Is it finally time to rebuild??

[ethat001]

Sure, we've been saying this for years, and Shanahan decided not to rebuild last year. I still wonder whether that was the right choice. BUT - now our starting #1 WR is 32 with few options behind him, our best LB and key to the defense is Fletcher (36) and here's an abbreviated list of one of the oldest rosters on the planet (ages for 2011):

P.Daniels - will be 38
McNabb - will be 35
Fletcher - will be 36
Casay Rabach - will be 34
Artis Hicks - will be 32
Santana Moss - will be 32
Andre Carter - will be 32
Kemo - will be 32
D. Dockery - will be 31
Clinton Portis - will be 30
Roydell Williams - will be 30

Cooley - will be 29
J.Brown - will be 29

I won't mention Galloway is all but already retired.

The question is - can we fix this team in 2-3 years? If not, we should rebuild, dump older players and accept a couple of bad seasons as they get experience. The Capitals rebuilt and now has one of the best young rosters in the league for years to come. The Eagles and Tampa Bay also come to mind with young talent.

The second question is: since coaches are rewarded for success - is there no incentive for Shanahan to rebuild because he knows that he could get fired if he does not deliver success within 2 years?

[takethecake]

The redskins ARE rebuilding. They cut a lot of older players last offseason, and I'm sure they'll cut more at the end of this season. I think everyone knows that they need to get younger, but I'm not sure it's as easy as it sounds. They will go with their best options regardless of age, and probably aim to add as much young talent as they can. We'll probably also see some different players getting snaps for the rest of this season.

The capitals didn't really have a profound "rebuilding." They just drafted well with their first and second round picks, and after four or five years of having high picks yielding quality players, they started to turn the franchise around.

2002: 1st round: Alexander Semin
2003: 1st round: Eric Fehr
2004: 1st round: Alexander Ovechkin, Jeff Schultz, and Mike Green
2006: 1st round: Nick Backstrom, Semyon Varlamov; 2nd round: Michael Neuvirth
2007: 1st round: Karl Alzner
2008: 1st round: John Carlson

It was only in the 2007-2008 season that things really started to come together for them. But your parallel with the caps shows what the redskins DO need: smart drafting in the early rounds over the next 3 to 4 seasons.

I question whether "dump older players and accept a couple of bad seasons as they get experience" is really a valid strategy for success. What is needed is young talent, not just young players. I'm all for giving younger players a shot, but you can't just throw a bunch of young guys with questionable ability together and expect that 2 years of experience will mold them into winners (especially not with the skins :P).

To answer your second question, it's less about coaches being rewarded for success and more about them being punished for a lack of production. While I think Shanahan's resume gives him a little more sticking power if next season goes downhill as well, I'm sure he understands that Snyder expects wins. He will utilize the players that give him the best chance to win, but I'm sure he's open to an influx of youth as long as it doesn't cripple the team's chances - this I am fine with. I guess overall I think that people cling on to the idea of "rebuilding" or "blowing up the team" as some sort of miraculous savior for bad teams, and that this team just needs strong leadership and good drafting over the next few years to reverse their current trend.

[Beemnseven]

Who says we aren't rebuilding? 2011 could be a bad season whether we "accept" it or not. Hell, we've already gone through two bad 4-5 win years already.

The problem will be if next year is even worse; say, a 3-13 type season -- will Snyder accept getting worse than this before it gets better and still keep this front office intact?

[rypper11]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Who says we aren't rebuilding? 2011 could be a bad season whether we "accept" it or not. Hell, we've already gone through two bad 4-5 win years already.

The problem will be if next year is even worse; say, a 3-13 type season -- will Snyder accept getting worse than this before it gets better and still keep this front office intact?

I think we are and 2011 will be a 7 or 8 win season. My thought is still 6 or 7 this season. If 2011 is a 2 or 3 win season then I'd expect a new HC in 2012 for the first 18 game season.

I think Carter, Rocky, Haynesworth, Dockery and Roydell Williams will be the only big names/older players released in the offseason. Daniels and Fletcher are still playing well enough to keep around for their leadership over the younger guys brought in.

[MTK]

I guess someone needs to slap a big sign on the front of Redskins Park that says we are rebuilding to make everyone happy.

There was only so much rebuilding that could be done last year with limited picks and a limited FA pool. That said they still turned over 1/3 of the roster and the changes next year should only continue.

[SolidSnake84]

I knew that this year we were seeing Rebuilding whether they wanted to admit it or not.

