My evaluation of Shanahan starts now

[30gut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Who are you talking about?
Why would you have though that?

Jason Campbell,but I should correct.
Mike Shanahan didn't cast off Campbell, I fell into the media perception for a second.
Campbell asked to be traded because he didn't want to be the back-up to McNabb and felt he could still start in the NFL.
And Shanahan actually did him a solid and allowed him to seek a trade.

Kyle comes from the Houston Texans who under Gary Kubiac run the Mike Shanahan Denver WCO and keep with Mike's balanced pass-run ratio of near 50-50.
Kyle is the only playcaller from that system that leans heavily towards the pass with a 60-40 ratio.

[REDSKINS4ever]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I can at least entertain the argument that Shanahan has brought something important to the team that was lacking with Jim Zorn, even if it hasn't shown in the standings. But I think the discussion should begin there, and back with the decisions made two years ago that shaped this team to be the way it is today, and not with a total write off of the last two seasons.

The problem is that if the Redskins underachieve again this year and go 6-10, then some people are going to claim that no one could have seen that coming and we need a longer time period to evaluate Mr. Shanahan.

But the truth is: the reason that no one is picking the Redskins to win the division in Shanahan's third year is because we've seen over the last two years that things aren't different than they were under Zorn, so we're looking for small positive signs from RG3 et al, instead of big things from our football team.

Yes, things are much different with Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan than they were under Vinny Cerratto and Jim Zorn. First thing is since Allen and Shanahan came on board, there has been tremendous overhaul to the roster two years and counting. The Redskins had a average draft in Mike Shanahan's first year, and the last two drafts they have drafted extremely well. One of the reasons the Redskins struggled on offense last year was the QB play. With RG3 although he's a rookie, the quarterback play will be much improved. I've been on NFL.com and I've seen what the so-called experts are predicting for the Redskins. Some analysts have the Redskins going 7-9. Other have the Redskins being 8-8. And one said 6-10.

I think they are all wrong. In addition to those draft picks, Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan has signed some key free agents on the offensive side of the ball too. Under Grossman and Beck at quarterback, the Redskins finished 16th in total offense. With Griffin III at quarterback along with Garcon, Moss, Hankerson, J. Morgan, Fred Davis, Niles Paul, I expect that offensive ranking to be greater than it was last season. Include an above average running game, and this Redskins offense can be in the top 10 this season.

I expect at worse the Redskins to be 8-8. At best they are at least a 10-6 team or better.

[GTripp0012]

I agree with you that the Redskins should be very good this year. At least, they've done enough over the last two offseasons to put themselves in position to be very good this year. I suspect that they haven't changed enough to go get it done on a week to week campaign, but they have big play ability on both offense and defense.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I agree with you that the Redskins should be very good this year. At least, they've done enough over the last two offseasons to put themselves in position to be very good this year. I suspect that they haven't changed enough to go get it done on a week to week campaign, but they have big play ability on both offense and defense.

Why are you still impersonating GTripp? Have you kidnapped him?

Holy smokes, if Tripp has guarded optimism, maybe this will be a very good year.

[GTripp0012]

I pretty much always have guarded optimism. I just can't buy in wholly to what I've seen the last two years until something convinces me it's different now.

That's why I've been a bit slower to get swept up in the RG3 madness. RG3 is awesome. But RG3 running Kyle Shanahan's offense is less exciting than it could be if he was running Andy Reid's offense or Kevin Gilbride's offense or even Mike Martz' offense. So I see this season as a mixed bag, but I'm cautiously optimistic about their chances this season.

[WilbursHomie]

There's two kinds of bad teams. Ones with bad talent, and ones with bad leadership. Bad leadership can be corrected with a new coach and 1 draft. Like San Fran last year. Unfortunately we were the former, and that takes a ton of time because you have to rebuild through the draft. Even if we're not there yet, the wheels are turning in the right direction. I could be wrong but I think 8 out of our nine draft picks this year made the team. When was the last time that happened in DC? Moving on Up.

[GTripp0012]

It happened in 2008?

[KI Skins Fan]

Didn't 11 of 12 draft picks get on the field at some point last season?

[Defensewins]

The title of this thread comes at interesting time.
Andy Reid has not yet been offered an extension and his job security has been questioned or at least challenged. M. Vick has been soft lately and needs to show he can survive at least one season.
Romo and the Dallas staff look vulnerable to me. That offensive line looks leaky. Romo's elusiveness will be tested this year. They have to make it to the playoffs to survive - not a guarantee.
We have two young promising Qb's that up to now show they can play in this league. I am not claiming them to be studs yet, but I have not been disappointed in what I have seen so far. The young OL they drafted this year look like they might be able play some. That is good because they will be needed. We got an ILB, CB and safety late in the draft that show some ability. They are finding talent, an area our last FO was mentally challenged.

[44 goes 50 gut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Who are you talking about?

No kidding, the first year Campbell was benched repeatedly for Gradkowski and only started due to injury, the second year he lucked into a couple wins while throwing for 150 yards and the usual one TD, while his running game did all the heavy lifting until he got injured NOT SLIDING (as usual) and was replaced by a mediocre Carson Palmer.

[HailGreen28]

Well, can't have an evaluation without a draft history. (shamelessly copied off wiki - LINK) Even though it's too early to conclusively judge even the 2010 draft, here it is.


