Ron Rivera Thread

MTK · 01-01-2020, 05:15 PM

I should add I do feel like we’re in good hands with Rivera and Del Rio. Both are high character quality guys who will establish a good culture here. No more club Jay BS, we’re going to be a hard nosed blue collar bunch. Again, Snyder needs to just let them do their jobs and we could have something here.

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MTK · 01-01-2020, 06:21 PM

The very early signs may be promising but we’ve only just begun

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mooby · 01-01-2020, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTK

The very early signs may be promising but we’ve only just begun

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The signs have been promising every time it happened except for Zorn.

2001: Oh he hired respected no-nonsense coach Marty Schottenheimer? What could go wrong!

2002: Ok, maybe he clashed with Schottenheimer. Spurrier runs that run'n'gun though, he's gonna have the Skins averaging 40 a game!

2004: O' holy father, thank you for answering my prayers. May Gibbs return this dumpster fire to the top of glory mountain.

2008: Well Gibbs ended on a sad note but at lea... wait what? Jim Fassel? ARE YOU SMOKING CRACK DAN? Fine, fine! We'll settle for Jim Zorn, even he can't be that bad compared to Fassel.

2010: Well we're not feeling Zorny anymore, but praise be! Cerrato has been removed, Bruce Allen has previous football experience and Mike Shanahan is a well respected head coach who has 2 titles under his belt!

2014: Well even Shanahan couldn't drag us out of the depths of hell, but Jay Gruden runs a good looking offense over there in Cincy!

2019: JESUS FUCKING CHRIST FIRE BRUCE ALLEN ALREADY! What's this? Nobody with any self-respect will work here as long as Allen does? Yay!!!!!! Itistheonlyway.

FrenchSkin · 01-01-2020, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooby

The signs have been promising every time it happened except for Zorn.

2001: Oh he hired respected no-nonsense coach Marty Schottenheimer? What could go wrong!

2002: Ok, maybe he clashed with Schottenheimer. Spurrier runs that run'n'gun though, he's gonna have the Skins averaging 40 a game!

2004: O' holy father, thank you for answering my prayers. May Gibbs return this dumpster fire to the top of glory mountain.

2008: Well Gibbs ended on a sad note but at lea... wait what? Jim Fassel? ARE YOU SMOKING CRACK DAN? Fine, fine! We'll settle for Jim Zorn, even he can't be that bad compared to Fassel.

2010: Well we're not feeling Zorny anymore, but praise be! Cerrato has been removed, Bruce Allen has previous football experience and Mike Shanahan is a well respected head coach who has 2 titles under his belt!

2014: Well even Shanahan couldn't drag us out of the depths of hell, but Jay Gruden runs a good looking offense over there in Cincy!

2019: JESUS FUCKING CHRIST FIRE BRUCE ALLEN ALREADY! What's this? Nobody with any self-respect will work here as long as Allen does? Yay!!!!!! Itistheonlyway.

The thing that differs for me, and maybe I don't have all the intel about the previous experiences, is that this time it's not only about the hiring of RR, it's also about the firing of BA AND the fact that RR is seemingly asking for and getting total control and Dan's hands off football decisions.

mooby · 01-01-2020, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

The thing that differs for me, and maybe I don't have all the intel about the previous experiences, is that this time it's not only about the hiring of RR, it's also about the firing of BA AND the fact that RR is seemingly asking for and getting total control and Dan's hands off football decisions.

Rivera already said he doesn't want total control, he just wants to play nice with the GM and pick his 46 for game days. Oh, and take any disagreements to the owner and let the owner settle it.

My only point is it's natural to get excited, we cleaned the house and it's a fresh start. It doesn't mean anything until we start putting wins on the board.

FrenchSkin · 01-01-2020, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooby

Rivera already said he doesn't want total control, he just wants to play nice with the GM and pick his 46 for game days. Oh, and take any disagreements to the owner and let the owner settle it.

My only point is it's natural to get excited, we cleaned the house and it's a fresh start. It doesn't mean anything until we start putting wins on the board.

