Jay Gruden you are our only hope

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Well then sit his ass down. If he comes out like this against SF then put in McCoy or KC. Guys were running wide open yesterday and he just didn't pull the trigger.

Next week RGII will be like a human pinata, Aaron Lynch on one side and Aldon Smith on the other. Lynch is a 5th round rookie playing like an all-pro (steal of the draft).

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Well then sit his ass down. If he comes out like this against SF then put in McCoy or KC. Guys were running wide open yesterday and he just didn't pull the trigger.

cant sit him, we have to coach him and play him to see results. makes zero sense to play colt. cant play, wont learn

[Coff]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Cousins and McCoy have played way more games, thrown more passes and have been sacked less. Yes, we need some upgrades, but a lot of this is on Griffin. He's over 30 starts in and still can't recognize a blitz, can't stop holding on the ball and still back peddles when he's pressured.

This is what's frustrating. This blind belief that no matter who is on the bench, he's better than the QB on the field. So we cherry pick statistics to find something to justify our belief. But this is just ridiculous. Okay, RGIII gets sacked more than Colt and Kirk. But he throws more touchdowns, throws fewer interceptions, completes more first downs, completes a higher percentage of his passes, averages more yards per reception, and has a much higher QB rating. But he gets sacked more, so yeah, let's make that the only statistic that matters.

Let's compare McCoy to Griffin. McCoy has thrown nearly 25% fewer passes but has managed to throw more interceptions. McCoy averages a TD every 34 passes, RGIII averages one every 25. McCoy has completed less than 60% of his passes, RGIII has completed 64% of his. McCoy averages 6.5 yards per attempt, RGIII 7.5. It's not a comparison; RGIII is a superior QB; he's a superior pocket passer. It's enough to just recognize that RGIII is not a great QB and that we will probably have to move on, but to get delusional about it and add to the cacophony of nonsense that surrounds this organization just simply isn't helpful.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

The problem is that you assume we think RG3 is the next Joe Montana. Thats not it at all. What we are calling the problem is developing the QB. It doesnt matter who you draft at this point. We wont develop them. You want to draft a few QB's a year and watch them falter for 20 or 30 more years. I want to fix the development problem so we dont have 20 or 30 more years of this. Whether that is with or without RG3, I dont really care. I just want a functional team.



RG3 could have been developed properly and still can. But until we decide that actually developing a QB is more than signing DJ, it wont matter.



And will people stop talking about Colt McCoy's performance against Dallas as anything spectacular. We scored 19 against the Titans and 20 points against Dallas, a worse defense than we scored 26 on the very next week with RG3. Colt loses the minny game as well. The defense showed up against both the titans and cowboys. Surprise.... Defense matters.



RG3 had a bad game against the Bucs, but if we cut everyone that had a bad game against the bucs, then the only members of the Redskins organization that is left is Alfred and the cheerleaders.

Alfred and the cheerleaders sounds excellent to me! Lol
I completely hear what you are saying. I know that you think he isnt being developed.
What I am saying is that regardless of his athleticism I dont think he has it in him to ever be anything even remotely resembling Joe Montana. What I am saying is that no matter who we bring in to develop him he is what he is. A supreme athlete that will never be a great or even really good passing qb. Maybe one day he will shock me whether it is as a Redskin or not. Who knows? My only point about Colt was that he seemed to have a feel for the offense once he got rolling. I dont think he is the long term answer by any means. If he had Roberts arm strength well than....
I disagree about our inability to develop a qb. It just has to be the rite one. Ramsey, JC - it isnt like they left the Skins and excelled. Who else are we talking about? Brunell - dudes best years were behind him. Jon Beck? Lol. With Robert we finally had a top pick and used it on a qb. He simply isnt what we hoped imo. Huge blunder but one we had to take a shot on. It isnt working. Its that simple. Sucks, but it is what it is. Im wanting to eat crow man. Im starving for a big ole crow sandwich!

[Evilgrin]

Put Colt in or Cousins in, then we will back again trying to develop Griffin after the season. Have to ride it out, there isn't alot of talent on this team anyways.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

RG3 pocket awareness is terrible, he gets happy feet and starts to feel pressure that isnt there as the game goes on. So even when he has time, he feels he doesnt. Has a hard time pre snap and has a hard time seeing the field. Jay needs to move the pocket more for him, but he doesnt for some reason.

Yup. RGIII has no clock in his head, sees the field poorly,and has not had the game slow down for him. The "no clock in the head" is the worst part.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Yup. RGIII has no clock in his head, sees the field poorly,and has not had the game slow down for him. The "no clock in the head" is the worst part.

Absolutely the worst part because this is not a developmental problem. This is an innate inability problem. Does anyone in their rite mind believe he is being told to hold the ball for 3-5 seconds than check down without progressing thru his reads?!? That's ridiculous.

[Evilgrin]

Lots of Qbs hold the ball to long, but they run out of the pocket. Our poor line play is compounded by him not moving well. He may have also lost some of his athletic ability from repeated surgeries, its probably a combination of everything. Him and Bradford are going to cause alot of teams to pass drafting QBs high with big surgeries in college.

However teams that want to win games with average Qbs, need alot better line play. We have 1 good offensive linemen right now(whos hurt), and only 1 above average defensive lineman. Our talent is just so subpar its ridiculous. We still aren't doing a good job drafting and signing free agents. We've had some really good coaches here the last 10 plus years. They can't make it work with whatever is going on behind the scenes.

