O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

As we continue to beat our QB issue to death and debate players at WR, we have not spent a lot of time on another glaring need, O-Line. Shanny's focus on the offense should produce some changes along the line with a new starter at RT and possibly one at a Guard spot. I expect some new depth as well. If Manning is a Skin, Oline becomes even more important. Shanny like versatility on the line and obviously athleticism in his scheme.

Left Tackle: Trent "Silverblunt" Williams starter, Willie Smith back up. This is the one position we seem set. I expect Trent to grow as a player and Willie Smith provides excellent depth, able to play both LT and RT. I like this combo.

Left Guard: Kory L. starter, Mo Hurt back up. Kory just got tendered, but I think there could be change. First, Mo Hurt played pretty good his first year and I expect him to continue to provide excellent depth. Kory knee injury is very serious and he might not be able to get on the field until August. Between Kory and Chester, we could and should IMO see a new starter.

Center: Monty starter, Eric Cook back up. Monty just signed a real friendly contract and most likely will be starter for the new year. Im ok with that, he does a decent job at Center, horrible at Guard. Eric Cook needs to go immediately. Im in favor of spending a mid round pick for a Center for the future and I think the Skins may do that with a C/G versatile type player. SS has mentioned Philip Blake, [url=http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1664874/philip-blake]Philip Blake, Baylor, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com[/url], Id welcome him with open arms.

Right Guard: Chris Chester starter, Cook/Hurt at back up. Anybody else just feel underwhelmed with Chester's first year? Seemed very average after a fairly poor start to the season. I wouldnt mind him to stick around, but I wouldnt care if he left and is replaced by a free agent. Like I stated above, one Guard position most likely could have a replacement.

Right Tackle: Jamal Brown starter, Willie Smith back up. Brown run blocking is above average to good. Pass blocking, he tends to escort defenders to a meet and greet with our QB. He is done. Ideally, we need to spend a relatively high pick on a RT. If you look at the free agent tackle pool, its garbage. There are a ton of mid first round to late second round quality draft prospects. Id like us to add a Tackle draft pick, and then look to bring in a quality, inexpensive vet to compete with the rookie for the job. I believe Ryan Harris has been mentioned? He seems like that type of vet to bring in.

My ideal situation is offering Carl Nicks a nice contract to play Left Guard and drafting Mike Adams or Jon Martin for Right Tackle. Then taking a C/G player 4-5th round to play behind Monty and using a late round pick again on Tackle. Adding Ryan Harris or another vet signing at Tackle would be a smart move.

My starting Oline:

LT: Silverblunt
LG: Nicks
C: Monty
RG: Chester/Kory L
RT: Mike Adam (R)

Who do you like in the draft at Oline?

What/Where are the OL need(s) in your opinion?

Who is your top choice free agent at Oline?

Does Kory L. return?

What other questions should we be asking about the Oline?

Here is a good reference site: [url=http://www.footballsfuture.com/]2012 NFL Draft, NFL Combine results, Mock Draft, Forums, from Football's Future[/url]

Opinions and observations please

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

Nicks does NOT fit our system. He's is your simple small durable guard you look for on your OL.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the #1 thing that affects the performance of the O-line is the play of the QB behind it. The same O-line that couldn't keep Jason Campbell upright created huge running lanes and gave Todd Collins all the time he needed to make plays down the field.

Look at the Colts O-line last year without Peyton Manning under Center. And look what happened when John Beck played against one of the worst pass rushing teams in the NFL, the Bills. He was sacked 10 times. QBs that can make Defenders miss, don't hold onto the ball too long and can anticipate where the pressure is going to come from before the ball is snapped take a lot of pressue off their O-lines. QBs that punish the blitz like Kurt Warner did so well, make Defenses play in nickel and dime sets more often. Look how the Jets play Brady - 3 down linemen with 8 DBs.

I didn't get the sense that our QBs were under constant duress last year, and the running game looked pretty damn good late in the season even though we were missing starters on the O-line. Plus, there are ways to negate a good pass rush with play calling. Draw plays, screen passes, bootlegs, etc.

I laugh when people claim we have SO MANY holes. Every team has holes. The Giants were dead last in Rushing and the Pats were one of the worst Defenses in the league all year. Aaron Rodgers was one of the most sacked QBs in the league when they won it all, and so was Big Ben when one of the times they won it.

