Fresh Start Political Thread

[sdskinsfan2001]

All national security should be above politics.

[sdskinsfan2001]

How did Trump kiss Putin's ass? I'm legitimately asking.

Was Obama tough on Putin?

Was Trump any different than the last couple administration's before him?

Seems like Trump is held to a different standard than anyone else because most of you hate him personally.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

How did Trump kiss Putin's ass? I'm legitimately asking.

Was Obama tough on Putin?

Was Trump any different than the last couple administration's before him?

Seems like Trump is held to a different standard than anyone else because most of you hate him personally.

Bothsideism definitely applies when it comes to Trump and Obama interactions with Russia/Putin - Obama was soft even before he was inaugurated (The after I'm elected comments, the wrecking of NATO missile defense policy etc. and Trump has been praising/defending Putin since he was elected.

Biden hasn't been as soft as either (yet?) but that is almost certainly due to Trump's coziness with Putin rather than a rational policy decision (although in this case it works out).

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Bothsideism definitely applies when it comes to Trump and Obama interactions with Russia/Putin - Obama was soft even before he was inaugurated (The after I'm elected comments, the wrecking of NATO missile defense policy etc. and Trump has been praising/defending Putin since he was elected.

Biden hasn't been as soft as either (yet?) but that is almost certainly due to Trump's coziness with Putin rather than a rational policy decision (although in this case it works out).

Chico has a point about the lifting of the pipeline sanction - hmm close Keystone and hurt Canada and the US, but remove sanctions connected to the Euro pipeline and help Russia. I withdraw my assertion that Biden is harder on the Russians so far, he is just as bad as his two predecessors.

[SunnySide]

President Donald Trump played down the SolarWinds breach and shifted blame to China in his first public remarks on a cyberattack that’s crippled numerous federal agencies.

“The Cyber Hack is far greater in the Fake News Media than in actuality,” Trump tweeted at 11:30 a.m. ET Saturday. “I have been fully briefed and everything is well under control. Russia, Russia, Russia is the priority chant when anything happens because Lamestream is, for mostly financial reasons, petrified of discussing the possibility that it may be China (it may!).”

Trump’s remarks around attribution contradict what Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said Friday in an interview with conservative talk radio program “The Mark Levin Show.”

https://www.crn.com/news/security/tr...-blames-russia

White House officials had readied a statement Friday calling Russia "the main actor" in the attack, but were ordered not to release it, the Associated Press reports.

Around the same time, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said in an interview that Russia is "pretty clearly" behind the attack, which hit the State Department, among many other agencies and businesses.
Saturday, Trump tweeted that the extent of the attack was being overplayed by the media and that others could be responsible for the attack, perhaps China.

Between the lines: Some security experts fear the president's position will transform what should be a unified government response to a hostile act by a foreign power into yet another personal loyalty test.

Last month Trump fired CISA director Christopher Krebs after Krebs affirmed that the 2020 election had been secure.

Anything involving "Russia, Russia, Russia" (as Trump put it in his tweet) has been a sore point for the president since Russia's hacks during the 2016 election became the foundation for years of investigations into his administration's relationship with Moscow.

https://www.axios.com/solarwinds-hac...1c0787c94.html

Receipts as you like to say ....

Its okay to acknowledge that a bankrupt tv reality personality would put his image above country ...

[SunnySide]

The pipeline .. Ive heard 2 reasons why.

1. Germany really wanted us to lift the sanctions bc the pipeline would greatly help them (albeit make them even more dependent on russia energy). After 4 years of treating our main ally poorly, I think we are trying to mend some broken relations.

2. We want to try and work with Russia on areas where we can. We made targeted sanctions in response to Solar Winds hack and this pipeline to Germany has nothing to do with the hacking.

I did read weve "hacked" russias power grid .. or at least let them know we can hack it at any moment.

----------

But my original thought remains ... what do we do with Russia and hacking? Do you hack them back hard? Do you sanction them some more?

its not a biden or trump thing moving forward .. what do we do now?

Id say we make cyber security a top priority. the actual details, i dont know.

[SunnySide]

Foreign hacking is no ones fault. We cant stop China or Russia from trying, Id assume we are under constant multiple attacks at all times .. and that doesnt change if its a D or an R in the WH.

Its not Trumps fault then and its not Bidens fault now.

Claiming that Biden is weak on Russia and hacking bc of his decision re a pipeline that benefits our ally Germany and is not connected to cyber hacking .... thats your call.

