China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Anyone heard of this?

BEIJING -- Just nine months before the Beijing Olympics, the Chinese government's news agency, Xinhua, reported that gymnast He Kexin was 13, which would have made her ineligible to be on the team that won a gold medal this week.

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer08/gymnastics/news/story?id=3534544&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines]ESPN - Earlier state media report listed gymnast He's age as 13 - Olympics[/url]

This would be an absolute shame, if it's true, because that would mean an entire country was cheating -- not just an individual. I can be almost certain this would be totally out of the question for any of the big 8 countries. The sad part is, I can't be so certain about China. If true, I think you have to bar China from future Olympics.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;464363]Anyone heard of this?

BEIJING -- Just nine months before the Beijing Olympics, the Chinese government's news agency, Xinhua, reported that gymnast He Kexin was 13, which would have made her ineligible to be on the team that won a gold medal this week.

[URL="http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer08/gymnastics/news/story?id=3534544&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines"]ESPN - Earlier state media report listed gymnast He's age as 13 - Olympics[/URL]

This would be an absolute shame, if it's true, because that would mean an entire country was cheating -- not just an individual. I can be almost certain this would be totally out of the question for any of the big 8 countries. The sad part is, I can't be so certain about China. If true, I think you have to bar China from future Olympics.[/quote]

If its true then the whole world should be ashamed of being beat by a bunch of kids. JK

I did hear about it and am aware of the advantages. On the other hand I really could care less. China has their strong events and we have ours.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

We should make Phelps to gymnastics. That'll learn em'

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Is there an advantage for being younger in gymnastics? I don't get the big deal, but I guess I don't really care about the Olympics either which makes my apathy make sense.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Yeah I am not so sure what advantage it gives them other than it increases their pool of potnetials but I do have zero doubt that at least a few of those girls were no more than 14. Tops.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[quote=Duffman003;464762]Is there an advantage for being younger in gymnastics? I don't get the big deal, but I guess I don't really care about the Olympics either which makes my apathy make sense.[/quote]
According to the first link in Google:
[quote]Younger, and therefore smaller, gymnasts have the advantage of being able to perform difficult skills easier.[/quote][url]http://www.hollywoodgrind.com/chinese-olympic-gymnasts-underage-scandal/[/url]

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

"if" it's true?

have you seen them? if you said they were 10 i wouldn't blink. they did the forensics on facial features and came up with 12 to 14.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

is there a hidden message here?

[quote]Chinese authorities insist that all three are old enough to compete. [B]He[/B] [I]herself [/I]told reporters after Wednesday's final that "my real age is 16. I don't pay any attention to what everyone says."[/quote]

[quote]A May 23 story in the China Daily newspaper, the official English-language paper of the Chinese government, said [B]He[/B] was 14. The story was later corrected to list [I]her[/I] as 16.[/quote]

where the f was the editor?

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=That Guy;465173]is there a hidden message here?





where the f was the editor?[/QUOTE][B]He[/B] is [I]her[/I] name.

[QUOTE]Just nine months before the Beijing Olympics, the Chinese government's news agency, Xinhua, reported that gymnast [B]He Kexin [/B]was 13, which would have made her ineligible to be on the team that won a gold medal this week.[/QUOTE]

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=That Guy;465173]is there a hidden message here?





where the f was the editor?[/QUOTE]

Haha, good one.

I think to speculate about what advantage may or may not be gained through lying about age is to miss the point. They violated the rules. It's like questioning if 3 year olds really have the best chance to win the Kentucky Derby - completely irrelevant because that's the age they have to be.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=djnemo65;465183]Haha, good one.

I think to speculate about what advantage may or may not be gained through lying about age is to miss the point. They violated the rules. It's like questioning if 3 year olds really have the best chance to win the Kentucky Derby - completely irrelevant because that's the age they have to be.[/QUOTE]

That would only matter if it was the US that had cheated this way. Otherwise it is fine. Just our sour grapes.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Did anyone see the pommel horse final yesterday?

The competitors get two attempts and their final score is the average of the two.

So, the US girl lands twice and takes a step or two for minor deductions. The Chinese girl falls on one of her attempts. Yet, she somehow got bronze, and the US girl got 4th. :confused:

Not saying this is China's fault. Just some shitty judging if you ask me.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=GhettoDogAllStars;465192]Did anyone see the pommel horse final yesterday?

The competitors get two attempts and their final score is the average of the two.

So, the US girl lands twice and takes a step or two for minor deductions. The Chinese girl falls on one of her attempts. Yet, she somehow got bronze, and the US girl got 4th. :confused:

Not saying this is China's fault. Just some shitty judging if you ask me.[/QUOTE]

Are you talking about the vault? 'Cause that was effed up.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Yeah - Bela Karolyi was fired up about that.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;465192]Did anyone see the pommel horse final yesterday?

