Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

By now we know that RGIII is out for several weeks with that dislocated ankle suffered against the Jags. With ligament damage unclear, it's likely between 4-8 weeks before we see him again..

Personally, I wouldn't even give a thought to bringing him back before the bye week, meaning at the high end of the 8 week recovery scale.

In the meantime, what are your expectations of Kirk Cousins as our starter?

Does he build on the Jacksonville game and take the reins enough to make it tough for Gruden to go back to Griffin?

Does he do some good, some bad and leave enough question that they should go back to the 'starter' when RG is healthy?

Does he repeat his 2013 performance when given a chance to start and cement his place as a backup?

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Sit Griffin until he gets his footwork right. To my untrained eyes, looked like he regressed last season due to injury.

Enough with the rushing things and limping and throwing off the back foot. I know these guys play hurt, but Griffin hasn't been the same since the Seattle playoff game 2012-2013 season.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Everything I've seen up until now suggest a 6-8 week recovery on a dislocated ankle.

[QUOTE]In general, it takes about 6 to 8 weeks for the bones to unite. However, every case is unique, as no two fractures are exactly alike.
[/QUOTE]

[url=http://www.stoneclinic.com/ankle-dislocation-rehab-protocol]Ankle Dislocation Rehab Protocol[/url]
[QUOTE]- Patient will be walking with crutches and touchdown (toe-touch) weight bearing on the surgical leg for 4 - 6 weeks post-op.
- Patient will be in a removable boot for 6 weeks or longer, pending x-rays.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][B]Prognosis of a dislocated ankle[/B]
Many patients with a dislocated ankle heal well with appropriate physiotherapy and return to normal function. [B][I]This may take weeks to months to achieve an optimal outcome[/I][/B]. However, due to the severity of injury and widespread connective tissue damage associated with this condition, patients may experience long term effects. The most common long term effect of a dislocated ankle is an increased likelihood of future dislocation or ankle sprain with relatively minor trauma. In cases of recurrent ankle dislocation, surgical intervention may be indicated to increase the ankle's stability. This is usually followed by an extensive rehabilitation program lasting many months.
[/QUOTE]

Then of course the more specific news related to our esteemed QB.

[URL="http://www.rotoworld.com/headlines/nfl/295146/rg3s-dislocated-ankle-could-cost-him-6-8-wks"]RG3's dislocated ankle could cost him 6-8 wks[/URL]
[QUOTE]According to NFL Network's Ian Rapoport, Robert Griffin III's ankle dislocation could still shelve him 6-8 weeks despite the fact that Monday's MRI revealed no fracture.
Initial reports had the timetable at 4-5 weeks. Griffin's absence will simply depend on how quickly he recovers. Whether he regains his starting job upon return is entirely unclear, as well. Fantasy owners can freely drop Griffin in 10- and 12-team leagues. He was playing poorly before the injury, and is now in danger of losing the first-team quarterback job outright to Kirk Cousins.
[/QUOTE]

....maybe I should have started with that last part...nah, to much sense that would make.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

"Does he do some good, some bad and leave enough question that they should go back to the 'starter' when RG is healthy?"

My choice from those listed above. IMO Cousins will give us fine outings like yesterday. He'll also give us three interception nightmares.

The good thing is that the rest of the team may be good enough so that we are still in it.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

I hate to say it, but for the first time since drafting both of them, I think we will have a legitimate QB controversy in 8 weeks or whenever III returns... Assuming Captain Kirk plays well, which I expect him to do...

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083243]Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason[/quote]

I would be ecstatic if KC plays well enough htat we could get:

- a "Carson Palmer to Oakland Deal." (1st and 2nd round picks)
- a "Matt Shaub Deal" for KC. (flip 1st's and two 2nd's)
- a "Kevin Kolb Deal for KC. (2nd and starter)

For now, however, I just want to keep winning.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083243]Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason[/quote]

You would be willing to trade him?

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

I don't expect RGIII back this year, after I saw his face while being carted out, the man was in so much pain he was crying. I'm being realistic, I hope I'm wrong.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Fiversons;1083246]I hate to say it, but for the first time since drafting both of them, I think we will have a legitimate QB controversy in 8 weeks or whenever III returns... Assuming Captain Kirk plays well, which I expect him to do...[/quote]

Cousins has a unique talent for playing well enough to help the team avoid a meltdown, but shaky enough to make it difficult to remove RG3. Still anyone remember the [COLOR="Red"][B]MELTDOWN[/B][/COLOR] following the Redskins using a draft pick on Cousins?
[YT]aNXtyTl1Ono[/YT]
[Sorry I had to settle for Stephen 'Don't give him a reason to hit you' A. Smith and Skip '[URL="http://youtu.be/YWWdk-GVZV8?t=15s"]I swear I'm not a racilist[/URL]' Bayless but I couldn't find original draft footage]