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Yup. RGIII has no clock in his head, sees the field poorly,and has not had the game slow down for him. The "no clock in the head" is the worst part.

...stares down receivers, abandons his fundamentals under pressure, shows poor judgement by not avoiding negative plays, etc., etc., etc. And this is coming from someone who has supported him.

He is playing very poorly and he is not offsetting some of his poor play by making big plays.

I don't know what to think of his progress at this point. I've gone from distressed about it to depressed about it.

[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Alfred and the cheerleaders sounds excellent to me! Lol
I completely hear what you are saying. I know that you think he isnt being developed.
What I am saying is that regardless of his athleticism I dont think he has it in him to ever be anything even remotely resembling Joe Montana. What I am saying is that no matter who we bring in to develop him he is what he is. A supreme athlete that will never be a great or even really good passing qb. Maybe one day he will shock me whether it is as a Redskin or not. Who knows? My only point about Colt was that he seemed to have a feel for the offense once he got rolling. I dont think he is the long term answer by any means. If he had Roberts arm strength well than....
I disagree about our inability to develop a qb. It just has to be the rite one. Ramsey, JC - it isnt like they left the Skins and excelled. Who else are we talking about? Brunell - dudes best years were behind him. Jon Beck? Lol. With Robert we finally had a top pick and used it on a qb. He simply isnt what we hoped imo. Huge blunder but one we had to take a shot on. It isnt working. Its that simple. Sucks, but it is what it is. Im wanting to eat crow man. Im starving for a big ole crow sandwich!

With our O line, the right one is either Fran Tarkenton or Doug Flutie. Once you ruin a QB, dont expect him to come back. Once Ramsey and Campbell left our team, It was pretty obvious that they werent going to all of a sudden get it. Although Im not convinced JC would ever be that good. Ramsey I thought could have been a good pocket QB. Not Brady good by any means. Spurrier ruined him by getting him killed, he was never the same, and they rarely are after that.

The only thing this organization has done since RG3 got here is lower the floor, not attempt to reach the ceiling. Until we care about our players reaching their ceiling, nothing else will matter much. I also dont think developing the QB is the only problem. I think picking the right people and developing every position properly is the problem. For as much as Raheem Morris gets talked down on, it seems that 2 of the 4 young ones that I see actually developing are under his charge (Amerson and Breeland with Alfred and Keenan Robinson as the others. Possibly Kerrigan, but he seems to be pulling an Orakpo this year. Be dominant in some games and disappear completely in others).

When Tyler Polumbus is your starting RT for 3 years. The something is wrong. When Tyler Polumbus finally gets sat down and we actually do worse at that position... We are drafting and developing wrong across the board, not just the QB position.

[Redskins247]

In my opinion, Gruden now has seen all of these weaknesses from RGIII, and it's up to him to try and help him out. Call passing plays with no more than 2 quick options, lot of roll outs, screens...things he does well...and minimizes the decisions he has to make since he obviously struggles with it. If Gruden can't do this, he probably should and will be gone. This is the qb you have right now, try and work with what you have now, your offensive scheme may be great, but it's certainly not so far with RGIII running it. So make changes.

[Avinash_Tyagi]

I don't see the point in bothering with Colt at this point, there's no chance of making the playoffs, so we need to let RG3 continue to grow and develop (Don't even mention cousins, the guy throws way too many interceptions).

What we need to do is find away to build the team to cover RG3's weaknesses.

He has bad pocket presence and can't avoid the sack, fine, build a stronger Offensive line, so he has all the time in the world.

A smart coach realizes the strengths and weaknesses of his team and makes moves to capitalize on the strengths and minimize the negative effects of the weaknesses

[MTK]

Colt or Cousins clearly aren't the answer... Griffin may not be either but he has to keep playing until we know.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Coff

This is what's frustrating. This blind belief that no matter who is on the bench, he's better than the QB on the field. So we cherry pick statistics to find something to justify our belief. But this is just ridiculous. Okay, RGIII gets sacked more than Colt and Kirk. But he throws more touchdowns, throws fewer interceptions, completes more first downs, completes a higher percentage of his passes, averages more yards per reception, and has a much higher QB rating. But he gets sacked more, so yeah, let's make that the only statistic that matters.

Let's compare McCoy to Griffin. McCoy has thrown nearly 25% fewer passes but has managed to throw more interceptions. McCoy averages a TD every 34 passes, RGIII averages one every 25. McCoy has completed less than 60% of his passes, RGIII has completed 64% of his. McCoy averages 6.5 yards per attempt, RGIII 7.5. It's not a comparison; RGIII is a superior QB; he's a superior pocket passer. It's enough to just recognize that RGIII is not a great QB and that we will probably have to move on, but to get delusional about it and add to the cacophony of nonsense that surrounds this organization just simply isn't helpful.

How does Griffin throw more TD's? He started 3 full games and has three TD passes. Also there is no way that his pass per reception is higher than Cousins. And two of his three starts the offense has scored less than 10. All I'm saying is if he comes out like this in the remaining games you have to pull him.

[JoeRedskin]

What was frustrating is it seems as if RGIII is regressing rather than progressing.

I still say he gets the remaining games. I don't care how bad he plays, he starts. The season is a wash and this is now "the RGIII audition tour." I was willing to give him a pass in Minnesota b/c he had been out. No such pass for TBay.

Six games to prove you're the man Griffin - that's a tall order.