Commanders Post at The Warpath  

Home | Forums | Donate | Shop




Go Back   Commanders Post at The Warpath > Off-Topic Discussion > Debating with the enemy

Debating with the enemy Discuss politics, current events, and other hot button issues here.


Ukraine mega thread

Debating with the enemy


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-05-2014, 12:12 PM   #61
CRedskinsRule
Living Legend
 
CRedskinsRule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Age: 57
Posts: 21,283
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
A couple of Ukrainian barracks had their weapons confiscated by the first wave of Russian Airborne, there won't be too much of a fight.
The first wave Russia had complete surprise. If they tried to fight a ground war I doubt very seriously that they would have any kind of air superiority and claiming and holding ground would be difficult. BUT that doesn't mean at this point Ukraine could re-take Crimea without a LOT of bloodshed. I think that is lost to them now, and economically that is a major blow.
CRedskinsRule is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 03-05-2014, 12:32 PM   #62
Alvin Walton
Pro Bowl
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 5,741
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
A couple of Ukrainian barracks had their weapons confiscated by the first wave of Russian Airborne, there won't be too much of a fight.
Yup....it could be like France in WW2.
5,000 Russian tanks come rolling in to western Ukraine and they just lay down for them.
Putin sets up a new new pro Russian govt and then leaves and its like back in the good old soviet days.
And Putin will guarantee somehow that Sevastopol will always be open/pro Russian since its his home port for the black sea fleet which leads to the Med.

Either way its all about limiting westernization from coming to his doorstep.
A pro Russian Ukraine creates that buffer zone for him.
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 12:32 PM   #63
RedskinRat
Franchise Player
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

RedskinRat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 12:34 PM   #64
Chico23231
Warpath Hall of Fame
 
Chico23231's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 34,155
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Crimea is lost. Unfortunately, the EU nor the US saw this coming and when we did we were too slow to act. Still think Russia may not stop at Crimea, Putin is a serious threat to the rest of the Ukraine and quite frankly, Im surprised we are not seeing this and reacting.

Any type of sanctions are slow moving and you cant just flick a switch unless you are throughly prepared. Obama, the US government and our intelligent community werent prepared for Russia to invade.

To the rest of the world, this is an embarrassment for the Europeans and especially the US. I think if we should respond at least with something else besides costs or threats.
__________________
My pronouns: King/Your ruler

He Gets Us
Chico23231 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 12:40 PM   #65
over the mountain
Playmaker
 
over the mountain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: close to the edge
Posts: 4,926
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

I dont think this is an embarrassment to the US. (syria is another story). Engaging in a knee jerk military response would be costly, divisive and ultimately produce the same result as applying sanctions.

i like to think "what would china do"? China would use this act of aggression to further isolate russia and damage their economy for the next 2 decades.

I think this is an embarrassment to Putin. He over-played his hand and is not sure how to untie his hands while saving face.

Does the benefits of Crimea (or however you spell it) outweigh the long term damage this will do to the russian economy?

i think the business sector of russia is pissed. a govt conducted poll of russians found 80% disapproved of the invasion.

this could be a huge benefit to the US if we play our cards right.
__________________
Life is brutal, but beautiful
over the mountain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 12:46 PM   #66
RedskinRat
Franchise Player
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

What OTM said.

Unfortunately, the brains trust at 1600 will turn it into an epic fail.
RedskinRat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 02:14 PM   #67
Alvin Walton
Pro Bowl
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 5,741
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chico23231 View Post
Crimea is lost. Unfortunately, the EU nor the US saw this coming and when we did we were too slow to act. Still think Russia may not stop at Crimea, Putin is a serious threat to the rest of the Ukraine and quite frankly, Im surprised we are not seeing this and reacting.

Any type of sanctions are slow moving and you cant just flick a switch unless you are throughly prepared. Obama, the US government and our intelligent community werent prepared for Russia to invade.

