When Camp Started I Thought...But Now...

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

And to protect the QB when needed.

Comparing a WR's job to a RB doesn't really make much sense. Moss doesn't have to pick up blitzing LB's for Brady.

For the record; when Campbell scrambled for the touchdown, Dockery completely whiffed on Richard Seymour and Mason picked him up to spring Campbell. I know it's just one play, but I think it shows that Mason is at least and average blocker. I think we're all a bit spoiled by the fact that Portis is arguably the best blocking halfback in the league.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Angry

Danny is upset because he doesn't play special teams. That's how ST coaches are.

Jesus...how is he pissed off? He's never played in a game. You don't think that might say something about his abilities? Even a little?

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Jesus...how is he pissed off? He's never played in a game. You don't think that might say something about his abilities? Even a little?

Damn dude chill, I said that half jokingly. I didn't really mean that he was pissed. I do believe however that he is going to snub the guy because he doesn't play teams. Yes, there is fact in Danny's statements, but the "why" was not explained. He made it seem that it is because of pass protection or whatever, but he did not actually come out and say it. Danny could just be biased against the guy for not playing teams. Even I don't know that for sure. Sure he hasn't played a snap in the regular season, but he has taken snaps in preseason. He has film out there that suggests that he can be good for something.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I don't see him as a change of pace either. He's almost a shorter version of Betts. He's not a speed guy at all, just a hit the hole, between the tackles kinda guy. He's certainly not a home run hitter.

Mason sort of reminds me of Joe Morris that used to play for the Giants.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I don't see him as a change of pace either. He's almost a shorter version of Betts. He's not a speed guy at all, just a hit the hole, between the tackles kinda guy. He's certainly not a home run hitter.

First off I agree with you. When Portis first came to the Skins he was the home run hitter the team needed. Speed type of runner. Though in Gibbs style of running the team bulked Portis up for power running. Now Portis is more of a between the tackles power runner. He has lost weight this season but I think he has lost his speed a little. Just a little.

Betts never was a home run hitter. He was already bulkier for the between the tackles type of running. Betts is a little slower then Portis though. when the coach's (in the past) tried to lean on him (the few times they did) he would fumble sometime during the game. Leaving coach's (I believe) to not trust him so he was relegated to 2nd place.

I know I'm not saying anything you all already don't know but simply pointing out that Mason is not a Speed back or scat back type of runner. He is another Portis or Betts. A between the tackles type of runner. Although he is younger and healthier. Someone whome can be groomed for the future after Portis.

Alridge and Dorsey are the speedier/scat back type of runners we need to change things up. Which is why I (if I was the coach) would cut both Betts and Rock, go with the younger power back in Mason to be groomed and fill in to spell Portis once in a while, and keep either Alridge or Dorsey as the speed back. Put the other on the practice squad if we still have a space. We obviously don't need another WR on the practice squad if we keep Moss, ARE, Thomas, Kelly, and Mitchell.

[Monkeydad]

I was HOPING Brennan could impress so we could get rid of Collins and keep both Brennan and Daniel, because they both have (had) great potential and it was tough to pick one to cut.

It's still a tough choice for me, I can see positive reasons to keep either of them. I wanted Collins cut because he won't be able to run an offense with deep passes, so our 5 talented WRs will be underused in a short passing game. Also, he has maybe one or two more years left and the younger guys have long-term potential, even if only as a solid backup. I wanted to keep both so build them up for the future...but Collins has somehow done just enough (although not impressively) to keep the #2 spot and Brennan has failed to take advantage of the opportunity. Collins was impressive in our OLD offensive system based on the Saunder playbook because he's been in it for a decade. Now he's new to the system and I don't believe can excel in a deep passing game, but he has not been supplanted as the backup.

If Campbell goes down, I do not see Collins repeating the last time he filled in.

Colt may still make it, but if he had beat out Collins and allowed both himself and Daniel to stay on the roster, I think the team would be better off long-term. Collins is about finished playing and is mediocre, just serviceable when he does play.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

When Camp Started I Thought...
Your turn...

Although some of these might still happen:
When Camp Started I Thought...

We were finally gonna see more of Fred Davis and these mythical double TE passing sets.

I thought that Trent Shelton would win the 5/6 WR spot.

I thought the offense would have more multiple formations with more 4/5 WR sets.

I thuoght that Landry was gonna look ready to emerge

I thought that Kareem Moore was gonna make a name for himself

I thought that Randy Thomas was done (i'm glad i was wrong)

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Southpaw

For the record; when Campbell scrambled for the touchdown, Dockery completely whiffed on Richard Seymour and Mason picked him up to spring Campbell. I know it's just one play, but I think it shows that Mason is at least and average blocker. I think we're all a bit spoiled by the fact that Portis is arguably the best blocking halfback in the league.

You are right about that play and Mason deserves props for that. But there were two other times the other night when he whiffed his blocks.

[mooby]

When camp started I thought our offensive line still hadn't improved enough to give Campbell the time he needs.

But now I think our offensive line has definitely improved and held their own in the preseason, although we haven't seen everything opposing defenses will throw at us this year.

