Cooley put on IR

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Bottom line, it's time for the young guys to step up.

I may be the only who feels this way, but none of these injuries are deal breakers, save London, and this team can still make a run.

As optimistic as I was at the beginning, for me it's hard not to see this thing going into a tailspin. We're last in the NFC in turnover ratio, 4th last in the league -- that's the only thing that's correctable. Otherwise, we have all the classic problems: Mediocre QB, no gamebreakers on offense. Hell, Moss was our biggest threat and even he hasn't been superstar material lately. Best you can say for Gaffney and Stallworth is that they're competent.

And apparently, asking young WRs like Paul, Hankerson, and Austin to step up and perform is a herculean task; 2-3 year learning curve rule for wideouts and all. Why does it always seem so hard for the Redskins to get some dynamic playmakers?

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

As optimistic as I was at the beginning, for me it's hard not to see this thing going into a tailspin. We're last in the NFC in turnover ratio, 4th last in the league -- that's the only thing that's correctable. Otherwise, we have all the classic problems: Mediocre QB, no gamebreakers on offense. Hell, Moss was our biggest threat and even he hasn't been superstar material lately. Best you can say for Gaffney and Stallworth is that they're competent.

And apparently, asking young WRs like Paul, Hankerson, and Austin to step up and perform is a herculean task; 2-3 year learning curve rule for wideouts and all. Why does it always seem so hard for the Redskins to get some dynamic playmakers?

Probably because we haven't focused on having a fundamentally sound team for the last decade. Playmakers are great, and I agree that we need to find one, two, or even 3, BUT, when our team fails at the simple things of pass protection, run blocking, or defensive pressure, the playmakers we have brought in (Moss, Portis, etc) generally fail. In most cases you have to have a sound team before you can have an explosive team. I believe we are doing better at building a sound team, admittedly- the last two weeks seem to argue against that.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Probably because we haven't focused on having a fundamentally sound team for the last decade. Playmakers are great, and I agree that we need to find one, two, or even 3, BUT, when our team fails at the simple things of pass protection, run blocking, or defensive pressure, the playmakers we have brought in (Moss, Portis, etc) generally fail. In most cases you have to have a sound team before you can have an explosive team. I believe we are doing better at building a sound team, admittedly- the last two weeks seem to argue against that.

We need a Andre Johnson, Calvin Johnson type guy that opens up everything for the entire offense. That's what's been missing around here. When was the last time we had a wr w/ double digit TD's??

[Lotus]

We signed Dominique Byrd and Jonathan Compas.

Hopefully Compas can guide Helu to the end zone.

Injury-riddled Redskins sign TE Byrd, OL Compas - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

[irish]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Probably because we haven't focused on having a fundamentally sound team for the last decade. Playmakers are great, and I agree that we need to find one, two, or even 3, BUT, when our team fails at the simple things of pass protection, run blocking, or defensive pressure, the playmakers we have brought in (Moss, Portis, etc) generally fail. In most cases you have to have a sound team before you can have an explosive team. I believe we are doing better at building a sound team, admittedly- the last two weeks seem to argue against that.

Yep, this team has been so chronically broken that it struggles to do the basics required to be consistently decent, its unrealistic to expect them to be dynamic.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Probably because we haven't focused on having a fundamentally sound team for the last decade. Playmakers are great, and I agree that we need to find one, two, or even 3, BUT, when our team fails at the simple things of pass protection, run blocking, or defensive pressure, the playmakers we have brought in (Moss, Portis, etc) generally fail. In most cases you have to have a sound team before you can have an explosive team. I believe we are doing better at building a sound team, admittedly- the last two weeks seem to argue against that.

We need at least 6-7 playmakers on both sides of the ball. It is impossible to get 14 starting playmakers and depth to go along with it using the strategy Snyder, Gibbs, Vinny, and even Shanahan year 1 tried to follow. There just isn't enough cap room and roster room left to pull it off. A sound team is a team full of playmakers.

