When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

I blame Gruden for a lot of the Redskins problems but I believe he is tasked with turning chicken shit into chicken salad.

There have been roster moves that are baffling and our draft picks haven't produced for us.

Bruce has said he wants to build through the draft and sign our own guys.
Since he's been here, he's drafted 77 players, only 13 are currently making contributions to this team.
[URL="http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?teamId=5110&type=team"]http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?teamId=5110&type=team[/URL]

This team lacks talent at the skill positions.
Our WRs have been a shit show since they let Garcon and Jackson walk and replaced them with Pryor and Doctson.



Thompson is a quality back but doesn't have homerun speed and doesn't make people miss on one on one situations where it seems AP just tosses them aside.

Peterson and Reed are the only two guys who can excel in this type of offense. We need more speed, A lot more speed on offense.

This front office is trying to build the team using low cost mediocre players ( Richardson and Pryor) and we are getting mediocre results from them.

It seems like the Redskins are in denial about certain players.
They had to have known Doctson wasn't going to be any good in the preseason yet they don't address it early on.
Lavaou has been a problem for years but they go into the season without a backup for him. we all complained about this before preseason started.


Excluding last year, this WR corp is the worst the redskins have had in the last 40 years. Even worse than Westbrooke, Thrash and Irving Fryer in the early 2000s!

I don't think any coach can succeed with this front office.

FIRE BRUCE!

#HungoverRant

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

I honestly don't think talent is the issue right now.

Allen needs to go regardless.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202512]I honestly don't think talent is the issue right now.

Allen needs to go regardless.[/quote]

Ditto on both.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

A fish rots from the head down. And our head is already as rotten as it gets. Teams get their identity from its GM and HC. And that applies to us right now with why we have no consistency and all too often look completely unprepared to play. Fucking sucks.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1202515]A fish rots from the head down. And our head is already as rotten as it gets. Teams get their identity from its GM and HC. And that applies to us right now with why we have no consistency and all too often look completely unprepared to play. Fucking sucks.[/quote]

IMO Allen is on the way out, and Doug is more of the GM. I pin most of the issues on Jay, as he's been the common denominator in all of this.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=jamf;1202508]I blame Gruden for a lot of the Redskins problems but I believe he is tasked with turning chicken shit into chicken salad.

There have been roster moves that are baffling and our draft picks haven't produced for us.

Bruce has said he wants to build through the draft and sign our own guys.
Since he's been here, he's drafted 77 players, only 13 are currently making contributions to this team.
[URL="http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?teamId=5110&type=team"]http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?teamId=5110&type=team[/URL]

This team lacks talent at the skill positions.
Our WRs have been a shit show since they let Garcon and Jackson walk and replaced them with Pryor and Doctson.



Thompson is a quality back but doesn't have homerun speed and doesn't make people miss on one on one situations where it seems AP just tosses them aside.

Peterson and Reed are the only two guys who can excel in this type of offense. We need more speed, A lot more speed on offense.

This front office is trying to build the team using low cost mediocre players ( Richardson and Pryor) and we are getting mediocre results from them.

It seems like the Redskins are in denial about certain players.
They had to have known Doctson wasn't going to be any good in the preseason yet they don't address it early on.
Lavaou has been a problem for years but they go into the season without a backup for him. we all complained about this before preseason started.


Excluding last year, this WR corp is the worst the redskins have had in the last 40 years. Even worse than Westbrooke, Thrash and Irving Fryer in the early 2000s!

I don't think any coach can succeed with this front office.

FIRE BRUCE!

#HungoverRant[/quote]Right on,you're absolutely right but we know Snyder ain't gonna fire Bruce because he doesn't have the GUTS TO DO IT!!

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

Bruce taints the organization in every facet and Grudens game to game management and leadership is atrocious. Great combo for never winning anything.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

Talent is decent, especially on the lines. WR sucks but I'm good with every other group. AD being the best player on O right now scares me tho. U cant have a 33 YO RB doing it all, he's all of the sudden a receiver too now?

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1202520]Talent is decent, especially on the lines. WR sucks but I'm good with every other group. AD being the best player on O right now scares me tho. U cant have a 33 YO RB doing it all, he's all of the sudden a receiver too now?[/quote]

To be fair, we drafted a stud RB and he got hurt. You can't pin injuries on anyone (see Dalvin Cook last year).

I just don't trust Jay's ability to do anything, so I doubt whether talent is the issue if he can't coach.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=Burgold;1202518]Right on,you're absolutely right but we know Snyder ain't gonna fire Bruce because he doesn't have the GUTS TO DO IT!![/quote]

Eh, he canned Vinny twice. Bruce isn't untouchable. It would probably be presented as him stepping down and not being fired.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1202526]To be fair, we drafted a stud RB and he got hurt. You can't pin injuries on anyone (see Dalvin Cook last year).

I just don't trust Jay's ability to do anything, so I doubt whether talent is the issue if he can't coach.[/quote]

I don't completely agree with this.
Dalvin Cook and Guice happen from time to time.
What about Lavauo, Doctson, and Reed?