He said that but he also said he wanted some guarantees that the FO guys would be on the same page as he did, that nobody would interfere with his football decisions and that he wants control on this year's draft. That's obviously way more control than what Jay had.

Warthog · 01-01-2020, 07:39 PM

The difference this year is that there’s no lackey high in the management structure to do Danny’s bidding. That doesn’t mean he may insert one, or turn a newly hired person to the dark side.

HOWEVER, I believe that Rivera asked Snyder for assurances (either verbally or written) that he would stay out of the management or micromanage of the team.
Snyder’s meddling has been the Achilles Heal of this franchise for 20 years. HC like Gibbs were too nice to keep Cerrato/Snyder out of the kitchen, guys like Zorn were too intimidated to do anything. I would be EXTREMELY SURPRISED if this topic was not discussed heavily, perhaps even before Rivera showed up. Remember Rivera’s agent only let Rivera come to Asburn if certain items were agreed to. Fire BA, Rivera gets total say on staff and first years draft and FA, Rivera gets to help in selection of GM and VP after the draft. The problem’s in the Redskin’s management is well known and documented in the NFL. Why would Rivera come here under the same conditions of the prior 8 HC failures!

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CRedskinsRule · 01-02-2020, 07:50 AM

Actually, from what I have read, it seems like Rivera is looking for a cooperative stace with Snyder not one where DS is locked out of control. That may be the best arrangement when you have an owner like Snyder. It keeps him in the loop enough so he doesn't get lackeys, but Rivera seems to have a strong enough sense of his way, and the results to keep Dan's respect.

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skinsfaninok · 01-02-2020, 11:39 AM

Presser at 2pm ET

SunnySide · 01-02-2020, 11:56 AM

Heard a Carolina inside reporter interview this morning on Doc and Galdi.

Analytics seems to be not high on Rivera's list. One of the reasons new team owner Tepper wanted a new coach, wanted a more analytic offensive HC.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...ire-ron-rivera

OConnell uses modern concepts and analytics. Hopefully that doesnt cause a rift.

JoeRedskin · 01-02-2020, 12:43 PM

In terms of the power dynamic at Redskins HQ, Snyder + FO Bootlicker is a bad combo no matter what the original agreement with the HC is. Cerrato/Allen both had Snyder's ear and, regardless of their title or express authority, they were apparently able to exert influence into key franchise decisions during stressful situations that, ultimately, undercut the HC's authority.

The exception this dynamic was Gibbs & Cerrato but Dan worshipped Gibbs; I am betting Cerrato did everything in his power to ingratiate himself to JG while he was here. When Gibbs unexpectedly quit, Cerrato stepped right back up and we ended up with <sigh> Zorn (stayin' medium!) who was 0 threat to Cerrato's influence.

I am with CRedskins on this. RR's being the first hire and a commitment from DS that the front office's head will be someone compatible with RR bodes well, IMHO.

If the new GM/[Title of Choice for FO head] is Kyle Smith, great. I think he is a solid choice and doesn't APPEAR to be a BA crony - at least I have seen nothing to suggest that. If RR and he are not on the same page, then out he goes. If they are, sweet! While housecleaning is necessary, if quality people can be retained who are on board and compatible with RR's "tough-nosed" professionalism, that is a good thing to me.

Giving RR say in who runs the FO is a solid move. RR has said "I don't want to run the organization or be in charge of player acquisition" (or words to that effect). Rather, he just wants "to pick the 46 that are going to play", to be consulted by those in charge of player acquisition about team needs, etc. and to have access to ownership if a dispute between him and the FO arises about the teams direction.

So, it seems to me that RR is looking to step into a situation where he and the FO are on the same page. I suggest it is RR's expectation that his relationship with the FO chief will work something like this -
--
FO Chief: Okay coach, what are we looking for?
RR: Well, we could use a MLB who is good at [X] and a TE who can really [Y]
FOC: Okay, we'll work on that. [TIME PASSES ...]
FOC: Okay, we got a couple of guys lined up who we think fit your needs.
RR: Great. Get them on the roster and we work'em out.