Hopefully we make cyber security a main priority going forward ... just seems like such an untameable ever changing beast to me.

I dont think we will ever be in front of it. Honestly what our govt is doing, i dont think we will ever know or become public knowledge.

[sdskinsfan2001]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Foreign hacking is no ones fault. We cant stop China or Russia from trying, Id assume we are under constant multiple attacks at all times .. and that doesnt change if its a D or an R in the WH.

Its not Trumps fault then and its not Bidens fault now.

Claiming that Biden is weak on Russia and hacking bc of his decision re a pipeline that benefits our ally Germany and is not connected to cyber hacking .... thats your call.

Hopefully we make cyber security a main priority going forward ... just seems like such an untameable ever changing beast to me.

I dont think we will ever be in front of it. Honestly what our govt is doing, i dont think we will ever know or become public knowledge.

Agreed, that it's only the president's fault insomuch as he was the president when it happened (any president). But it's not like they are on the front lines.

And you can't stop every hack forever. It's not possible or reasonable to expect.

As much as playing defense the best you can is important, I think being able to track where the threats come from and being able to hit back twice as hard is more important.

Cyber warfare is going to be just as important as boots on the ground for the rest of humans existence on this planet.

We should be spending time, money, and resources on it like our national security depends on it. Because it does.

We can launch an offensive attack with manpower/weapons that the world has never seen before, we need to have the same capabilities with cyber warfare. Maybe we already do, like you said, I doubt that is info they will or should share.

[SunnySide]

Infrastructure Bill is going to be interesting. Seems there are going to be 2 bills.

One is bipartisan at around 1.2T focused on "hard" infrastructure like roads, bridges.

Second is the Dem only one, which would be passed through reconciliation only requiring 50 + 1 (VP Harris). Manchin said he could go along with a 2T plan, Bernie wants 6T. Dem plan would include climate measures, health care, college etc.

The "infrastructure bill" is supposed to pay for itself and then some but idk. Im not keen on passing a 6T bill. 2T sounds fair enough.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Infrastructure Bill is going to be interesting. Seems there are going to be 2 bills.

One is bipartisan at around 1.2T focused on "hard" infrastructure like roads, bridges.

Second is the Dem only one, which would be passed through reconciliation only requiring 50 + 1 (VP Harris). Manchin said he could go along with a 2T plan, Bernie wants 6T. Dem plan would include climate measures, health care, college etc.

The "infrastructure bill" is supposed to pay for itself and then some but idk. Im not keen on passing a 6T bill. 2T sounds fair enough.

Wow 2T sounds fair enough??? How did we get to the point where anyone thinks that is sane?

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Wow 2T sounds fair enough??? How did we get to the point where anyone thinks that is sane?

By ignoring it for years and years and years. Mitch and the GOP and their “just leave well enough alone” attitude. Now we have major issues across the board as a result of the do nothing GOP.
It’s the same as not paying your bills or taxes for years. All of the sudden you have a mountain of debt. Its just on a larger scale because we are talking about an entire country not a single family home.

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Wow 2T sounds fair enough??? How did we get to the point where anyone thinks that is sane?

The last Transportation Bill was passed in 2015 with a price tag of 305B that expired last year and we extended it this year bc we didnt have a replacement.

So it seems there needs to be some kind of new Transportation Bill.

There hasnt been a gas tax increase since 1993 and with cars being more fuel efficient, the Highway Trust Fund will be insolvent by 2022.

So it looks like we need to (1) pass a new Trans Bill, (2) pump money into it bc the gas tax supposed to fund it is nearly zero.

But I dont think anyone is arguing about the need for one .. just the amount and scope.
---------------------------------------------

By The Numbers: Biden's $2 Trillion Infrastructure Plan

The $2 trillion proposal includes:

$115 billion to repair and rebuild bridges, highways and roads;
$100 billion to expand high-speed broadband across the entire country;
$100 billion to upgrade and build new schools;
and $100 billion to expand and improve power lines and spur a shift to clean energy.

Embedded within the plan are efforts to build out U.S. clean energy infrastructure that, by itself, would rank as one of the most ambitious initiatives ever by the federal government to lower the country's greenhouse gas emissions, along with efforts to address racial inequalities and advance the U.S. economy to compete with China.

The initial package includes two environmental ideas Biden regularly talked about when running for president: creating a New Deal-inspired Climate Conservation Corps to work on conservation projects and environmental justice efforts, as well as catalyzing an irreversible shift from gasoline-powered to electric vehicles.

