The Redskins want to replace Jon Jansen for good

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by That Guy

do you're own research then. the list is pretty long... mccardell didn't do anything till his 4th year, ginn had 400 yards his rookie season (and he started 9 games)... winslow had 2 crappy years , coles only had 370 his first season (another guy that started games). burress had 270 his rookie year (starting 9 games - and 0 TDs). hines ward had 240 yards as a rookie.

search nfl.com if you want more. it's VERY rare for a WR to jump in like boldin or colston.

Here's my list of every receiver drafted in the first two rounds since 2000. Which excludes guys like the Real Steve Smith (3rd round) and Colston among others. It gave me a less than sanguine outlook on Thomas especially. I would actually say the guys who come from nowhere are more the exception than the rule.

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post522944

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

If they signed Runyan, Vinny should be fired immediately. Jansen is hopefully going to be the backup and then he is gone next year. They aren't cutting anyone who would count against the cap this year. (One of the reasons that trading Rogers for a pick(s) made zero sense)

I posted this cause a lot of people in this forum want Jansen gone. Personally I want him to be given one more chance, as for signing Runyan, it would have to be a 1 year contract just to fill the hole if they decide to cut Jansen. Runyan is in his mid 30's and can still play and I just don't see people lining up to signing him unless it's for the vet minimum in which you don't break the bank if you draft someone with the 13th pick. We just spent 180mil on 3 players and our cap space is close, especially after the draft. My theory is you trade down get Mack instead of some questionable T and fill the position the next year.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag359

I know you want to give Heyer a chance but to me he's average at best, so unless he has a monster offseason I don't see him improving to much. Would love it though if was able to. And as far as drafting Loadholt in the 3rd, it's definately a conceiveable option, but look how long it took to develop Dockery. Heck we seem to be going though the same thing Rhinehart right now. Any one of the big 4 could easily make an impact next year and onward.

Well you're right Dirtbag. I would like to see Heyer given a real chance at RT, but if one of the top 4 tackles is still there at 13, I think we should take him, or Mack, but I'm not gonna keep harping on that. If nothing else Heyer adds depth. But I could see if they're gone at 13 and a LB like Maualuga is still there, Vinny catching that sparkle out of the corner of his eye and saying " OOHHH.....what's that?" and picking up a LB that he thinks is a better value instead of reaching for a lesser OT that is not as high on the board. Which you really could'nt blame him as LB is also a position of need. With pro day coming up it's hard to tell right now who is going to be available. Players are still gonna be rising and falling. I think we could get by this year with the LB's we have if we had to, so a HOSS at RT would certainly be the #1 choice if one is available. And I agree that any one of the big 4 would pay dividends for years. But if they are gone, then going LB with the first pick and looking at guys like Fulton, Loadbolt, and Vollmer in the 3rd may be our only choice. Barring any change in draft position of course. If we had a second round pick I think guys like Britton, Beatty, and Meredith could possibly still be around. Of course it all depends on their pro days and some experts have as many as 6 OT's going in the first round.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

I posted this cause a lot of people in this forum want Jansen gone. Personally I want him to be given one more chance, as for signing Runyan, it would have to be a 1 year contract just to fill the hole if they decide to cut Jansen. Runyan is in his mid 30's and can still play and I just don't see people lining up to signing him unless it's for the vet minimum in which you don't break the bank if you draft someone with the 13th pick. We just spent 180mil on 3 players and our cap space is close, especially after the draft. My theory is you trade down get Mack instead of some questionable T and fill the position the next year.

Why would Runyan sign a one year deal? It doesn't make sense for him or his agent. I don't see Runyan as much of an upgrade from Jansen.

There is a reason that we have the 13th pick, only 12 teams were worse than us. We don't need a backup center with our first round pick we need a starting tackle.

I don't know which of the four top tackles are questionable. That Outland Trophy that Andre Smith earned answers all of my questions.

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

Why would Runyan sign a one year deal? It doesn't make sense for him or his agent. I don't see Runyan as much of an upgrade from Jansen.

There is a reason that we have the 13th pick, only 12 teams were worse than us. We don't need a backup center with our first round pick we need a starting tackle.

I don't know which of the four top tackles are questionable. That Outland Trophy that Andre Smith earned answers all of my questions.

Mack can play C or G, Thomas is a ?. Rinehart can play T so can Heyer, no one is going to sign Runyan for more than 2 years. People complain about Jansen being injured all the time, Runyan is always on the field and knows the NFC East opponents well. Smith right now is a ? unless he changes his way till draft day.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Mack can play C or G, Thomas is a ?. Rinehart can play T so can Heyer, no one is going to sign Runyan for more than 2 years. People complain about Jansen being injured all the time, Runyan is always on the field and knows the NFC East opponents well. Smith right now is a ? unless he changes his way till draft day.

