What Michael Vick won't be

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

...They took a man who committed bad crimes and projected him in an even worse light. Vick was a criminal, but he is also a little bit of a victim when you look at how so many people have tried to go out of their way to keep him from doing what he loves.

...

Sorry, but there are thousands, or 10s of thousands (or more) of people who committed a crime, and now are "kept from doing what they love". Many rehabilitated criminals live without the right to vote. None, or very few, will ever hold a job requiring a security clearance of any type - even if their very livelihood had depended on it. I definitely believe in second chances, and the fact that a man may screw up, but still deserves to be allowed to move forward. But your saying that Vick is being victimized, in ANY degree, is ridiculous. This man was bankrupt, jailed, and still has had the opportunities to come back and be on the top of his profession. As JR said, he is in no way, shape or form a victim.

any way. last words rarely are.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

Some people are going to hate on Vick no matter what he does.

So I guess it wasn't your last word. I have said it before and will say it again, I got no hate for Vick.

I do hate that Vick's actions are being rationalized away by those who wish to portray him as a victim or who chose to believe that he was not responsible for his own criminal behavior and I am sick to death of the sports media portraying his first steps toward rehabiliation as "mission accomplished" when, in any other profession, he would have far, far to go.

From my prior posting on Vick in the "Vick wants a Dog thread" which seems somewhat appropos:

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

First, please don't generalize about my beliefs - I try hard not to do so about others. True, I think what he did was indescribably evil. I don't think, however, that "there's no hope for him". "Fellas like me" firmly believe in redemption of the spirit. I just don't think redemption is something purchased easily - Vick has seemingly made a good start towards redemption but that is long road and Vick has barely walked the first mile.

As to all those guys who exposed him to such an environment? You know what - some will get the fixing they deserve, but, as always in life, some who deserve to be punished will skate on. It happens in all levels of society, not just in the circle Vick grew up in. All we can do as a society, is hold Vick responsible for his actions. He committed his actions, not the "culture" he was raised in. Just b/c lots of different parts of society needs "fixing", doesn't mean individuals who commit despicable acts should have those actions whitewashed.

Do you think Vick's cohorts in crime are being treated better than he? I sincerely doubt it. For sooo many jobs, if he weren't "Michael Vick, NFL QB", Vick would simply be DQ'd. Period, end of story. His co-conspirators don't have the physical talents that make them everyone's media darling ("Oh, look, Vick is throwing touchdowns, let's help him get 'rehabilitated'!"). No, it is more likely they will actually have to really work at regaining society's trust.

As I said, sure there is hope for Vick's redemption. From your posts, however, you appear to think redemption is something to be given based on jail time and a few good acts done while in the spotlight of fame and fortune. I, on the other hand, believe it to be something purchased much more dearly.

[SolidSnake84]

I didnt defend Vick no matter what he did. But i am willing to let the past be the past, and move on. For some reason people are having a hard time doing that. Back when i was on Extreme Skins a few years ago, i villified Vick, but i never fell into the "lifetime ban" crowd that formed right before Vick's release. I wish we could all just move on from Vick's prison sentence, and all the people who were against his comeback...It's over with, we need to live in the now.

[MTK]

No hate for Vick here either. No sympathy for him either.

In fact I really don't care either way, not sure why we're devoting so much time to the guy.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

At least come out and say what you've got against Vick. I know your an animal owner. Is that the reason why? I looked back at your posts and it just seemed to me like you went out of your way to bash the man. Is it something other than that???

Define "bash". To me, I have accurately stated the nature of his transgressions. Tell me where I have "bashed" him?

[Hog1]

Vick getting a dog makes as much sense as a Child molester getting a child?

[JoeRedskin]

^^ Did I say that??? Naw... I may have thought it, but I am sure I never said it. (Joking SS84, just joking).

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I didnt defend Vick no matter what he did. But i am willing to let the past be the past, and move on. For some reason people are having a hard time doing that. Back when i was on Extreme Skins a few years ago, i villified Vick, but i never fell into the "lifetime ban" crowd that formed right before Vick's release. I wish we could all just move on from Vick's prison sentence, and all the people who were against his comeback...It's over with, we need to live in the now.

Your opinion is just that......of which there are obviously many on the issue. NO more correct than any other.....opinion on the issue. MV generates much emotion for many and trying to convert everybody to...your opinion is.....a waste.
Move on Grasshopper, move on.........

And that's my LAST words on the issue.....maybe

[44ever]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Vick getting a dog makes as much sense as a Child molester getting a child?

The same argument could be made for guys who race dogs for a living. But it's not.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Your opinion is just that......of which there are obviously many on the issue. NO more correct than any other.....opinion on the issue. MV generates much emotion for many and trying to convert everybody to...your opinion is.....a waste.
Move on Grasshopper, move on.........

And that's my LAST words on the issue.....maybe

JoeRedskin endorses this statement - and its disclaimer.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by 44ever

The same argument could be made for guys who race dogs for a living. But it's not.

Not sure of your meaning?
Dog racers:
a) Torture and kill dogs?
b) Molest children?

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Not sure of your meaning?
Dog racers:
a) Torture and kill dogs?
b) Molest children?

Invoking your prior disclaimer awfully fast there Hog. Ever thought of entering the legal field?

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Invoking your prior disclaimer awfully fast there Hog. Ever thought of entering the legal field?

NO Comment...

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Hog1

NO Comment...

Shoot, let's just get you that law degree. You already know all the right answers.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Not sure of your meaning?
Dog racers:
a) Torture and kill dogs?
b) Molest children?

Basically the outcome of the dog after about 2 years of racing will be destroyed. Some are juiced to the point of insanity. They have Greyhound adoption agencies but how many people do you know who own Greyhounds? A few maybe. There are thousands destroyed every year.

Yet Greyhound owners are obviously allowed to own dogs. Oh yeah, most owners don't personally destroy the dog. They pay someone else to do that for them. But some do.

Have you been to the Naples Fort Myers Greyhound track? Not a dog over 4 years old racing there.