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

I think my crush on Griffin is over.
I thought he was going to take us to at least a couple super bowls but now I dont.
He tries to over achieve and do things his paper tiger body cant do.
I am hoping Cousins takes us to the playoffs and Griffin sits the rest of the year.
Then trade him (Griffin) as soon as we can.
Looking back I was in total favor of giving up the picks we did.
Now I regret it.
I would never do that again.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083243]Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason[/quote]

Question, Do you think Cousins:

1) Has hit his ceiling

2) Can improve in a new system and coaching

3) Lead the team to keep the Skins within playoff contention

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Chico23231;1083253]Question, Do you think Cousins:

1) Has hit his ceiling

2) Can improve in a new system and coaching

3) Lead the team to keep the Skins within playoff contention[/quote]

Cousins has always struck me as a 2TD 1 Int type of QB. However these days he might me seeing the field better.
[YT]pe74qk1QpjY[/YT]

...Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;1083251]Cousins has a unique talent for playing well enough to help the team avoid a meltdown, but shaky enough to make it difficult to remove RG3. Still anyone remember the [COLOR="Red"][B]MELTDOWN[/B][/COLOR] following the Redskins using a draft pick on Cousins?
[YT]aNXtyTl1Ono[/YT]
[Sorry I had to settle for Stephen 'Don't give him a reason to hit you' A. Smith and Skip '[URL="http://youtu.be/YWWdk-GVZV8?t=15s"]I swear I'm not a racilist[/URL]' Bayless but I couldn't find original draft footage][/quote]

I give Captain Kirk a pass last year... The entire team was just god awful, so I can't really put too much blame on Kirk... I am not saying he is going to be a stud, but if he is an above average QB, which I think he is, then I don't see how we can let him go this season and bank on RGIII to be the face of the franchise... To me, that would be insanity...

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Chico23231;1083253]Question, Do you think Cousins:

1) Has hit his ceiling

2) Can improve in a new system and coaching

3) Lead the team to keep the Skins within playoff contention[/quote]

1. Yes
2. No
3. He won't hurt their quest

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Too soon to make that call RGIII vs. KC.
Frankly I am tired of waiting for RGIII, between knee injury and bad play once he returned, this preasons and game 1 were ugly.
I am ready to give KC a chance to see what he has. I am not saying KC will be the next Peyton Manning. I just want to give him a fair chance with a team that gives him a chance to win. Which is what I THINK we might have. We will see.
IF KC keeps winning, RGIII should sit once he is healthy.
This about winning not a Snyeratto move.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Defensewins;1083258]Too soon to make that call RGIII vs. KC.
Frankly I am tired of waiting for RGIII, between knee injury and bad play once he returned, this preasons and game 1 were ugly.
I am ready to give KC a chance to see what he has. I am not saying KC will be the next Peyton Manning. I just want to give him a fair chance with a team that gives him a chance to win. Which is what I THINK we might have. We will see.
IF KC keeps winning, RGIII should sit once he is healthy.
This about winning not a Snyeratto move.[/quote]

I couldn't have said it better myself... I was a huge RGIII believer, and I would still be if he could stay healthy, but he can't... RGIII might have a higher ceiling than Kirk, but how long is it going to take for him to get there? And more importantly, can he stay healthy long enough to get there even if he can? I see the type of success Luck and Wilson are having, and I can't justify simply drinking the Kool Aid blind anymore... I am still a RGIII fan, but I am a bigger fan of the Redskins... If Captain Kirk has success while RGIII is out, which I think he will, we would be damn stupid to trade him and bank of III staying healthy and reaching his ceiling, how ever high that might be...

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Paintrain;1083237]By now we know that RGIII is out for several weeks with that dislocated ankle suffered against the Jags. With ligament damage unclear, it's likely between 4-8 weeks before we see him again..

Personally, I wouldn't even give a thought to bringing him back before the bye week, meaning at the high end of the 8 week recovery scale.

In the meantime, what are your expectations of Kirk Cousins as our starter?

Does he build on the Jacksonville game and take the reins enough to make it tough for Gruden to go back to Griffin?

Does he do some good, some bad and leave enough question that they should go back to the 'starter' when RG is healthy?

Does he repeat his 2013 performance when given a chance to start and cement his place as a backup?[/quote]

I want to see Kirk minimize the turnovers. That's the only knock on him. For a guy who's only started 4 games, he looks awesome at times. If he can show that he can protect the ball better, he should at least prove he can be an effective starter in this league.