[jdlea]

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post768237

[skinsguy]

You can't rebuild all within one season. It takes time. It's a process. There will be more roster changes by season's end. No need to worry about that. Shanahan had to go through at least one full season with this team to have a better understanding of what he had to work with here. You dump who you can and keep who gives you the best team on the field in the current situation.

No matter what, you always try your best to win now, even when it's apparent that you're not that great of a team. MS is finding out who wants to be here next season and who doesn't. I personally believe it's going to take at least three years to truly see a transformation. I just hope Snyder, and the fans, are patient enough to endure the basement until then.

[Longtimefan]

The concept of rebuild has been well adopted in the minds of many fans, but will it be adopted at the box office. If this team continues it's losing ways, attendance will suffer greatly, forcing management to somehow find a happy medium. Yesterdays announced attendance 66,000+ could become the norm.

Mike Wise - Mike Shanahan and Washington Redskins must face need to rebuild

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

I guess someone needs to slap a big sign on the front of Redskins Park that says we are rebuilding to make everyone happy.

There was only so much rebuilding that could be done last year with limited picks and a limited FA pool. That said they still turned over 1/3 of the roster and the changes next year should only continue.

I totally agree with you. The team could only make so many moves in the off season. It's not like there was a ton of talented OL in FA waiting to be picked up and you only have so many picks in the draft.

[SmootSmack]

Graham Gano essentially represents the conundrum Redskins fans face. Ask every 5 Redskins fans, and probably 3 want him gone. But if you want to rebuild, you probably have to have patience and put up with Gano missing some kicks, Sundberg botching a snap, Banks fumbling, Riley committing a penalty, Moore missing a tackle...that said, there's a fine (very fine) line between being patient and holding on for too long

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

The concept of rebuild has been well adopted in the minds of many fans, but will it be adopted at the box office. If this team continues it's losing ways, attendance will suffer greatly, forcing management to somehow find a happy medium. Yesterdays announced attendance 66,000+ could become the norm.

Mike Wise - Mike Shanahan and Washington Redskins must face need to rebuild

I'm sure the weather was a factor in that

[Daseal]

We have NOT tried to rebuild yet. A lot of people equate losing to rebuilding. Just because we suck doesn’t mean we’re rebuilding. We’re still giving up draft picks for 34 year old players. That is not rebuilding – that’s saying we want to win now. If you want to pick up some veteran FA’s. Fine. If you are trading for them, sacrificing young future players for the team, you’re still trying to win.
I’m ready to break the core of this team apart. See what we can get some value for, turn to the younger players. Start building a new attitude in DC. Not saying trade away everyone. But keep age in mind. Anyone over the age of 27/28 should be expendable, for the right price.

[SolidSnake84]

I've kind of wondered about attendance before. If we keep having all these losing seasons, i guess at some point we really could be like Detroit, and have the stands at less than capacity.

How bad do things have to get around here for us to experience a "blackout" from TV, like other poor franchises have??

[44 70 chip]

Originally Posted by takethecake

The capitals didn't really have a profound "rebuilding." They just drafted well with their first and second round picks, and after four or five years of having high picks yielding quality players, they started to turn the franchise around.

IMO they had the definitive hockey rebuilding year, they sent Gonchar and a host of other veteran players off for anything they could get in draft picks, IMO it doesn't get a lot more "rebuilding" then what the Caps did when they recognized how badly the team needed it. I admit it's pretty subjective

IMO the Skins should have been in rebuilding mode every year for the last decade. When you piss away 19 total draft picks on 5 players who lasted any time and were productive players via trade/draft trade ups then you "reap what you sow"

I am refering to:
2nd and Bailey for Portis (instead of just Bailey)
3rd for Brunell
1st, 3rd, & 4th total picks for Campbell
3rd & 4th total picks cost of Cooley
3rd & 4th for TJ Duckett
3rd & 4th for Brandon Lloyd
2nd & 6th + another drafts 2nd cost for Rocky McIntosh
2nd & 6th for Taylor
3rd or 4th rounder for Brown pending McNabb
2nd & 3rd or 4th rounder for McNabb

That's a total of 19 picks sent for (arguably) 5 long term starting Redskins of any caliber and two of those (McNabb and Brown obviously) are assuming McNabb and Brown stay for years to come and that is VERY much in question, as Brown is a unrestricted free agent in 3 games and McNabb... well who knows...

The Skins team building philosophy (if you can credit it with enough forethought to call it a philosophy) has been to sacrifice the long term (young potentially talented draftees who might play for 6 or 10 years) for proven players who may have a few years left on the clock, but usually spend at least one of those years adjusting to new systems and then often the next year adjusting to a new HC or coordinator and their systems.

McNabb's first year here is a great example... So was Brunell's