2010 Draft
Rd Pick Overall Name Position College
1 4 4 Trent Williams OT Oklahoma
4 5 103 Perry Riley LB Louisiana State
6 5 174 Dennis Morris TE Louisiana Tech
7 12 219 Terrence Austin WR UCLA
7 22 229 Erik Cook G New Mexico
7 24 231 Selvish Capers OT West Virginia

2011 Draft
Round Pick Overall Name Position College
1 16 16 Ryan Kerrigan DE Purdue
2 9 41 Jarvis Jenkins DT Clemson
3 15 79 Leonard Hankerson WR Miami
4 8 105 Roy Helu RB Nebraska
5 15 146 DeJon Gomes S Nebraska
5 24 155 Niles Paul WR Nebraska
6 12 177 Evan Royster RB Penn State
6 13 178 Aldrick Robinson WR Southern Methodist
7 10 213 Brandyn Thompson CB Boise State
7 14 217 Maurice Hurt OT Florida
7 21 224 Markus White DE Florida State
7 50 253 Chris Neild DT West Virginia

2012 Draft
Round Pick Overall Name Position College
1 2 2 Robert Griffin III QB Baylor
3 8 71 Josh LeRibeus OG Southern Methodist
4 7 102 Kirk Cousins QB Mich St
4 24 119 Keenan Robinson ILB Texas
5 6 141 Adam Gettis OG Iowa
6 3 173 Alfred Morris RB FAU
6 23 193 Tom Compton OT South Dakota
7 6 213 Richard Crawford CB Southern Methodist
7 10 217 Jordan Bernstine S Iowa

Thoughts? Anybody want to grade this so far?

[GTripp0012]

6 starters so far, all the first rounders have pro bowl type potential, a little bit of upside elsewhere?

Solidly average, and trending a little bit upward (above average in 2011 and 2012 combined).

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

Well, can't have an evaluation without a draft history. (shamelessly copied off wiki - LINK) Even though it's too early to conclusively judge even the 2010 draft, here it is.


2010 Draft
Rd Pick Overall Name Position College
1 4 4 Trent Williams OT Oklahoma
4 5 103 Perry Riley LB Louisiana State
6 5 174 Dennis Morris TE Louisiana Tech
7 12 219 Terrence Austin WR UCLA
7 22 229 Erik Cook G New Mexico
7 24 231 Selvish Capers OT West Virginia

2011 Draft
Round Pick Overall Name Position College
1 16 16 Ryan Kerrigan DE Purdue
2 9 41 Jarvis Jenkins DT Clemson
3 15 79 Leonard Hankerson WR Miami
4 8 105 Roy Helu RB Nebraska
5 15 146 DeJon Gomes S Nebraska
5 24 155 Niles Paul WR Nebraska
6 12 177 Evan Royster RB Penn State
6 13 178 Aldrick Robinson WR Southern Methodist
7 10 213 Brandyn Thompson CB Boise State
7 14 217 Maurice Hurt OT Florida
7 21 224 Markus White DE Florida State
7 50 253 Chris Neild DT West Virginia

2012 Draft
Round Pick Overall Name Position College
1 2 2 Robert Griffin III QB Baylor
3 8 71 Josh LeRibeus OG Southern Methodist
4 7 102 Kirk Cousins QB Mich St
4 24 119 Keenan Robinson ILB Texas
5 6 141 Adam Gettis OG Iowa
6 3 173 Alfred Morris RB FAU
6 23 193 Tom Compton OT South Dakota
7 6 213 Richard Crawford CB Southern Methodist
7 10 217 Jordan Bernstine S Iowa

Thoughts? Anybody want to grade this so far?

I'd give 2010 a C because while we got two starters from that draft, one has a major mark against him in Williams. The rest of that draft class was worthless.

The 2011 draft gets an A-. Seven players will be counted on to contribute in 2012, that's pretty impressive. I doubt there are any potential All Pro players other than Kerrigan but all of them will be playing a role every Sunday.

Of course it is too soon to judge the 2012 draft but I'll go with a grade no lower than a B-. We've solved the QB spot two deep for the next 5 years or worst case have a potential trade chip in Cousins. I think Crawford has something at the CB position and have hopes that LeRib and Gettis will be factors on the OL in 2013 and beyond.

Part of the plan was clearly to get younger and more 'home grown'. I've noted in a couple of threads that we have drafted the most number of players (21) in the league and the most OL (7) over the past 3 drafts, although 4 OL and 18 (plus Nield) remain on the roster. That is a huge improvement from the old, mismatched roster that was here in 2009.

One of the things the Steelers, Patriots, Giants of the league have done is cultivate a culture and a 'brand' for lack of a better term and they have drafted, traded and signed free agents according to their philosophy. This is what Shanahan is trying to do IMO.

[WilbursHomie]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

Didn't 11 of 12 draft picks get on the field at some point last season?

See, there you go. Thats a ton of young talent. So when one ends up being a great player, we'll have them on the way up, playing for that big dollar second contract. Good things are coming. The only bad thing is that our whole division does that really well. Except Dallas...they do nothing well...ever...except suck ass.

[KI Skins Fan]

We seem to do fine in the first four rounds. After that, there doesn't seem to be all that much potential. My preliminary conclusion would be that trading down hasn't helped much, if at all.

Allow me to restate the obvious: based on what we gave up in future high draft picks for RGIII, we need him to be an outstanding player. If he becomes our Franchise QB for ten years, Shanahan's draft grade goes way up IMO.

I think Cousins was a shrewd pick. If he develops the way I think he will, then he will be a valuable asset either on the field or as a trade chip.

Also, if Leonard Hankerson and Jarvis Jenkins can get back to where they were physically before their injuries, I think they could become stars.