To the rest of the world, this is an embarrassment for the Europeans and especially the US. I think if we should respond at least with something else besides costs or threats.
How it is an embarrassment?
We are not protectors of the world (despite the world police argument and stuff).
We didn't let any bad thing happen.
Russia has been frog marching the Crimea since WWII anyway.
We don't owe the Crimeans anything.
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 02:21 PM   #68
Chico23231
Warpath Hall of Fame
 
Chico23231's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 34,155
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

People forgetting the treaty we signed with Russia and the Ukraine.
__________________
My pronouns: King/Your ruler

He Gets Us
Chico23231 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 03:11 PM   #69
Alvin Walton
Pro Bowl
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 5,741
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chico23231 View Post
People forgetting the treaty we signed with Russia and the Ukraine.
What does that mean?
You want the US military in The Ukraine?
You want a shooting war with Russia?
You're talking about guaranteeing the Ukraines sovereignty?
We would have to counter-invade the Crimea to do that.
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 03:12 PM   #70
Chico23231
Warpath Hall of Fame
 
Chico23231's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 34,155
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvin Walton View Post
What does that mean?
You want the US military in The Ukraine?
You want a shooting war with Russia?
I dont want a shooting war with anybody
__________________
My pronouns: King/Your ruler

He Gets Us
Chico23231 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 03:15 PM   #71
Alvin Walton
Pro Bowl
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 5,741
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chico23231 View Post
I dont want a shooting war with anybody
Well I doubt they will leave if we ask nicely.

And since they are the third largest energy producer in the world any sanctions wont do bupkiss.

So we are left with diplomacy..........
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 03:54 PM   #72
NC_Skins
Gamebreaker
 
NC_Skins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,332
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

I remember many of these same people talking about how we were helping the people in Iraq by "liberating" them and giving them freedom. Guess freedom and liberating isn't so noble in Ukraine.
__________________
"So let me get this straight. We have the event of the year on TV with millions watching around the world... and people want a punt, pass, and kick competition to be the halftime entertainment?? Folks, don't quit your day jobs."- Matty
NC_Skins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 04:01 PM   #73
Alvin Walton
Pro Bowl
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 5,741
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NC_Skins View Post
I remember many of these same people talking about how we were helping the people in Iraq by "liberating" them and giving them freedom. Guess freedom and liberating isn't so noble in Ukraine.
Nice dig.....but your comparison sucks.
Going up against Saddams military vs Putins is vastly different.
Unless you're interested in seeing 10's of thousands of Americans die in the Ukraine. Not to mention the nukes.
I'm pretty sure the aggressor has nukes this time.
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 04:10 PM   #74
Chico23231
Warpath Hall of Fame
 
Chico23231's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 34,155
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NC_Skins View Post
I remember many of these same people talking about how we were helping the people in Iraq by "liberating" them and giving them freedom. Guess freedom and liberating isn't so noble in Ukraine.
Its wierd isnt it? A treaty is a commitment to the international community, not just the nation. We told the Ukranians we, along with the UK and (maybe others, unsure) we will defend them. But yet we let a criminal (ukraine president) escape to Russia, who then invades the Ukraine because a criminal asked them.
__________________
My pronouns: King/Your ruler

He Gets Us
Chico23231 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 04:29 PM   #75
NC_Skins
Gamebreaker
 
NC_Skins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,332
Re: Hey there's about to be a war in Ukraine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvin Walton View Post
Nice dig.....but your comparison sucks.
Going up against Saddams military vs Putins is vastly different.
Unless you're interested in seeing 10's of thousands of Americans die in the Ukraine. Not to mention the nukes.
I'm pretty sure the aggressor has nukes this time.

Oh, so we only bully those with less weaponry? I guess that's how we rate people's scale of "freedom".


Even if we did go to war with Russia, they wouldn't use nukes. I don't think any country will ever use them after seeing the aftermath of our 2 atomic bombs.
__________________
"So let me get this straight. We have the event of the year on TV with millions watching around the world... and people want a punt, pass, and kick competition to be the halftime entertainment?? Folks, don't quit your day jobs."- Matty
NC_Skins is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
We have no official affiliation with the Washington Commanders or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.49242 seconds with 11 queries