When camp started I thought Marko Mitchell would be lucky to make the roster with guys like Hackett and the others having more experience than him.

But now I think he's pretty much locked down that fifth spot and could even see significant pt if he keeps catching everything thrown his way.

When camp started I wasn't sure how well Orakpo would transition to playing outside linebacker.

But now I think even though he still has a long ways to go at OLB he has shown plenty improvement since he started learning the position.

When camp started I thought our offense didn't look as up to speed as the defense and definitely still had a ways to go.

But now I think our offense looks improved since that point and our defense actually needs more week.

When camp started I was hoping our backup o-liners would step up and prove they deserve a spot on the roster.

But now I'm not so sure about that, I haven't really seen anyone stand out that much.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Angry

Randy Moss sucks at run blocking, who gives a crap? Note: I am not saying that Mason is the same caliber as Randy Moss. A running backs primary job is to carry the rock and get yards. Where Mason has been really impressive to me is around the goal line. We have struggled with running it in short yardage situations on the goal line in recent years, but he seems to have a knack for it. I think that he would be worth keeping for that ability alone. He can be taught to pick up the blitz eventually. Then again we did cut McCants because he was only good at catching TD passes.

I understand that you're not trying to compare the players in quality or total value, but I think this argument would be better invoked on a guy like Adrian Peterson. AD is a major limiting factor on the quality of his team's passing game, but despite that, OH MY GOD LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN HE GETS THE BALL.

It's because Mason isn't going to start for us (unless you think of him as a future starter) that he has to do the small things well to have value. If he's being kept as the 3rd RB, he's probably only going to find his way into the game situationally, in which case, he's a liability if he can't do simple blitz pickups.

So while it's true that a running back's primary job is to carry the football, the only time Mason is a primary running back is during the preseason. You know, before the cuts.

Now, if you want to keep him on the roster and invest in him for future value and try to improve his pass blocking over time, that's a completely different perspective. Players like Mason take a lot of coach hours to turn into that kind of player, but I think the guy has the potential to be an elite runner. He's no older now than Willie Parker was in 2005, so that's probably his upside.

Of course, Willie Parker is one of the weakest players who is still a Steelers regular, so you have to keep everything in perspective. If the fruits of your labor is to develop Mason into the starting RB in 2011, and by 2013, he's a liability that we need to spend a draft pick on to replace (either partially or completely) is it really worth it?

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I understand that you're not trying to compare the players in quality or total value, but I think this argument would be better invoked on a guy like Adrian Peterson. AD is a major limiting factor on the quality of his team's passing game, but despite that, OH MY GOD LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN HE GETS THE BALL.

It's because Mason isn't going to start for us (unless you think of him as a future starter) that he has to do the small things well to have value. If he's being kept as the 3rd RB, he's probably only going to find his way into the game situationally, in which case, he's a liability if he can't do simple blitz pickups.

So while it's true that a running back's primary job is to carry the football, the only time Mason is a primary running back is during the preseason. You know, before the cuts.

Now, if you want to keep him on the roster and invest in him for future value and try to improve his pass blocking over time, that's a completely different perspective. Players like Mason take a lot of coach hours to turn into that kind of player, but I think the guy has the potential to be an elite runner. He's no older now than Willie Parker was in 2005, so that's probably his upside.

Of course, Willie Parker is one of the weakest players who is still a Steelers regular, so you have to keep everything in perspective. If the fruits of your labor is to develop Mason into the starting RB in 2011, and by 2013, he's a liability that we need to spend a draft pick on to replace (either partially or completely) is it really worth it?

..............................................Yes.

Well GTripp, here's the deal. When Mason wakes up in the moring he pisses excellense, he's just a big harry winning machine. You know....if you aint first your last.

[Beemnseven]

When camp started I thought we'd all be seeing Mike Williams stunning the rest of the NFL. But now, not so much.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Although some of these might still happen:
When Camp Started I Thought...

We were finally gonna see more of Fred Davis and these mythical double TE passing sets.

I thought that Trent Shelton would win the 5/6 WR spot.

I thought the offense would have more multiple formations with more 4/5 WR sets.

I thuoght that Landry was gonna look ready to emerge

I thought that Kareem Moore was gonna make a name for himself

I thought that Randy Thomas was done (i'm glad i was wrong)

I'm with you on these two points -- I'd love to see Campbell in the shotgun with 5 wides airing it out here and there.

Kareem Moore has been trying to take some heads off this preseason, I'd say he's safely in the backup role. Never heard of Trent Shelton.

[70Chip]

When camp started I was a Devin Thomas hater...

Now, I think he could rise up and be a playmaker.

In fact, I'm very encouraged by Thomas, Kelly, and Mitchell and the passing game from a theoretical standpoint. I'm seeing things I was calling for late last year, like the bunch formation and Cooley running deeper routes. Pre-season, of course, but even so.

I am willing to eat crowe on Vinny's receivers if they can produce. It will taste like twinkies if we are winning.

[SmootSmack]

On that first drive against the Steelers we saw a lot of Davis and Cooley together, with Cooley moving all over the place. But I think ultimately the ball was given to CP in those situations.