I have no doubt we'll add some pieces across the O-line and will find a WR either in Free Agency or the Draft, but until we get a legitimate starting QB, the team will appear to have more holes than it really does.

Besides, isn't Shanny known for making good O-lines out of middle to late round no-namers that fit his zone blocking scheme?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I definitely don't see Nicks here, too much $$ and not an ideal scheme fit. MS historically doesn't look for big names or spend big $$ on the interior.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I agree about QB can make the team better and seem like less holes, and agree QB is our biggest need, priority no 1.We have made improvements, but I still see Oline as a need. I think its been stated that Shanny is looking at Tackles first round and he took one a couple years ago at 4...so mid to late round yeah point, Id dont know bout that; maybe for the interior.

I dnt want nicks

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;891461]I dnt want nicks[/quote]

who do you want then?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I like what we have now, lots of young guys that can get better. I would like to get Cook out of our line up and replace him with a good young prospect. I thought that guy would be Eric Olsen, but the Saints stole him from us. I thought Polumbus showed he is a good prospect at RT, along with Willie Smith. If they add Ryan Harris and a mid round center prospect and I will be happy.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I wouldn't mind looking at Levi Brown OT for the Cardinals. Marcus McNeil is also worth a look.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

Lol @ "Silverblunt"

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

What about Grubbs from baltimore.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;891518]What about Grubbs from baltimore.[/quote]

he doesnt fit just like nicks

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;891520]he doesnt fit just like nicks[/quote]

Cult45, why dont you tell us who is a good fit at Guard from the FA class?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=Chico23231;891522]Cult45, why dont you tell us who is a good fit at Guard from the FA class?[/quote]

Mike Briesel, Evan Mathis, Samson Satele, Dan Connolly.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=Chico23231;891522]Cult45, why dont you tell us who is a good fit at Guard from the FA class?[/quote]

For real.

My take is that I'd like to see some depth in the interior. I think Kory L. was doing a good job when he got hurt. I would say the biggest need may be RT, I really didn't think Brown did that great of a job.

Oh and as a general comment for everyone [B]We get it, we ALL know that QB is the biggest need for the team, no reason to repeat it every time and every thread[/B] especially when we are trying to talk about other areas.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

It's interesting that a lot of teams supposedly talked to Rieff at the combine about playing guard

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;891529]It's interesting that a lot of teams supposedly talked to Rieff at the combine about playing guard[/quote]

Isn't the knock on Rieff that he plays too upright and stiff, which is less of a liability in a guard than in a tackle?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;891524[B]]Mike Briesel, Evan Mathis[/B], Samson Satele, Dan Connolly.[/quote]

Briesel and Mathis are def solid players. Wouldnt be mad about either one. Im just really concerned if we just stick with Kory L, that injury was tough.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

^ Yeah I mean you just don't know how a guys ACL is going to hold up the next year. Usually not good, but we'll see.

[QUOTE=44Deezel;891453]I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the #1 thing that affects the performance of the O-line is the play of the QB behind it. The same O-line that couldn't keep Jason Campbell upright created huge running lanes and gave Todd Collins all the time he needed to make plays down the field.

Look at the Colts O-line last year without Peyton Manning under Center. And look what happened when John Beck played against one of the worst pass rushing teams in the NFL, the Bills. He was sacked 10 times. QBs that can make Defenders miss, don't hold onto the ball too long and can anticipate where the pressure is going to come from before the ball is snapped take a lot of pressue off their O-lines. QBs that punish the blitz like Kurt Warner did so well, make Defenses play in nickel and dime sets more often. Look how the Jets play Brady - 3 down linemen with 8 DBs.

I didn't get the sense that our QBs were under constant duress last year, and the running game looked pretty damn good late in the season even though we were missing starters on the O-line. Plus, there are ways to negate a good pass rush with play calling. Draw plays, screen passes, bootlegs, etc.

I laugh when people claim we have SO MANY holes. Every team has holes. The Giants were dead last in Rushing and the Pats were one of the worst Defenses in the league all year. Aaron Rodgers was one of the most sacked QBs in the league when they won it all, and so was Big Ben when one of the times they won it.