IF DISPUTES ARISE:
RR: Hey, those guys didn't really work out and we need to move on from them.
FOC: Not gonna do that. ... and BTW, we signed X and DS expects him to be our new starting RB.
RR: We need to have a sit down with DS and figure out this sh**, b/c this is not how 'teamwork' works.
FOC: No need, DS is already in the loop and on board.
RR: Yes. Need. DS is not in the loop until he has heard my piece. If he is on board after that, then so be it. Next time though, if you try an end-around, one of us is out the door and I will tell DS exactly that.
--
Again, I don't think RR really wants to run things. I do think RR really wants to have things run professionally and that, if thinks they are not, he will let DS know that.

BaltimoreSkins · 01-02-2020, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

In terms of the power dynamic at Redskins HQ, Snyder + FO Bootlicker is a bad combo no matter what the original agreement with the HC is. Cerrato/Allen both had Snyder's ear and, regardless of their title or express authority, they were apparently able to exert influence into key franchise decisions during stressful situations that, ultimately, undercut the HC's authority.

The exception this dynamic was Gibbs & Cerrato but Dan worshipped Gibbs; I am betting Cerrato did everything in his power to ingratiate himself to JG while he was here. When Gibbs unexpectedly quit, Cerrato stepped right back up and we ended up with <sigh> Zorn (stayin' medium!) who was 0 threat to Cerrato's influence.

I am with CRedskins on this. RR's being the first hire and a commitment from DS that the front office's head will be someone compatible with RR bodes well, IMHO.

If the new GM/[Title of Choice for FO head] is Kyle Smith, great. I think he is a solid choice and doesn't APPEAR to be a BA crony - at least I have seen nothing to suggest that. If RR and he are not on the same page, then out he goes. If they are, sweet! While housecleaning is necessary, if quality people can be retained who are on board and compatible with RR's "tough-nosed" professionalism, that is a good thing to me.

Giving RR say in who runs the FO is a solid move. RR has said "I don't want to run the organization or be in charge of player acquisition" (or words to that effect). Rather, he just wants "to pick the 46 that are going to play", to be consulted by those in charge of player acquisition about team needs, etc. and to have access to ownership if a dispute between him and the FO arises about the teams direction.

So, it seems to me that RR is looking to step into a situation where he and the FO are on the same page. I suggest it is RR's expectation that his relationship with the FO chief will work something like this -
--
FO Chief: Okay coach, what are we looking for?
RR: Well, we could use a MLB who is good at [X] and a TE who can really [Y]
FOC: Okay, we'll work on that. [TIME PASSES ...]
FOC: Okay, we got a couple of guys lined up who we think fit your needs.
RR: Great. Get them on the roster and we work'em out.

IF DISPUTES ARISE:
RR: Hey, those guys didn't really work out and we need to move on from them.
FOC: Not gonna do that. ... and BTW, we signed X and DS expects him to be our new starting RB.
RR: We need to have a sit down with DS and figure out this sh**, b/c this is not how 'teamwork' works.
FOC: No need, DS is already in the loop and on board.
RR: Yes. Need. DS is not in the loop until he has heard my piece. If he is on board after that, then so be it. Next time though, if you try an end-around, one of us is out the door and I will tell DS exactly that.
--
Again, I don't think RR really wants to run things. I do think RR really wants to have things run professionally and that, if thinks they are not, he will let DS know that.

Only commenting on Vinny here. He has a radio show in Baltimore and some of this is he said/ he said from the show and some just inferring but I get the impression Vinny was a yes man through and through and not interested in exuding any authority.

Warthog · 01-02-2020, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

Only commenting on Vinny here. He has a radio show in Baltimore and some of this is he said/ he said from the show and some just inferring but I get the impression Vinny was a yes man through and through and not interested in exuding any authority.

Both Vinny and Bruce Allen were the same: lackey, azz kissing executives with vast power in the franchise and little football knowledge or ability. Their job was to provide cover for Dan Snyder decisions and be the fan/media punching bag when those decisions were wrong - as they often were.