Reed is healthy only because he wasn't used.
He is all world talent but is on a pitch count.

Lavauo breaks down every year yet we didn't have a back up plan for him so we shuffled the line.

Doctson is in the witness protection program.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=jamf;1202528]I don't completely agree with this.
Dalvin Cook and Guice happen from time to time.
What about Lavauo, Doctson, and Reed?

Reed is healthy only because he wasn't used.
He is all world talent but is on a pitch count.

Lavauo breaks down every year yet we didn't have a back up plan for him so we shuffled the line.

Doctson is in the witness protection program.[/quote]

Well the plan for guard was Arie Kouandjio, but we all know how that went.

I just feel that Jay has more of a say on personnel matters, especially after this summer when there seem to be reports showing that Allen is on his way out. Combine that with issues in coaching and developing/preparing players (like Doctson) to me he seems more responsible than anyone.

Once again, I do agree Allen needs to go, but I feel he's on the way out. It'll be important to have someone in place to hire the next HC. But some of the issues we are having right now are more of Jay's fault .

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

I've been on the fire Allen bandwagon since the Shanahan days, always thought he wanted McC gone because he was jealous of McC getting the credit for building the roster in those days.

The way this season is going I wouldn't be surprised if Gruden and Allen are out. The minimum Gruden needs to do is make the playoffs, but if it's one and done I still wouldn't rule it out.

Allen's football acumen has always been suspect and I'm sure we can find someone equally competent at handling front office matters.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202527]Eh, he canned Vinny twice. Bruce isn't untouchable. It would probably be presented as him stepping down and not being fired.[/quote]

Agree, the organization wont say he was fired even if he is.

People are checking out on this team in droves and I think its going to get worse before it gets better. There is absolutely no buzz or excitement with this team anymore and as fans go away so does the $. That's the only thing the ownership understands and hopefully they get the message before its too late.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

Question, if talent isn't an issue...where do you rank our roster just within the division?

Eagles have a more talented roster...that's an easy one. I think the Giants roster is on par with ours. I think Offensive talent we are better the cowboys...but defensively I think they are equally talented, and maybe give the Cowboys a slight edge.

To say the talent isn't an issue, that's just ignorant....borderline stupid.

Callahan, Tomsula, Kotwica, randy Jordan...these are league-wide, well respected coaches.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=Chico23231;1202582]Question, if talent isn't an issue...where do you rank our roster just within the division?

Eagles have a more talented roster...that's an easy one. I think the Giants roster is on par with ours. I think Offensive talent we are better the cowboys...but defensively I think they are equally talented, and maybe give the Cowboys a slight edge.

To say the talent isn't an issue, that's just ignorant....borderline stupid.

Callahan, Tomsula, Kotwica, randy Jordan...these are league-wide, well respected coaches.[/quote]

Totally agree. Talent is still an issue with this team. Sure the roster has some talent but this team has no bonafide superstars. People might say Williams or Kerrigan and they are nice players but nobody would line up to get those guys. Until the talent gets better this team is stuck in the middle.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202527]Eh, he canned Vinny twice. Bruce isn't untouchable. It would probably be presented as him stepping down and not being fired.[/quote]

He also [U]hired[/U] Vinny twice, for some unfathomable reason.

He doesn't need to fire Bruce to make things better. He could simply put Bruce in charge of all things to do with "winning off the field" and tell Bruce to stay the F away from all football related things.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1202586]He also [U]hired[/U] Vinny twice, for some unfathomable reason.

He doesn't need to fire Bruce to make things better. He could simply put Bruce in charge of all things to do with "winning off the field" and tell Bruce to stay the F away from all football related things.[/quote]

They tried that with the McCloughan hiring but that didn't work out because Scott was getting too much praise.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=Chico23231;1202582]Question, if talent isn't an issue...where do you rank our roster just within the division?

Eagles have a more talented roster...that's an easy one. I think the Giants roster is on par with ours. I think Offensive talent we are better the cowboys...but defensively I think they are equally talented, and maybe give the Cowboys a slight edge.

To say the talent isn't an issue, that's just ignorant....borderline stupid.

Callahan, Tomsula, Kotwica, randy Jordan...these are league-wide, well respected coaches.[/quote]

Do you think there's enough talent to win 10 games? I do. Definitely enough talent here to challenge for the division.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=irish;1202584]Totally agree. Talent is still an issue with this team. Sure the roster has some talent but this team has no bonafide superstars. People might say Williams or Kerrigan and they are nice players but nobody would line up to get those guys. Until the talent gets better this team is stuck in the middle.[/quote]

Williams is more than just a nice player. He's an elite LT.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202589]Do you think there's enough talent to win 10 games? I do. Definitely enough talent here to challenge for the division.[/quote]

Honestly...10 wins, I don't think we do.

To challenge for the division, its a different question but Peterson/Schwartz are the best coaches and they have more talent on the roster. I don't think we can.