And I think it's entirely realistic to think a young player with only 4 starts under his belt can get better at ball security. I think before the end of the season, he'll also demonstrate the ability to call out protections and make changes at the line of scrimmage.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;1083250]I don't expect RGIII back this year, after I saw his face while being carted out, the man was in so much pain he was crying. I'm being realistic, I hope I'm wrong.[/quote]

I caught my **** in my zipper once. It hurt so bad I almost cried but it didn't keep me out of action for long.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

If the defense keeps playing well and we stay reasonably healthy through the rest of the season, Cousins should do okay. Gruden so far has been much better than the Shannys in terms of game planning. Plus, with these receivers we have, all he has to do is keep doing what he did against the Jags: make quick decisions and throw a catchable ball.

Long-term, I'm not so quick to jump off the Griffin train, but Cousins is a guy that's extremely easy to root for. Not only for his come-off-the-bench play, but also his humility and likeable personality.

We'll probably head into the offseason with a fairly good idea on who our "QB of the future" is. I think Griffin will be the guy.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Chico23231;1083253]Question, Do you think Cousins:

1) Has hit his ceiling

2) Can improve in a new system and coaching

3) Lead the team to keep the Skins within playoff contention[/quote]

Hit his ceiling? WTF? The guy has started 4 games. Who the hell hits their ceiling after 4 career starts? He can and most likely will get better.

All he really needs to fix is the interceptions, something Andrew Luck is still struggling with after 33 starts. Romo and Eli are still struggling with that for crying out loud. If he does that, he can be a very productive QB for a very long time. I think his ceiling is in the Dalton, Cutler, Wilson range.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

44, it's a legit question. The ceiling option is valid since no one traded for him this offseason. It's based on perceived opinion from other organization who need qb. I'll put u down for option 2

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

I love what Cousins brings - good pocket presence, reads the field well, uses his eyes to look off defenders, above average accuracy. to me it looks like he has a slightly weak arm and twill occasionally try to put some "ummph" on the ball and lose some accuracy.

but that is what cousins is. at best - decent starter. at worst - good backup.

this is RG3's team. period in my book. If RG3 didnt get injured, i think it is still a blow out.

RG3 can lead you to a Superbowl, cousins can get you to .500.

i just wish we could morph them into 1 player. they are so ying-yang to me. but RG3 is the incredible athlete, RG3 is the game breaker .... freaking injuries can derail a legend in the making thoo .....

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1083261]I caught my **** in my zipper once. It hurt so bad I almost cried but it didn't keep me out of action for long.[/quote]

Sorry for your shortness :)

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=44Deezel;1083260][B]I want to see Kirk minimize the turnovers.[/B] That's the only knock on him. For a guy who's only started 4 games, he looks awesome at times. If he can show that he can protect the ball better, he should at least prove he can be an effective starter in this league.

And I think it's entirely realistic to think a young player with only 4 starts under his belt can get better at ball security. I think before the end of the season, he'll also demonstrate the ability to call out protections and make changes at the line of scrimmage.[/quote]

Good luck with that.

IMO Kirk is like Grossman and Favre: one of his best qualities is his aggression. And one of his worst qualities is his aggression. And because aggression got him where he is, that problematic aggression is not going away.

Also, please note that while Kirk may have only 4 starts, he is in his third year. It's not like he's had no time to develop like Aaron Rodgers did.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083243]Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason[/quote]

I'm not buying this trading KC anymore. Especially if he comes in and plays like he did Sunday.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;1083251]Cousins has a unique talent for playing well enough to help the team avoid a meltdown, but shaky enough to make it difficult to remove RG3. Still anyone remember the [COLOR="Red"][B]MELTDOWN[/B][/COLOR] following the Redskins using a draft pick on Cousins?
[YT]aNXtyTl1Ono[/YT]
[Sorry I had to settle for Stephen 'Don't give him a reason to hit you' A. Smith and Skip '[URL="http://youtu.be/YWWdk-GVZV8?t=15s"]I swear I'm not a racilist[/URL]' Bayless but I couldn't find original draft footage][/quote]

I never disagreed with drafting a second QB there but I did argue against Cousins. I wanted Lindley. And Lindley's stellar career has certainly vindicated my choice. :)

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=44Deezel;1083264]Hit his ceiling? WTF? The guy has started 4 games. [B]Who the hell hits their ceiling after 4 career starts?[/B] He can and most likely will get better.

All he really needs to fix is the interceptions, something Andrew Luck is still struggling with after 33 starts. Romo and Eli are still struggling with that for crying out loud. If he does that, he can be a very productive QB for a very long time. I think his ceiling is in the Dalton, Cutler, Wilson range.[/quote]

John Beck. But Cousins surely hasn't.

