The official 2008 draft discussion thread

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I'm in love with all three of these picks.

First off, it shows that our coaches and GM aren't smoking crack and drinking the Anthony Mix Kool Aid. They recognize that we need serious weapons. They're right.

Santana Moss, as good as he is, doesn't score enough TDs. Same with ARE. Down in the red zone these guys disappear. Nevermind the fact that Moss is getting older and that without these WRs, James Thrash or Anthony Mix would be our #3 WR (horrible).

Fred Davis gives us a second TE weapon, another big body for making yards after the catch.

We got serious value out of our picks. You guys are crazy.

Alright, if I give you Davis and Kelly, can you come up with any sort of defense for the Thomas pick with every other receiver (except Avery) available?

Would we not have been better off with Jordy Nelson?

[itvnetop]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Alright, if I give you Davis and Kelly, can you come up with any sort of defense for the Thomas pick with every other receiver (except Avery) available?

Would we not have been better off with Jordy Nelson?

GTripp, wouldn't you have more of a lowdown on Thomas since you're in MI?

What about him don't you like? All I know is that he's a bit raw, but he's got the most upside out of the rest of the group. Didn't he lead the Big 10 in receiving?

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Alright, if I give you Davis and Kelly, can you come up with any sort of defense for the Thomas pick with every other receiver (except Avery) available?

Would we not have been better off with Jordy Nelson?

I think Jordy was a huge reach at # 36. Time will tell on Thomas. The FO must not have had the DL or OL available rated better than the slots we picked. I think the theme is "value". Was Thomas a value at # 34, based on what most teams and analysts had, I believe so. Same thing with Davis and Kelly. Having Davis and Cooley could create some serious mismatch problems in a 3 WR set in the run game unless the opponent has very good coverage LBs.

Again, I'll reserve judgement until tomorrow. We still have serious needs at DL, CB, S depth, LB depth, and T depth & Guard. Hopefully we'll find value to fill those needs

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Alright, if I give you Davis and Kelly, can you come up with any sort of defense for the Thomas pick with every other receiver (except Avery) available?

Would we not have been better off with Jordy Nelson?

GTripp, I understand you have a blog, and I understand that you know statistics, which apparently makes you really smart, but I gotta call you on this. You don't know what you're talking about on Thomas.

The guy is strong. He sheds tacklers when running with the ball, which is very important in a WCO when running slants and such. Seeing him on tape, he CONSISTENTLY makes plays week in and week out. He cuts with fluidity and doesn't lose speed coming in and out of breaks, which is something that makes or break a WR at the next level when they face much tighter coverage.

I'm not a measurables guy. But if you like that kind of thing, he's a 4.4 WR who stands 6 feet 2.

And the "short body of work" argument is just retarded. You can't put up 1260 yards over the course of 13 games, in a RUN ORIENTED OFFENSE, if you're not talented.

He was the best WR available in this draft.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

The more I think about the WR picks I start to think about Moss' hamstring injuries in NY that lead to him coming here for Coles. He had a bruised heel this year and that awful game that he pulled himself out of. The WR picks don't bode well for his long-term future here. ARE will be fine as he's more versatile is a solid slot or # 3 and can focus more on his return game.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

The more I think about the WR picks I start to think about Moss' hamstring injuries in NY that lead to him coming here for Coles. He had a bruised heel this year and that awful game that he pulled himself out of. The WR picks don't bode well for his long-term future here. ARE will be fine as he's more versatile is a solid slot or # 3 and can focus more on his return game.

I don't think I'd go that far, Moss is a long-term 'Skin. His contract doesn't make it feasible to cut him until 2010, and even then it would only be wise if he totally sucked by then.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I don't think I'd go that far, Moss is a long-term 'Skin. His contract doesn't make it feasible to cut him until 2010, and even then it would only be wise if he totally sucked by then.

If 2010 is the year, it makes sense the FO is being really forward thinking. Young WRs often don't hit stride for a couple of years, by then Moss is 29-30 and slowing down. Or his injuries are more of a concern & the two WRs are insurance so we don't go into a game with 52 yr. old receivers on the field (McCardell).

The other thing is that all three picks are big targets and will help Campbell as he gets his accuracy together in the new offense. At first take I was definitely against WR first, I wanted to shore up the DL & CB, but depending on tomorrow this may be a very good draft.