We need things to go our way in order to challenge. We will see.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202590]Williams is more than just a nice player. He's an elite LT.[/quote]

When he isn't hurt which is often. Even saying he's elite, who else do the Skins have that is elite? Nobody.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202590]Williams is more than just a nice player. He's an elite LT.[/quote]

Williams is consistently a top 5 LT , That is not a Nice player that is a HOF type lineman. Kerrigan is a "nice" type of player

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=irish;1202595]When he isn't hurt which is often. Even saying he's elite, who else do the Skins have that is elite? Nobody.[/quote]

I agree , nobody else is Elite on this team but we have a good roster. Better than it has been, especially on D. Now the WRs are very AVG as is our Pass rushers (Kerrigan and Smith).

I am sticking with my 9-7 prediction.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[QUOTE=irish;1202595]When he isn't hurt which is often. Even saying he's elite, who else do the Skins have that is elite? Nobody.[/QUOTE]


When has his missed major time? Even on one knee he played great last year. I get your point about the team lacking A+ type of players but Williams isn’t a good example to point to

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=MTK;1202598]When has his missed major time? Even on one knee he played great last year. I get your point about the team lacking A+ type of players but Williams isn’t a good example to point to[/quote]

He doesn't miss major time but he's never 100%. I'll give you Williams but when an OT is your only A+ player then your team is severely lacking talent.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=irish;1202584]Totally agree. Talent is still an issue with this team. Sure the roster has some talent but this team has no bonafide superstars. People might say Williams or Kerrigan and they are nice players but nobody would line up to get those guys. Until the talent gets better this team is stuck in the middle.[/quote]

I am willing to bet everything you own that if we released or offered to trade Trent William's at 5pm today he'd be on another team by 6:30

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1202605]I am willing to bet everything you own that if we released or offered to trade Trent William's at 5pm today he'd be on another team by 6:30[/quote]

Agree but I bet the Skins wouldn't get nearly what you think they'd get for him. My point is that if Williams is the team's only A+ player then this team has a talent problem that no amount of coaching will fix.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

Lack of star power is definitely an issue on this team. There's no guy capable of taking over and dominating. No Aaron Donald, no JJ Watt, no Khalil Mack, no Jalen Ramsey, no Antonio Brown, no Gronk, etc.

You can still be a 10-6 team without a star, though. We do have enough talent to be that good. I point more towards coaching as the issue, rather than lack of talent.

And I point towards the front office for the failing in the coaching department, too. The front office is supposed to set the culture and find the coach. Allen and Gruden both need to go.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=Schneed10;1202612]Lack of star power is definitely an issue on this team. There's no guy capable of taking over and dominating. No Aaron Donald, no JJ Watt, no Khalil Mack, no Jalen Ramsey, no Antonio Brown, no Gronk, etc.

You can still be a 10-6 team without a star, though. We do have enough talent to be that good. I point more towards coaching as the issue, rather than lack of talent.

And I point towards the front office for the failing in the coaching department, too. The front office is supposed to set the culture and find the coach. Allen and Gruden both need to go.[/quote]

While I have been making the point for not enough talent, I agree with you about coaching as well. It seems to me that the Skins coaches never seem to make anyone outplay their contract. Other teams seems to take nobodys and make them into good players while the Skins struggle to get what talent the players have out of them. Gruden will be gone at the end of the season and it will be start over and rebuild. The wheels keep on spinning.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

Well on defense Allen and Payne are suppose to be elite players and hopefully will be. The book certainly isn't closed on those two. Josh Norman is suppose to be elite, he's being paid that way and he is an average player. Docston is suppose to be Aj Green and he is the 5th option on offense. Guice also can be an a great player but he's hurt. We just need a coaching staff that can get more out of these players. I miss Greg Williams.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1202626]I miss Greg Williams.[/quote]

I was thinking the same thing.

I would bet a paycheck that Gregg Williams could produce with this defensive roster.

The guy is a narcissist and probably a sociopath, and a hell of a D coordinator.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[QUOTE=Chico23231;1202582]Question, if talent isn't an issue...where do you rank our roster just within the division?



Eagles have a more talented roster...that's an easy one. I think the Giants roster is on par with ours. I think Offensive talent we are better the cowboys...but defensively I think they are equally talented, and maybe give the Cowboys a slight edge.



To say the talent isn't an issue, that's just ignorant....borderline stupid.



Callahan, Tomsula, Kotwica, randy Jordan...these are league-wide, well respected coaches.[/QUOTE]



I agree talent is a huge issue. WR? Nothing. RB? An old man and a kid who has never set foot on the field (it was addressed though so I will give it a pass). Interior o line - weak. Edge rusher - weak. Secondary - weak. TE- Reed is awesome for the three games he plays a year - and so that is another area of need. QB - don’t even get me started.
We have a couple O linemen and Trent is getting towards his twilight years, a couple stud D linemen, a RB yet to prove a damn thing. That is all I can think of that we have to build around. Yeah, like Chico said - to say talent isn’t an issue is borderline stupid.

Re: When is Enough, Enough? Bruce Allen Edition
 

[quote=DYoungJelly;1202628]

The guy is a narcissist and probably a sociopath, and a hell of a D coordinator.[/quote]

That's what i'm looking for in a D Coordinator.