So we should bench Randy Thomas for a rookie and bring in John Runyan who is a frickin eagle and is a liability in pass pro just like Jansen. That would mean 3 of the 5 starters on the line are gone and two of the new starters know nothing about our system. Musical chairs on the line is usually a bad idea. Mack won his awards (which don't add up to Rinehart) at center, why would we draft him and make him a guard?

Is the goal to go after David Carr's record for sacks or to try and win the division?

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

So we should bench Randy Thomas for a rookie and bring in John Runyan who is a frickin eagle and is a liability in pass pro just like Jansen. That would mean 3 of the 5 starters on the line are gone and two of the new starters know nothing about our system. Musical chairs on the line is usually a bad idea. Mack won his awards (which don't add up to Rinehart) at center, why would we draft him and make him a guard?

Is the goal to go after David Carr's record for sacks or to try and win the division?

Mack would play G for a season and move to C after Rabach is probably released next year, Mack can start right away and adds insurance if Thomas doesn't comeback from surgery or Rabach gets hurt.

[GMScud]

Absolutely NO to signing John Runyan. He had the dreaded microfracture surgery on his knee and he turns 36 this year. We don't need any more injury prone old guys on the O-line.

[Eknox]

Why do we need a quick fix with an old o-lineman , isn't that the problem we are having now? We don't need grandpa Runyon (even though he's from my hometown Flint,Mi) he's too old..

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by Eknox

Why do we need a quick fix with an old o-lineman , isn't that the problem we are having now? We don't need grandpa Runyon (even though he's from my hometown Flint,Mi) he's too old..

You going to tell him that the next time you see him in town?

[gully]

Vinny is a survivor, if nothing else. If Awol Smith is there at #13, I think he knows better than drafting him and shelling out many millions guaranteed to someone who clearly does not have his head straight, regardless of need. All bets are off though if we trade down to the 20's and he's still there

[schndr_tdd]

The line was doing great the first half,then the aches and pains of old age started to take over.We need quality youth on both sides of the line.Smith would be an excelent pick at 13,just what we need.Unless we can trade and get two quality guys for the price of one.

[70Chip]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

It's not even worth discussing, he said there weren't any at all. Clearly that's wrong. But he still believes what he believes. I guess we should just draft more wide receivers this year

We should but we won't. Instead we will have to make do with assurances that prosperity is right around the corner.

They all know that Thomas is a bust at Redskins Park, they just can't admit it. Kelly has promise, but he's apparently got the knee that won't heal, like Gilbert Arenas or Lavar Arrington. (I think Rocky Mcintosh has it as well) I hope you guys are right, but honestly, do you really think these two will ever amount to anything? If you could trade Thomas and Kelly for 1 second round pick today, wouldn't you do it? I sure would. But who would have them? Who would be almost as stupid as us? (We gave up two second round picks for them) No one, that's who.

To pretend that the defense was the problem last year and to have intelligent people believe it, boggles the mind. "Gee, if the defense had only given up three points we could have beaten Pittsburgh." "If we hadn't given up 16 points to THE DEFENDING WORLD CHAMPS, our 7 points would have been great". Honestly, who held the Giants to 16 in the first 12 weeks of the season?

[Eknox]

Originally Posted by Angry

You going to tell him that the next time you see him in town?

Hey, I'm not that crazy..lol

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

We should but we won't. Instead we will have to make do with assurances that prosperity is right around the corner.

They all know that Thomas is a bust at Redskins Park, they just can't admit it. Kelly has promise, but he's apparently got the knee that won't heal, like Gilbert Arenas or Lavar Arrington. (I think Rocky Mcintosh has it as well) I hope you guys are right, but honestly, do you really think these two will ever amount to anything? If you could trade Thomas and Kelly for 1 second round pick today, wouldn't you do it? I sure would. But who would have them? Who would be almost as stupid as us? (We gave up two second round picks for them) No one, that's who.

To pretend that the defense was the problem last year and to have intelligent people believe it, boggles the mind. "Gee, if the defense had only given up three points we could have beaten Pittsburgh." "If we hadn't given up 16 points to THE DEFENDING WORLD CHAMPS, our 7 points would have been great". Honestly, who held the Giants to 16 in the first 12 weeks of the season?

What's w/ all the negativity surrounding Thomas/Kelly. First of all, have you watched vids of Thomas w/ the ball in his hand? His athleticism is off the chart... I'll say right now that after Moss this kid will be the most explosive player on offense WHEN HE HAS THE BALL IN HIS HANDS. And that's the crux of it. He never learned to run routes and, oh what a surprise, has shown poor hands. HIXON! Who's f'ing job is it to see that the 2 rookies in your group 1) take the off-season serious 2) learn the playbook like the back if their hand 3) learn to run crisp routes. What's the problem... Hixon has too many other responsibilities. RIDICULOUS. Meanwhile Kelly was an excellent route runner in college and had great hands... gets to Redskin Park and looks like he's a basketball player in football pads.

... please don't throw our rookies under the bus when their direct coach has never developed an NFL player in his entire career. The only real mistake the FO has made this year, and it's a huge one IMO, is keeping Hixon on the staff.