I have no doubt we'll add some pieces across the O-line and will find a WR either in Free Agency or the Draft, but until we get a legitimate starting QB, the team will appear to have more holes than it really does.

Besides, isn't Shanny known for making good O-lines out of middle to late round no-namers that fit his zone blocking scheme?[/QUOTE]

I agree with this whole post. Our O-line may not be elite but a good qb behind it will make a decent line that much better.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

i agree we need a RT and an OG. send chester to the bench and brown to the unemployment line.

our line kinda got it together at the very end last year, but a quality tackle would be welcome.

we'd still need to get a QB, #1 WR and a DB (safety and/or #1 CB) first though in order of needs... I think the WR/RT have to be FAs since our draft will either send picks for RGIII or draft a guy claiborne at 6 and a QB in the 2nd round. you can get OG/Cs in the 3rd without too much trouble.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

LT-Williams
LG-DeCastro
C-Lichtensteiger/Montgomery (health issue for Lightensteiger)
RG-Chester
RT-Brown or Smith

I say drafting DeCastro after trading down is the way to go, best G since Steve Hutchinson. Rather have him than drafting a RT since Smith showed he could play. If you guys haven't seen DeCastro pull, I suggest you find a you tube video and watch him in action.

Another reason to draft him is to keep the Cowboys from drafting him, they would have one of the best young OL's if they do. I rather it be the Redskins.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=44Deezel;891453]I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the #1 thing that affects the performance of the O-line is the play of the QB behind it. The same O-line that couldn't keep Jason Campbell upright created huge running lanes and gave Todd Collins all the time he needed to make plays down the field.[/quote]I don't remember Todd Collins ever having a good game in the last four seasons.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=GTripp0012;891653]I don't remember Todd Collins ever having a good game in the last four seasons.[/quote]

Is there a point in there somewhere?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=SmootSmack;891529]It's interesting that a lot of teams supposedly talked to Rieff at the combine about playing guard[/quote]

Were the Skins one of those teams? Only thing I heard about Rieff was his stock has been dropping big time.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;891524]Mike Briesel, Evan Mathis, [B]Samson Satele[/B], Dan Connolly.[/quote]

Isn't he a CTR.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=Chico23231;891675]Were the Skins one of those teams? Only thing I heard about Rieff was his stock has been dropping big time.[/quote]

I don't know

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I would love to improve our oline this offseason. Id prefere to build through the draft but since im in the trade the world for RG3 camp then we will be short on early picks. Luckily shanny likes to generally use mid to late rounders on oline. This draft is actually rather deep at the gaurd position while being weak at tackle. Outside of ziebre sanders in the 2nd i doubt we will be able to find a starting RT in this draft even though i do believe RT is our biggest need. Nate potter in the late 3rd early 4th will need some development at RT but could also play gaurd in the mean time. Potter is also a good zbs fit. Alot of the gaurds in this draft are good zbs fits like kevin zietler 2/3rd, ben jones c/g 2/3rd, lucas nix 4/5th are all guys that i would like to grab if we can try and reaccumulate picks. Adam gettis is small but showed great athleticism at the combine with the fastest 40 and very long jumps, he might be worth a 6/7th round flier even though he could stand to put on a few extra pounds. Finally probably my favorite guy this year will be the already mentioned phillip blake. Again, if we trade up for RG3 then i fully believe drafting the same center he has alteady built a chemistry with the past few years will speed up his development. Before the senior bowl and combine i was hoping to grab him in the 5th round or so but i think his stock might have risen to possibly as high as the 3rx but i think he is safely in the 4th round discussion. He showed alot of athleticism along with power and good technique to not only fit the zbs as a center but even fill in at gaurd if need be. Tell me what you guys think, thanks!!!