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JoeRedskin · 01-02-2020, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warthog

Both Vinny and Bruce Allen were the same: lackey, azz kissing executives with vast power in the franchise and little football knowledge or ability. Their job was to provide cover for Dan Snyder decisions and be the fan/media punching bag when those decisions were wrong - as they often were.

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We need a facebook "Like" button, b/c I would have smashed on it this.

AnonEmouse · 01-02-2020, 12:51 PM

Re Snyder's approach, something tells me this brain trust he reportedly used told him he needed to step away from football ops and let the football guys do their stuff. It may not be a case of RR wanting/having more control as much as DS agreeing that he'd look after the business side and leave the GM & HC to manage the football ops.

It is a little curious not having a new GM in place before the HC, but I suspect that DS was advised to keep Smith in place and if they judge that he continues to draft right (and maybe more so, to RR's needs) then they are inclined to promote Smith to GM and thus have the de facto GM already in place; just official post draft. As long as DS isn't telling anyone who to draft, I'd be good with this.

View Poll Results: Grade the Rivera hire
A	42	61.76%
B	23	33.82%
C	2	2.94%
D	0	0%
F	1	1.47%
Voters: 68. You may not vote on this poll

01-01-2020, 05:15 PM	#1
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,851	Re: Ron Rivera Thread I should add I do feel like we’re in good hands with Rivera and Del Rio. Both are high character quality guys who will establish a good culture here. No more club Jay BS, we’re going to be a hard nosed blue collar bunch. Again, Snyder needs to just let them do their jobs and we could have something here. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

01-01-2020, 06:21 PM	#2
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 52 Posts: 99,851	Re: Ron Rivera Thread The very early signs may be promising but we’ve only just begun Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

01-01-2020, 07:39 PM	#7
Warthog The Starter Join Date: Nov 2018 Location: Doylestown, PA Posts: 1,253	Re: Ron Rivera Thread The difference this year is that there’s no lackey high in the management structure to do Danny’s bidding. That doesn’t mean he may insert one, or turn a newly hired person to the dark side. HOWEVER, I believe that Rivera asked Snyder for assurances (either verbally or written) that he would stay out of the management or micromanage of the team. Snyder’s meddling has been the Achilles Heal of this franchise for 20 years. HC like Gibbs were too nice to keep Cerrato/Snyder out of the kitchen, guys like Zorn were too intimidated to do anything. I would be EXTREMELY SURPRISED if this topic was not discussed heavily, perhaps even before Rivera showed up. Remember Rivera’s agent only let Rivera come to Asburn if certain items were agreed to. Fire BA, Rivera gets total say on staff and first years draft and FA, Rivera gets to help in selection of GM and VP after the draft. The problem’s in the Redskin’s management is well known and documented in the NFL. Why would Rivera come here under the same conditions of the prior 8 HC failures! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Four Combat Tours in Afghanistan, Iraq and Kuwait. Flyboy. "Land of the Free and Home of the Brave"

01-02-2020, 07:50 AM	#8
CRedskinsRule Living Legend Join Date: Aug 2008 Age: 58 Posts: 21,703	Re: Ron Rivera Thread Actually, from what I have read, it seems like Rivera is looking for a cooperative stace with Snyder not one where DS is locked out of control. That may be the best arrangement when you have an owner like Snyder. It keeps him in the loop enough so he doesn't get lackeys, but Rivera seems to have a strong enough sense of his way, and the results to keep Dan's respect. Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

01-02-2020, 11:39 AM	#9
skinsfaninok Warpath Hall of Fame Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UNITED STATES Age: 38 Posts: 36,194	Re: Ron Rivera Thread Presser at 2pm ET __________________ “Mediocre people don’t like high achievers, and high achievers don’t like mediocre people.” ― Nick Saban

01-02-2020, 11:56 AM	#10
SunnySide Playmaker Join Date: Sep 2019 Posts: 4,568	Re: Ron Rivera Thread Heard a Carolina inside reporter interview this morning on Doc and Galdi. Analytics seems to be not high on Rivera's list. One of the reasons new team owner Tepper wanted a new coach, wanted a more analytic offensive HC. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...ire-ron-rivera OConnell uses modern concepts and analytics. Hopefully that doesnt cause a rift. __________________ 19,937 car accidents a day in the US. Buy a dash camera for everyone you love. Insurance companies are increasingly denying claims.

