Trayvon Martin Case

[JoeRedskin]

Wow. Marvelling at the prosecution's fumbling attempts to discredit certain statements.

Defense has recalled two of the detectives who interviewed Trayvon's father, Tracy Martin. Apparentlly, when Martin heard the tapes with the screaming while being interviewed by the Detectives, Tracy gave some indication that it wasn't Trayvon. The defense is attempting to get Tracy's hearsay statements into evidence (obviously, they aren't going to call Tracy as a defense witness - no way he admits that is what was he meant (see prosecutor's final questions below)).

First detective is not allowed to say what Tracy said and is dismissed.

Second detective (Serino) says, based on Tracy's response when he interviewed Tracy and played the tape, Serino was believed that Tracy didn't think the screaming was Trayvon. Serino's statement:
[Serino] describes Tracy Martin's response: "I let him listen first before I asked anything. I believe my words were, ‘Is that your son’s voice in the background’ or I think I said it a little differently than that," said Serino. He describes Tracy Martin's response: "It was more of a verbal and non-verbal. He looked away and under his breath, as I interpreted it, said, ‘No.’"

I think, but am not sure, the hearsay statement was allowed because the judge considered it a statement of "present sense impression" by Martin that affected Serino's continuing investigation rather than a simple statement such as was probably made to the first detective. I don't think it should have come in, but I can see many a judge ruling in the same fashion.

It's bad evidence for prosecutor. Rather than rolling with it and moving on, prosecutor really highlights Tracy's denial:

"You stated it was under his breath," said de la Rionda.

"Yes, sir," said Serino.

"You interpreted it as he said, 'No,'" said de la Rionda.

"Yes sir," said Serino.

"You didn't flat out hear the word 'no' unequivocally?" asked de la Rionda.

"I heard it and saw the movement of his mouth," said Serino.

"Your opinion is he said, 'No,'" said de la Rionda.

"Yes sir," said Serino.

Serino agrees with de la Rionda that saying, "No," could be seen as denial when being told or hearing that a loved one is dead. De la Rionda has concluded his cross-examination.

Zimmerman’s friends on 911 call: 'It's George' | HLNtv.com

I mean, you (1) reemphasized the bad evidence and (2) let the detective give an even stronger statement that Tracy denied it was Trayvon's voice. Sure, you get the tag at the end "well, he may have been saying blah blah", but the jury has now heard Serino TWICE testify that Trayvon's own father said it wasn't Trayvon on the tapes.

Leave it, move on. It's a losing point regardless. No one knows who was screaming on the tape with any degree of certainty and Tracy CLEARLY did not say it WAS Trayvon or you would have called him prosecution.

Point Zimmerman.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by Gary84Clark

no where near being a riot you guys are so ill informed about what caused the LA riots. It was the fact [people were tired of the long history of he LA PD and that was the last straw. riots don;t happen off of isolated incidents. Frustration has to build up over time. But that won't fit into Rush Limbaugh narrative, not as entertaining. He is gonna do some time not sure how much though. His rectum is gonna be re-sized.

Whats your narrative based on?

I don't think anyone expects a full blown riot like we experienced in LA 20 years back. But unfortunately most of us are without a JoeRedskins to inform them with the realities of the case. So i think its reasonable to believe that their may be some civil disobedience, because at the end of the day there are many people who also let their ignorance of facts guide their decision making.

If Zimmerman gets acquitted I think it would be completely reasonable to expect a few flash mobs (non-Glee style). I think you could see something slightly worse if he gets off because of a Stand Your Ground immunity verdict by the judge. The worst case scenario, id imagine, is if you were to have a white or a white Hispanic person shoot and kill a black teen while defending themselves against a flash mob or mini-riot.

Either way im sure Sanford and FL are ready for it.

[saden1]

I am confused why this tape and who heard whose voice matters given the fact that Zimmerman himself said the voice wasnt his voice. I would think Zimmerman's perception matters more than the grieving parents of Martin or Zimmerman's mother.

[RedskinRat]

Originally Posted by saden1

I am confused why this tape and who heard whose voice matters given the fact that Zimmerman himself said the voice wasnt his voice. I would think Zimmerman's perception matters more than the grieving parents of Martin or Zimmerman's mother.

Originally Posted by saden1

You guys disgust me. I'm done talking about this case.

Oh, you came back. Shame.....

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by saden1

I am confused why this tape and who heard whose voice matters given the fact that Zimmerman himself said the voice wasnt his voice. I would think Zimmerman's perception matters more than the grieving parents of Martin or Zimmerman's mother.

“Somehow, he got on top of me,” Zimmerman said. “That’s when I started screaming for help.”

[RedskinRat]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

If Zimmerman gets acquitted I think it would be completely reasonable to expect a few flash mobs (non-Glee style).

If we don't get an updated version of the Jets and Sharks a la West Side Story I'll be very upset. Lots of finger snaps and some magnificent glaring.

"Be cooooool!"

[saden1]

There is no shame in enlightenment, there is in ignorance and malice.

I am taking bets on zimmerman getting convicted of at least manslaughter...you in?

[Gary84Clark]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

Whats your narrative based on?