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=NYCskinfan82;891689]Isn't he a CTR.[/quote]

Yeah, but Oakland moved him to guard this year with Stefan Wisnewski, and he did a very solid job there. He's basically Will Montgomery 2.0, but is slightly better at Guard than Will was.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=joeyt56;891717]I would love to improve our oline this offseason. Id prefere to build through the draft but since im in the trade the world for RG3 camp then we will be short on early picks. Luckily shanny likes to generally use mid to late rounders on oline. This draft is actually rather deep at the gaurd position while being weak at tackle. Outside of ziebre sanders in the 2nd i doubt we will be able to find a starting RT in this draft even though i do believe RT is our biggest need. [B]Nate potter[/B] in the late 3rd early 4th will need some development at RT but could also play gaurd in the mean time. Potter is also a good zbs fit. Alot of the gaurds in this draft are good zbs fits like [B]kevin zietler[/B] 2/3rd, ben jones c/g 2/3rd, lucas nix 4/5th are all guys that i would like to grab if we can try and reaccumulate picks. Adam gettis is small but showed great athleticism at the combine with the fastest 40 and very long jumps, he might be worth a 6/7th round flier even though he could stand to put on a few extra pounds. Finally probably my favorite guy this year will be the already mentioned [B]phillip blake[/B]. Again, if we trade up for RG3 then i fully believe drafting the same center he has alteady built a chemistry with the past few years will speed up his development. Before the senior bowl and combine i was hoping to grab him in the 5th round or so but i think his stock might have risen to possibly as high as the 3rx but i think he is safely in the 4th round discussion. He showed alot of athleticism along with power and good technique to not only fit the zbs as a center but even fill in at gaurd if need be. Tell me what you guys think, thanks!!![/quote]

In bold are the guys I think could be good picks. I think the RT position is pivotal and outside the obvious (which Im not gonna say RUskins) is our greatest need along with WR. If we get Manning, our first round pick [B]MUST[/B] be a RT. Philip Blake is the guy I want us to grab mid round as well.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

I'd take David Molk over Phillip Blake.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;891745]I'd take David Molk over Phillip Blake.[/quote]

is he big enough though to play Guard? I think Shanny gonna want that versatility.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=44Deezel;891664]Is there a point in there somewhere?[/quote]Well, sure. The point is that if the O-Line's performance in terms of protecting the quarterback is heavily dependent on who the quarterback is, and the idea is that we've seen this in recent Redskins history, then I would probably not suggest using Todd Collins as an example.

Here is why: Collins was last relevant in 2007, and the offensive line was pretty good in 2007. For Campbell and Collins. Since the offensive line declined, Collins did nothing on a football field to ever suggest he was the missing link in the Redskins pass protection.

I mean, really nothing. We're talking about like 25 pass attempts or something with a couple of awful sacks and fumbles. By Todd Collins. In mop up.

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story, I guess is the lesson here.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

Nicks is a wall. I'd sign him in heartbeat as we prepare to bring in a rookie hoping he develops. How does a DOMINANT blocker not fit out system?

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=Skins4L;895275]Nicks is a wall. I'd sign him in heartbeat as we prepare to bring in a rookie hoping he develops. How does a DOMINANT blocker not fit out system?[/quote]

I agree. I really don't care if Nicks doesn't fit your system. He's the best out there and we need some studs on the o-line. I'd sign him before I'd sign Jackson.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=skinsfan69;895305]I agree. I really don't care if Nicks doesn't fit your system. He's the best out there and we need some studs on the o-line. I'd sign him before I'd sign Jackson.[/quote]

As Matty stated, Shanahan isn't going to drop that kind of coin on a guard. Same thing with Meyers (C) in that we aren't going to give a interior OL a 8mil/year contract.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

As a free agent pickup at wide receiver, who would you guys rather have, Mario Manningham, Pierre Garcon, Vincent Jackson, or Marcus Colston? Reports have already surfaced that Mike Shanahan is going after Manningham.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

Garcon.

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

[quote=REDSKINS4ever;895370]As a free agent pickup at wide receiver, who would you guys rather have, Mario Manningham, Pierre Garcon, Vincent Jackson, or Marcus Colston? Reports have already surfaced that Mike Shanahan is going after Manningham.[/quote]

Garcon and Manningham are both inconsistent as hell, with Manningham being the worse of the two. I would rather have Vincent Jackson out of this group, but would have some sort of "character clause" in his contract in case he's suspended again. I really like Colston too, but injuries is a issue.

edit. Let's keep this topic to OL please. :)

Re: O-Line Edition: Free Agency and the Draft
 

i think vincent jackson would help griffin the most