Biden wants to spend billions on rebates and tax incentives to encourage Americans to purchase electric vehicles, and he proposes paying for the transition of thousands of transit and school buses from diesel to electric. At the same time, he wants incentives for state and local governments to build electric vehicle charging stations to power those new cars and buses.

Altogether, Biden is proposing $174 billion in spending on boosting the electric vehicle market — more than the plan would spend on highway and bridge repairs.

The proposal would also try to speed up private investments in clean energy such as wind and solar by expanding investment and production tax credits and funding existing state and local projects that already do the same.
Biden Administration Pushes Major Expansion For Offshore Wind Energy

Biden has repeatedly said that addressing historic racial injustice is one of the top goals of his administration. Attempts to fix decades of racial inequity run through the various efforts in the infrastructure proposal. The president's plan would replace all of the country's lead pipes and service lines — dangerous infrastructure flaws that predominantly affect communities of color such as Flint, Mich. It would spend $85 billion improving and expanding mass transportation, the main mode of transportation for many people of color.

Biden's plan even includes a $20 billion proposal to reconnect urban neighborhoods cut off, bulldozed and blighted by highways planned and built with little to no regard for the people who lived along their routes.

The pay-fors

Biden's just-passed $1.9 trillion American Rescue Plan relied entirely on deficit spending. This time, the administration is proposing tax hikes — with several directed at corporations.

The White House wants to raise corporate taxes to 28% — halfway between the current top corporate rate of 21% set by former President Donald Trump's 2017 tax law and the 35% rate before it was enacted. Biden's measure would also raise the global minimum tax for U.S. multinational corporations, attempting to stop the shifting of profits to tax havens.

The infrastructure proposal does not mention raising individual tax rates, including on wealthy Americans.

While the bulk of the proposal's $2 trillion in spending would come over the coming eight years, the administration says the increased revenue would pay for all of the projects over a timespan nearly twice as long: 15 years.

https://www.npr.org/2021/03/31/98290...structure-plan

---------------

The year is 2021.

Electric vehicles - im all for it. Its the future, its where we are going. Fossil fuels are outdated and while we have vast oil reserves, the market is volatile and too dependent on Iran and Russias of the world.

Clean energy - alternative energy sources just makes sense. Why not take serious steps towards the future of energy.

Transitioning busses from gas to electric - just making more sense. Weve put off technology long enough.


Looking at the bill, it is transformative but it is needed. If the Dems dont get this done now in their 2 year window, youre looking at god knows how long until they have another chance.

Obama got ACA.

Trump got his corporate tax cuts.

Biden hopefully gets his Transportation Bill.


*** yeah i know its a big wall of hard to read text ... but its the first article I read that did a decent breakdown ... for anyone interested in knowing the details of a plan they already made their mind up to hate ***

[Giantone]

Fuck trump

Yahoo News
'Was there a bone saw?' How Trump helped the Saudis whitewash the murder of Jamal Khashoggi.


https://news.yahoo.com/was-there-a-b...090028789.html

The story of how the Trump White House responded to Khashoggi’s gruesome murder — and ultimately helped cover up the crime — is the subject of “Anatomy of a Cover-up,” the eighth and final episode in the Yahoo News’ “Conspiracyland” podcast series, “The Secret Lives and Brutal Death of Jamal Khashoggi.”

It is a story in which American values and rhetorical support for human rights around the world collided head first with perceived U.S. strategic and economic interests in the region. And it is a tension that carried over into the Biden administration when the new president, having pledged during his campaign to turn the Saudi kingdom into a world “pariah,” chose not to impose any penalties on the person who the CIA had concluded was responsible for Khashoggi’s murder: Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, or MBS.





chico blaming MSM in .....5,4,3,2,1

[Chico23231]

6 trillion…what in the actual fuck ? Amazing. Absolutely no way should we waste 6 trillion for these bullshit pet projects…I’m sure they spending on welfare so more lazy ass Democrats can sit home and not work…claiming their oppressed or some other made up bullshit excuse of being a victim


I know what I’m getting G1 for Christmas:



Lol get rekt

[punch it in]

The guy who we cannot mention by name because he is suddenly irrelevant (yeah sure) spent 2 T on tax cuts for the super rich but there is outrage on a possible 2T bill that would actually benefit all Americans. Laughable.
Unless you are a multi millionaire and you stand behind today’s GOP you might as well just wake up every day, punch yourself in the face repeatedly, and go back to sleep.