Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice

[biffle]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Thanks, but I prefer this:

futurama Bite my shiny metal ass - YouTube

[NC_Skins]

You can go back to ES any day now. Thanks in advance.

[skinsfaninok]

I actually like john Clayton

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Why? He's not a analyst nor a draft expert so why does he need to know these things to report?

If he does these things, I'll cut him some slack then. That said, even Morocco Brown and Scott Campbell had to get instruction/guidance from Mike in regards to the characteristics they looked at regarding their system. If a professional scout team couldn't do it, not sure I buy that Clayton can either. Not unless they've broken it down to him.

Perhaps you should study what real reporters actually do with their days.

Of course he needs to try to know such things if he is to be a good reporter.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Perhaps you should study what real reporters actually do with their days.

Of course he needs to try to know such things if he is to be a good reporter.

I gathered he didn't just sit around in some office scanning forums/twitter/fax/email/phone for news alerts. If he's that knowledgeable, why don't they use him as a analyst?


SO why is I've heard that NFL scouts say that guys like Mel Kiper and Todd McShay don't know shit?

"Most people at my level feel he is a joke," a veteran NFL scout told us via e-mail. "People in the league respect Kiper. He is not a true scout but he does work at it. A lot of his info he gets from connections in the league, and over the years he has made quite a few. When he was younger he used to burn some bridges. He doesn't do that any more."

So what about McShay?

"McShay does not have any good connections," the source opined. "Higher-ups in the league think he is an arrogant asshole. A know-it-all. And he really knows nothing. Whatever he says about a quarterback, take it to the bank, it will be the opposite. Remember, last August he stated that Jevan Snead was better thanColt McCoy and would get drafted in the top five. He has yet to publicly retract that statement.

[SmootSmack]

Clayton's opinion isn't random. But whatever, this isn't a thread about Clayton

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Don't get me wrong, I think that RGIII is dynamite and I would love to get him. But I think these factors may make him fall to #6:

1) Footwork/mechanics concerns
2) Durability concerns moving to the next level
3) There are real studs at other positions and teams may prefer to have the best player at position X rather than the second best QB
4) The trade-up price for QB hungry teams below us will be very steep, perhaps too steep to leapfrog us

Really hard to argue with these. It seems highly improbable at this exact moment but RGIII could fall to six. Stranger things have happened on many drafts.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Clayton's opinion isn't random. But whatever, this isn't a thread about Clayton

I'd rather talk about Clayton at this point than quarterbacks.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

You can go back to ES any day now. Thanks in advance.

Ouch!?

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by biffle

My point was simply you can't assign some percentage chance of success on any player because of what other, completely different, players did. Both history and common sense should tell us that. I'm not sure how that is "irrelevant".

I wonder why actuaries use life tables.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

I gathered he didn't just sit around in some office scanning forums/twitter/fax/email/phone for news alerts. If he's that knowledgeable, why don't they use him as a analyst?


SO why is I've heard that NFL scouts say that guys like Mel Kiper and Todd McShay don't know shit?

Nobody said that folks like Clayton know everything. If people like him did, they'd be GM's, not TV reporters.

But, on the other hand, they still put out a lot of effort, so just dismissing them is as disrespectful as it is foolish.

And economics dictate that there can only be so many analysts and so many reporters.

[REDSKINS4ever]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

Not waisting more then 1 draft pick on said player would put the big smile on my face if we could land one of these, but it's doubtfull. So trading back, continueing with last years fabulous draft by trading back to aquire more picks in order to not only get valuable pieces but to help build up our back up pool.

Stock piling draft picks while not a bad idea, still won't cure the Redskins most pressing need. Quarterback is the most pressing need. I disagree that it's doubtful that the Redskins can get Luck or RG3. I will admit, Luck may be out of reach. But Rg3 isn't. For one Mike Shanahan and Rams coach Jeff Fisher go back to their days with the 49ers. So, they know each other well. If Mike Shanahan is offering the Redskins 6th pick in the draft in addition to a Redskins 1st round selection in 2013, then they can agree to a trade in order for Washington to move up to 2nd in the draft. The Rams can more than likely still come away with Justin Blackmon or Matt Khali at the 6th pick. And in exchange, the Redskins can come away with RG3 with the second pick.

Back in 2004, the Giants offered San Diego a boat load of draft selections to land Eli Manning. After leading the Giants to two super Bowls, I'd say that decision to trade up was a good one for the G-men.

I think Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan know that they have quite a problem at quarterback. Both of them are great football men. I'm sure they know what important moves they must make in order to better the Redskins.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Nobody said that folks like Clayton know everything. If people like him did, they'd be GM's, not TV reporters.

But, on the other hand, they still put out a lot of effort, so just dismissing them is as disrespectful as it is foolish.

I said it more or less being a smart ass since kid has been riding my balls this whole thread. Had I known the Clayton E-knight crew was going to rush in to save the day, I would have kept my mouth shut...lol

[That Guy]

RGIII, If I knew manning was 100% it'd be different, but I've never heard so much FUD in my life.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by biffle

As for the 30gut thing earlier, I made an attempt to explain to him how he was completely misusing a statistic,

You made a horrible failed attempt to make a strawman argument.

Its not misuse to quote a well known stat.

However its kinda bad form to make false assumptions and claims then turn around and claim that your false assumptions represent my point.

I don't understand how you can get this:

Originally Posted by biffle

The real world doesn't work that way. Griffin has virtually nothing in common with Ryan Leaf or Jamarcus Russell, whether you're looking at backgrounds, education, skillset, production, character or temperments. Not to mention, Griffin will be stepping into a situation that will likely bear little resemblence to what the other 2 walked into.

So, to suggest the former's chances of success decline by some percentage because of the failures of the latter two is really wrongheaded, at absolute best.

From this:

Originally Posted by 30gut

With Griffin the gamble is the same as with any rookie QB where historically the success rate is right around 50/50 its even lower when using the 'franchise' QB or 'elite' QB label as the measure of success.

Without thinking that people will view your posts as somewhat disingenuous.