And I'm not kidding about 7 playmakers. OLB, OLB, NT, Shutdown CB, Stud MLB, stud safety for our D. We have 4 of those positions filled on D, but only 3 long-term as Fletch is close to retirement. Franchise QB, stud RB, stud WR, stud TE, stud LT, a couple other stud OL are needed for our O. No one on our O has proven that they've reach that level of greatness, but at least we have some prospects that might help long-term in Trent, Helu, and Davis.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Probably because we haven't focused on having a fundamentally sound team for the last decade. Playmakers are great, and I agree that we need to find one, two, or even 3, BUT, when our team fails at the simple things of pass protection, run blocking, or defensive pressure, the playmakers we have brought in (Moss, Portis, etc) generally fail. In most cases you have to have a sound team before you can have an explosive team. I believe we are doing better at building a sound team, admittedly- the last two weeks seem to argue against that.

One of the most important facets of a "fundamentally sound team" are players that can score points. I would argue that all of the things you mentioned, pass pro, run blocking, and defensive pressure, have improved. Granted, the running game is sometimes there, and sometimes it isn't. But when I talk about "playmakers" I'm referring specifically to wideouts who can get separation, run precise routes, and have the speed and elusiveness to find the endzone.

As I said, the only player we have that remotely fits this description has been Santana Moss and even he hasn't been there when we've needed a score most. Fred Davis comes after that, but now all opposing defenses have to do is focus in on him and our offense is effectively grounded.

What bugs me is this idea that you can't rely on young receivers to fill these needs because the learning curve takes so long to go from college to the pros. I'm not sure I buy that. Nonetheless, it's a problem and year after year this franchise doesn't have an answer for it.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

One of the most important facets of a "fundamentally sound team" are players that can score points. I would argue that all of the things you mentioned, pass pro, run blocking, and defensive pressure, have improved. Granted, the running game is sometimes there, and sometimes it isn't. But when I talk about "playmakers" I'm referring specifically to wideouts who can get separation, run precise routes, and have the speed and elusiveness to find the endzone.

As I said, the only player we have that remotely fits this description has been Santana Moss and even he hasn't been there when we've needed a score most. Fred Davis comes after that, but now all opposing defenses have to do is focus in on him and our offense is effectively grounded.

What bugs me is this idea that you can't rely on young receivers to fill these needs because the learning curve takes so long to go from college to the pros. I'm not sure I buy that. Nonetheless, it's a problem and year after year this franchise doesn't have an answer for it.

The bolded point is THE point. Playmakers are great but only if an offense, or defense, can - in all other facets- at least keep an opposing teams on an even keel. Much like we hoped RK would allow Orakpo more freedom to blitz. Playmakers still, generally, need a solid team in order for their abilities to shine through, otherwise opponents zero in, and can prevent them from making plays.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

The bolded point is THE point. Playmakers are great but only if an offense, or defense, can - in all other facets- at least keep an opposing teams on an even keel. Much like we hoped RK would allow Orakpo more freedom to blitz. Playmakers still, generally, need a solid team in order for their abilities to shine through, otherwise opponents zero in, and can prevent them from making plays.

See, we always hear that our team has a lot of solid, but not spectacular players. At this point, I'd say our offensive line is getting to be solid, but not star-studded by any means.

I would also submit that we have *solid* running backs. Nothing particularly special to be sure. QBs and wide receivers, -- that's where we have problems.

Defensively, Landry, Hall, Otogwe, Carriker, Bowen, Kerrigan, Rak, are all "solid" players -- not necessarily perennial Pro Bowlers, and not guys that will show up on a box of Wheaties. But guys who are competent, know their positions, and can basically be counted on to perform consistently.

My point is, we don't have a set of players that take everybody else to the next level. The thing that separates the winners from the losers in this league are the teams that are able to collect the most playmakers. We don't have those guys and it shows.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

As optimistic as I was at the beginning, for me it's hard not to see this thing going into a tailspin. We're last in the NFC in turnover ratio, 4th last in the league -- that's the only thing that's correctable. Otherwise, we have all the classic problems: Mediocre QB, no gamebreakers on offense. Hell, Moss was our biggest threat and even he hasn't been superstar material lately. Best you can say for Gaffney and Stallworth is that they're competent.

And apparently, asking young WRs like Paul, Hankerson, and Austin to step up and perform is a herculean task; 2-3 year learning curve rule for wideouts and all. Why does it always seem so hard for the Redskins to get some dynamic playmakers?

Building a football team is very much like building a portfolio, and most people don't know jack shit on how to do either, Vinny Cerrato and Dan Snyder included.