon.

So we are going to ignore the fact that Garcon had Wayne, Harrison, and Clark to share passes with, and to say that Garcon is a poor man's Boldin is a terrible comparison because they play nothing alike, Garcon does not have Boldin's strength, and as much as you do not want to aknowledge it, Garcon is a burner and has speed that Boldin does not.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

So we are going to ignore the fact that Garcon had Wayne, Harrison, and Clark to share passes with, and to say that Garcon is a poor man's Boldin is a terrible comparison because they play nothing alike, Garcon does not have Boldin's strength, and as much as you do not want to aknowledge it, Garcon is a burner and has speed that Boldin does not.

A younger Boldin was quicker, faster than Garcon. But I still wouldn't call either a pure burner at any point in their respective careers. Boldin is just a much more talented WR.

I think they're a pretty good physical comparison size wise, but you hit the nail on the head Garcon doesn't have the strength.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by The Goat

Again, speed isn't real important when you're talking about the big, dominant pass-catchers who rip the pigskin out of the air and rumble on for yardage. Think Megatron, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitz for WRs, though all have wheels too and especially the younger guys. Graham, Gronk and Hernandez for TEs.

And you have guys with extraordinary ability to create space and make plays. Rice is the paradigm. Roddy White and Julio Jones are there. A younger Steve Smith (Carolina) definitely fits that mold. Tana was in his younger days too, and while he still is our best WR at getting open he doesn't get the YAC anymore.

What's frustrating to me about our WR corp is we don't have that guy who is dominant on either end of the spectrum so to speak. No real burner, and no big target. It's a disappointment in the regime really. The great organizations find these guys, and quite honestly do so pretty often. Think the Patriots, Steelers, Saints and now the Falcons (2012 NFC Champ?). I know there's still a lot of hype and hope for Garcon but he's a poor man's Boldin at best. Garcon never broke 1000 with arguably the greatest QB in history throwing to him. Boldin went for 1300+ yards in his first or second season.

You can go down the list of guys but the bottom line is we still don't have that big time down-field threat, and at least a few have been available to draft or sign, but we seem to prioritize roster positions at less than ideal times.

On the other hand, the Giants have won two SBs now with very good WRs who don't quite fit the bill as really dominant WRs. But...NY does have a sick (dominant) defensive front seven, along with an elite QB (hate admitting that btw).

I just look at the current regime and don't see winners (present and future tenses), and I think it's more evident now than ever. I agree with Tripp that the defense is likely to be closer to the bottom of the league again this year. Basically, the regime gave us RGIII. He's amazing. The best we've had in decades. But you need more than a superstar QB to be a real contender (otherwise P Manning would have multiple rings, right?), and outside QB I really, honestly, don't think Mike and co have made this team any better than the one they inherited. Younger? Sure. Better? Hmmm c'mon now. The defense is...different...but certainly not better and statistically it's worse. The offense would be pitiful w/o RGIII.

In a sentence, I think RGIII's talent and time are probably wasted under Shanahan and co. Already looking ahead to the next regime and hoping it builds a real contender. Danny boy matured as an owner over the last few years. Here's to continued maturity and the next great GM/coach on the horizon.

Goat are you serious? Are you writing off the team already? Lotta things change throughout the season. To criticize the building of the team is premature. I agree there has been wrong, bad decisions by the Shanny regime, but no organization is perfect, havent seen one yet. The "plugging" of holes in the certain areas of the team should last longer than the past.

In regards to the WRs, you gotta give guys more than 2 games together before you draw conclusions. Garcon, Morgan and Hankerson in 2 games have already adequately produced and if your not seeing the development of Robinson your quite frankly havent been paying attention. Moss is the savy veteran of the crew. I think that crew of receivers are a nice combo of size, catching ability and speed. You know its really hard to find Jerry Rice and Randy Moss, let alone Steve Smiths, Hakeem Nicks, and Roddy Whites.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Goat are you serious? Are you writing off the team already? Lotta things change throughout the season. To criticize the building of the team is premature. I agree there has been wrong, bad decisions by the Shanny regime, but no organization is perfect, havent seen one yet. The "plugging" of holes in the certain areas of the team should last longer than the past.

In regards to the WRs, you gotta give guys more than 2 games together before you draw conclusions. Garcon, Morgan and Hankerson in 2 games have already adequately produced and if your not seeing the development of Robinson your quite frankly havent been paying attention. Moss is the savy veteran of the crew. I think that crew of receivers are a nice combo of size, catching ability and speed. You know its really hard to find Jerry Rice and Randy Moss, let alone Steve Smiths, Hakeem Nicks, and Roddy Whites.

I too think our WR corp is nice

Admittedly I was very skeptical of Shanny and co from the beginning. Always thought Mike was the "luckiest" coach to ever win multiple rings. He had the best defense/defensive coordinator in Wade Phillips, a HOF QB he inherited. Mike undoubtedly gets credit for Terrel Davis and the run game. But overall, I don't see Mike ever being a contender again short of inheriting another SB caliber team. Maybe I'm wrong and that'd be nice.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Is there a player fast enough for you Goat?

Usain Bolt.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Is there a player fast enough for you Goat?

Gaffney and Plaxico.