BTW, I don't think Andy Dalton was any better than Cousins at the same stage of their careers. Dalton has improved and so will Cousins.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1083275]John Beck. But Cousins surely hasn't.

BTW, I don't think Andy Dalton was any better than Cousins at the same stage of their careers. Dalton has improved and so will Cousins.[/quote]

How much better do you think Cousins can be?

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083243]Cousins will play well enough to get us the trade value for him next offseason we were looking for this offseason[/quote]


So Griffin will be the QB next year ? How much rehabbing has he done since 2009 ?So in the last 5-6 seasons he has had 3 season ending injury's and yes this ankle is a season ender ,why take the chance ?

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083277]How much better do you think Cousins can be?[/quote]

I think he could be in the top 15.

Top 10... Probably not.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Lotus;1083271]Good luck with that.

IMO Kirk is like Grossman and Favre: one of his best qualities is his aggression. And one of his worst qualities is his aggression. And because aggression got him where he is, that problematic aggression is not going away.

Also, please note that while Kirk may have only 4 starts, he is in his third year. It's not like he's had no time to develop like Aaron Rodgers did.[/quote]

Drew Brees plays w/ aggression. He's doing OK.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Can we let Cousins play 3 weeks, and then have this conversation? I would say 6-8 but that timing is coincidental and not actually related to RGIII's injury. Pat Kirwan once said, and for some reason my brain actually holds on to it as a valid thought, is that it takes the NFL about 6 weeks to catch up to tendencies of replacement qb's (assuming that they are decent players to begin with). That makes sense to me, with the varied looks and reads that qbs have to make you probably do need 3 or 4 game tapes, plus 1 or 2 to see how he adjusts to the first set of adjustments.

So I guess what I am saying, is just about the time can start to see whether we should be discussing whether to keep Cousins or not, is the time that Griffin will probably be chomping at the bit to come back. Welcome to the Skins Fan QB Conundrum.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1083277]How much better do you think Cousins can be?[/quote]

I tend to see Cousins as a hair better than Dalton at his best.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Cousins could help them to win the games like he did yesterday.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

You shelve RG3 for the season...Ain't nobody got time for him to rehabilitate and become a better pocket passer. As far as I am concerned the dude is unreliable and unreliable don't get the keys to a franchise.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

My first thought on all this is, Griffin is going to want to come back too soon, especially if Cousins is ballin, and Gruden needs to put his foot down and make Griffin be patient. There is no sense ruining him, franchise QB or not. That will tell us how good of a coach he is.

I honestly have no clue. I'm trying to keep my expectations for Cousins in check, because they were on Sunday, and I was able to thoroughly enjoy every second of his performance. So, if he keeps playing like he did this week, I will enjoy the ride, and if he doesn't, oh well, he's our backup QB 4th Rd draft pick.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

Thanks for sharing Saden, I know most people's stance but I wasn't really positive where you stood from your oh so classy post in the other thread.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

I think it actually doesn't depend too much on how well he plays, but if they win games. Obviously, the better he plays, the more likely he keeps the job, but if the skins come out of this with more wins than losses, we know the QB always gets more credit than he deserves.

Re: Griffin Out For Undetermined Time, It's Cousins Time
 

[quote=Giantone;1083279]So Griffin will be the QB next year ? How much rehabbing has he done since 2009 ?So in the last 5-6 seasons he has had 3 season ending injury's and yes this ankle is a season ender ,why take the chance ?[/quote]

QB durability can change though. I remember there was a time where Aaron Rodgers made the likes of Sam Bradford and RG3 look like Cal Ripken Jr by comparison.

[url=http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=261119009]New England Patriots vs. Green Bay Packers - Box Score - November 19, 2006 - ESPN[/url]
[quote]On November 19, 2006 Rodgers broke his left foot while playing against the New England Patriots in a 0-35 defeat at home, [B]filling in for an injured Brett Favre[/B], and Rodgers missed the remainder of the 2006 season[/quote]
Keep in mind Favre started that game and played long enough to attempt 15 passes.

Before Rodgers became the starter he was actually injured more often than Favre.

From 2008: [url=http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=241976]NFL Forum :: - Aaron Rodgers Injury Prone?[/url]
[quote]
What does everyone say AR is injury prone?

Patriots Game: Freak play when some dude stepped on his foot. Still played the rest of the game with a broken foot. Keep in mind, it was against the NFL's best and most confusing defense for young QBs. It was also his R season.

Practice: M3 (btw, why is he called M3 I don't get it) said that he probably could have played the next week, but didn't want to risk any further injury. It was also on the last play of practice, a little bit of a freak injury.

Thoughts?[/quote]

[quote]Don't forget his screwed up knee in high school, which he screwed up again twice more in college, and eventually required surgery.
[/quote]