[bigm29]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

The more I think about the WR picks I start to think about Moss' hamstring injuries in NY that lead to him coming here for Coles. He had a bruised heel this year and that awful game that he pulled himself out of. The WR picks don't bode well for his long-term future here. ARE will be fine as he's more versatile is a solid slot or # 3 and can focus more on his return game.

Moss is going to have pressure on him this year, or at least in the next couple years, for his job, so he's going to have to perform well.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

GTripp, I understand you have a blog, and I understand that you know statistics, which apparently makes you really smart, but I gotta call you on this. You don't know what you're talking about on Thomas.

The guy is strong. He sheds tacklers when running with the ball, which is very important in a WCO when running slants and such. Seeing him on tape, he CONSISTENTLY makes plays week in and week out. He cuts with fluidity and doesn't lose speed coming in and out of breaks, which is something that makes or break a WR at the next level when they face much tighter coverage.

I'm not a measurables guy. But if you like that kind of thing, he's a 4.4 WR who stands 6 feet 2.

And the "short body of work" argument is just retarded. You can't put up 1260 yards over the course of 13 games, in a RUN ORIENTED OFFENSE, if you're not talented.

He was the best WR available in this draft.

So which card are you playing here? The draft is a crapshoot, I don't know what I'm talking about, or speed and strength is all that matters for a receiver?

If it's the latter, I'm calling you on this. If the former, then I'm willing to play the wait and see game. However, the methodology still sucks.

At best, it becomes a "we did okay, but we should have done better" kind of thing. That's not what we should be working towards with the first selection of the draft.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

So which card are you playing here? The draft is a crapshoot, I don't know what I'm talking about, or speed and strength is all that matters for a receiver?

If it's the latter, I'm calling you on this. If the former, then I'm willing to play the wait and see game. However, the methodology still sucks.

At best, it becomes a "we did okay, but we should have done better" kind of thing. That's not what we should be working towards with the first selection of the draft.

With regard to Thomas is it true that he drops passes? I know I heard the guys on ESPN mention this as a concern. They also said he's great w/ the ball in his hands but that sounds a lot like that guy I've been watching the last few years... what's his name... MOSS!!!

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by The Goat

With regard to Thomas is it true that he drops passes? I know I heard the guys on ESPN mention this as a concern. They also said he's great w/ the ball in his hands but that sounds a lot like that guy I've been watching the last few years... what's his name... MOSS!!!

We don't really know if Thomas drops passes. We don't know if he runs good routes. We don't know if he's an NFL talent. Nothing he did in college suggests that he's good at anything football.

He's fast and strong. That much we know about him. He can jump, and move laterally very fast.

Sold? I'm not.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

We don't really know if Thomas drops passes. We don't know if he runs good routes. We don't know if he's an NFL talent. Nothing he did in college suggests that he's good at anything football.

He's fast and strong. That much we know about him. He can jump, and move laterally very fast.

Sold? I'm not.

Not sold in the least. We could have taken Rachal here for our oline talent and still done the "crazy" thing w/ the best TE in the draft and a great big WR. I would sleep much better tonight if that was the reality.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

We don't really know if Thomas drops passes. We don't know if he runs good routes. We don't know if he's an NFL talent. Nothing he did in college suggests that he's good at anything football.

He's fast and strong. That much we know about him. He can jump, and move laterally very fast.

Sold? I'm not.

I'm totally baffled by this post. I think you spend too much time with your metrics and DVOAs and your DPARs that you overanalyze way too often and then you find yourself trying to convince us that we're better off with Tim Rattay, yet Devin Thomas has only shown the ability to run and jump

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm totally baffled by this post. I think you spend too much time with your metrics and DVOAs and your DPARs that you overanalyze way too often and then you find yourself trying to convince us that we're better off with Tim Rattay, yet Devin Thomas has only shown the ability to run and jump

Forget about me for a second. Is anything I said untrue?

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm totally baffled by this post. I think you spend too much time with your metrics and DVOAs and your DPARs that you overanalyze way too often and then you find yourself trying to convince us that we're better off with Tim Rattay, yet Devin Thomas has only shown the ability to run and jump

Smoot....I really really like Thomas but with your first pick you need to go with more of a sure thing. Don't you think?