01-02-2020, 12:43 PM	#11
JoeRedskin Contains football related knowledge Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Second Star On The Right Age: 62 Posts: 10,401	Re: Ron Rivera Thread In terms of the power dynamic at Redskins HQ, Snyder + FO Bootlicker is a bad combo no matter what the original agreement with the HC is. Cerrato/Allen both had Snyder's ear and, regardless of their title or express authority, they were apparently able to exert influence into key franchise decisions during stressful situations that, ultimately, undercut the HC's authority. The exception this dynamic was Gibbs & Cerrato but Dan worshipped Gibbs; I am betting Cerrato did everything in his power to ingratiate himself to JG while he was here. When Gibbs unexpectedly quit, Cerrato stepped right back up and we ended up with <sigh> Zorn (stayin' medium!) who was 0 threat to Cerrato's influence. I am with CRedskins on this. RR's being the first hire and a commitment from DS that the front office's head will be someone compatible with RR bodes well, IMHO. If the new GM/[Title of Choice for FO head] is Kyle Smith, great. I think he is a solid choice and doesn't APPEAR to be a BA crony - at least I have seen nothing to suggest that. If RR and he are not on the same page, then out he goes. If they are, sweet! While housecleaning is necessary, if quality people can be retained who are on board and compatible with RR's "tough-nosed" professionalism, that is a good thing to me. Giving RR say in who runs the FO is a solid move. RR has said "I don't want to run the organization or be in charge of player acquisition" (or words to that effect). Rather, he just wants "to pick the 46 that are going to play", to be consulted by those in charge of player acquisition about team needs, etc. and to have access to ownership if a dispute between him and the FO arises about the teams direction. So, it seems to me that RR is looking to step into a situation where he and the FO are on the same page. I suggest it is RR's expectation that his relationship with the FO chief will work something like this - -- FO Chief: Okay coach, what are we looking for? RR: Well, we could use a MLB who is good at [X] and a TE who can really [Y] FOC: Okay, we'll work on that. [TIME PASSES ...] FOC: Okay, we got a couple of guys lined up who we think fit your needs. RR: Great. Get them on the roster and we work'em out. IF DISPUTES ARISE: RR: Hey, those guys didn't really work out and we need to move on from them. FOC: Not gonna do that. ... and BTW, we signed X and DS expects him to be our new starting RB. RR: We need to have a sit down with DS and figure out this sh**, b/c this is not how 'teamwork' works. FOC: No need, DS is already in the loop and on board. RR: Yes. Need. DS is not in the loop until he has heard my piece. If he is on board after that, then so be it. Next time though, if you try an end-around, one of us is out the door and I will tell DS exactly that. -- Again, I don't think RR really wants to run things. I do think RR really wants to have things run professionally and that, if thinks they are not, he will let DS know that. __________________ Strap it up, hold onto the ball, and let’s go.

01-02-2020, 12:51 PM	#15
AnonEmouse Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: UK Age: 59 Posts: 2,656	Re: Ron Rivera Thread Re Snyder's approach, something tells me this brain trust he reportedly used told him he needed to step away from football ops and let the football guys do their stuff. It may not be a case of RR wanting/having more control as much as DS agreeing that he'd look after the business side and leave the GM & HC to manage the football ops. It is a little curious not having a new GM in place before the HC, but I suspect that DS was advised to keep Smith in place and if they judge that he continues to draft right (and maybe more so, to RR's needs) then they are inclined to promote Smith to GM and thus have the de facto GM already in place; just official post draft. As long as DS isn't telling anyone who to draft, I'd be good with this.

Ron Rivera Thread

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