I don't think anyone expects a full blown riot like we experienced in LA 20 years back. But unfortunately most of us are without a JoeRedskins to inform them with the realities of the case. So i think its reasonable to believe that their may be some civil disobedience, because at the end of the day there are many people who also let their ignorance of facts guide their decision making.

If Zimmerman gets acquitted I think it would be completely reasonable to expect a few flash mobs (non-Glee style). I think you could see something slightly worse if he gets off because of a Stand Your Ground immunity verdict by the judge. The worst case scenario, id imagine, is if you were to have a white or a white Hispanic person shoot and kill a black teen while defending themselves against a flash mob or mini-riot.

Either way im sure Sanford and FL are ready for it.

You expect a riot, that is your expectation. I just do not agree. Why would ther be a riot? Jumping the shark. SMDH.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

“Somehow, he got on top of me,” Zimmerman said. “That’s when I started screaming for help.”

George Zimmerman Can't Hear Himself on 911 Call - Business Insider

People change thier tune once they realize thier freedom is at stake. Zimmerman has proven to be an unscrupulous character so you will have to execuse me for not giving him a pass.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by saden1

George Zimmerman Can't Hear Himself on 911 Call - Business Insider

People change thier tune once they realize thier freedom is at stake. Zimmerman has proven to be an unscrupulous character so you will have to execuse me for not giving him a pass.

From your own link: "I didn't take it as denial. I took it as not recognizing his own voice," Serino said.

You never had that kind of reaction hearing yourself recorded, saden?


edit: Just to be clear, Zimmerman has always said he was the one yelling for help on the tape. Listening to the tape with a cop...

When lead detective for the Sanford, Fla. police department Chris Serino played the recording for Zimmerman during questioning, Zimmerman said, "That doesn't even sound like me," Serino told jurors Monday.

Mark O'Mara, lead attorney for the defense then asked Serino if he thought Zimmerman was in denial.

"I didn't take it as denial. I took it as not recognizing his own voice," Serino said.

How saden turns, what seems to me a normal reaction to hearing yourself on tape, into denial that Zimmerman was the one screaming... I don't know.

Now that's just what Zimmerman and his neighbors say, but to claim Zimmerman "changed his tune" is pretty dishonest on Saden's part.

[RedskinRat]

Originally Posted by saden1

George Zimmerman Can't Hear Himself on 911 Call - Business Insider

People change thier tune once they realize thier freedom is at stake. Zimmerman has proven to be an unscrupulous character so you will have to execuse me for not giving him a pass.

He didn't recognize his voice, that doesn't equate to being unscrupulous.

I know from your earlier coments you just want him found guilty and locked up for life. Your bigotry is astounding, given the evidence presented in the trial so far.

[RedskinRat]

And now the Judge is allowing the evidence of Martin's pot use.

There goes the innocent kid angle.

I see the case for the Prosecution circling the drain. Hope the jury understands what they're hearing and don't just go with a 'Guilty' from the heart.

[saden1]

I guess we should flush his "that doesn't sound like me" statement down the toilet too? The heart doesn't really come into play, just facts of the case and how insane it is to have someone like Zimmerman stalking people talking about they "always get a way with it" and shooting kids in the heart in the name of self-defense go free.


So no go on a bet? Pussy!

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by saden1

I guess we should flush his "that doesn't sound like me" statement down the toilet too? The heart doesn't really come into play, just facts of the case and how insane it is to have someone like Zimmerman stalking people talking about they "always get a way with it" and shooting kids in the heart in the name of self-defense go free.

So no go on a bet? Pussy!

Flush nothing out, including what the detective who was actually talking to Zimmerman at the time said.

In your post above, you flushed out the whole issue of Zimmerman being in the neighborhood watch (he called a lot of people in, for better or worse, without an incident), and whether the kid attacked him or vice-versa. You are flushing out a lot of important points in your diatribe, saden.

I assume you're talking to RR about your bet of conviction for manslaughter or above, but I'd like ask people about that: The charge is murder 2, so manslaughter's not even in play this trial, right?

Could be a real easy bet for you to take, RR. I don't think Zimmerman's getting convicted of any murder charge. I feel like betting is taking sides too much, but unless there's some very good evidence that appears (video of the confrontation would be a godsend one way or the other) it doesn't look good for saden's bet.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

Flush nothing out, including what the detective who was actually talking to Zimmerman at the time said.

In your post above, you flushed out the whole issue of Zimmerman being in the neighborhood watch (he called a lot of people in, for better or worse, without an incident), and whether the kid attacked him or vice-versa. You are flushing out a lot of important points in your diatribe, saden.

I assume you're talking to RR about your bet of conviction for manslaughter or above, but I'd like ask people about that: The charge is murder 2, so manslaughter's not even in play this trial, right?

Could be a real easy bet for you to take, RR. I don't think Zimmerman's getting convicted of any murder charge. I feel like betting is taking sides too much, but unless there's some very good evidence that appears (video of the confrontation would be a godsend one way or the other) it doesn't look good for saden's bet.

Oh lord... if you're going to talk about facts and people going on diatribe and thinking with their hearts you aught to know that manslaughter is in play. It will be presented by the prosecutor for sure and the judge will allow it and the only thing left is whether the jury will knock down 2nd degree murder to manslaughter.

Forget RR, you can get that easy money too!