The competitors get two attempts and their final score is the average of the two.

So, the US girl lands twice and takes a step or two for minor deductions. The Chinese girl falls on one of her attempts. Yet, she somehow got bronze, and the US girl got 4th. :confused:

Not saying this is China's fault. Just some shitty judging if you ask me.[/quote]

Her name is Alicia Sacramone, she is smokin hot! [IMG]http://www.faniq.com/images/blog/Picture%2038(6).png[/IMG]

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Yeah, it was vault. My bad... can't keep the names straight -- d'oh!

And yeah stacks, she is pretty hot ... gotta thick neck, but still hot nonetheless.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=GhettoDogAllStars;465232]Yeah, it was vault. My bad... can't keep the names straight -- d'oh!

And yeah stacks, she is pretty hot ... gotta thick neck, but still hot nonetheless.[/QUOTE]

I was a little ticked that the North Korean won the gold despite clearly committing a violation by landing outside the designated area. She had at least one foot out of bounds and the second was on the line.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

They said on the line is in, so she got one foot in (still a deduction, but not as bad).

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;465263]I was a little ticked that the North Korean won the gold despite clearly committing a violation by landing outside the designated area. She had at least one foot out of bounds and the second was on the line.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, the judges really screwed up on that event.

It seems like they try to make the scoring as objective as possible, but for some reason it's just not consistent. It makes it really confusing and frustrating to watch. It sounded like Bela Karolyi was almost about to cry, he was so disappointed.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[quote=GhettoDogAllStars;465192]Did anyone see the pommel horse final yesterday?

The competitors get two attempts and their final score is the average of the two.

So, the US girl lands twice and takes a step or two for minor deductions. The Chinese girl falls on one of her attempts. Yet, she somehow got bronze, and the US girl got 4th. :confused:

Not saying this is China's fault. Just some shitty judging if you ask me.[/quote]

I saw this.

The American girl did 2 clean vaults, MAYBE a slight hope on one landing but it still looked clean.

The Chinese girl did a vault and landed on her butt! Still ahead of the U.S.

The German lady (33 YO) did the same vault twice in a row and while they were done well, were the same vault! Finished ahead of the U.S.

The other girl (Korea?) landed out of bounds once and on the line on the second vault. What happened? Finished ahead of the U.S.



On top of the Chinese cheating, it looks like the judges are corrupt too.

It's so frustrating watching any event that is judged rather than scored or timed.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

I don't really think it is a Chinese conspiracy or anything. I just think the Olympics have some issues they need to work out with judging and scoring. I didn't follow it closely, but I remember some judging controversies with ice skating a few years back.

You're right Buster -- I had never really though about it, but scored and timed events are much more ideal. I think that's what the IOC tried to do with gymnastics, but it doesn't seem to be working as it should.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

The new scoring system removed all limits to cheating.

Before, there was a max score, a "perfect 10". Now, there is no maximum possible score. Judges can give more points to a gymnast after scoring a technically perfect routine. This also leaves the possibility for "corrections" to previous scoring mistakes they realize they may have made, but will only benefit some of the gymnasts.

At least before, there could be a tie for the top. Now, all they have to do is give a certain performer they favor .001 points more so they win, which they can do without a 0-10 scoring system.

Basically, the judges can now pull random scores out of their butts without any restrictions.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[QUOTE=Buster;465421]The new scoring system removed all limits to cheating.

Before, there was a max score, a "perfect 10". Now, there is no maximum possible score. Judges can give more points to a gymnast after scoring a technically perfect routine. This also leaves the possibility for "corrections" to previous scoring mistakes they realize they may have made, but will only benefit some of the gymnasts.

At least before, there could be a tie for the top. Now, all they have to do is give a certain performer they favor .001 points more so they win, which they can do without a 0-10 scoring system.

Basically, the judges can now pull random scores out of their butts without any restrictions.[/QUOTE]
Not totally sure but I don't think they can award more than 10 points for execution. Each routine gets and A and a B score. One is for diffculty and one is for execution. So if you do a 7.5 vault and land on your ass (say a .8 deduction) then you'd get and 16.7 score (7.5+10-.8).

But how they score the execution is essentially subjective as well as how they judge the actual difficulty. If the routine starts at a 7.5 but the performer fails to connect certain elements properly or doesn't actually do an element that counted towards the 7.5 then the 7.5 can be reduced also.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Take a look at how the Olympics score track and field:

[url=http://cosmicvariance.com/2008/08/19/the-hidden-complexity-of-the-olympics/]The Hidden Complexity of the Olympics | Cosmic Variance[/url]

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Here's some interesting research into He's real age:
[url=http://strydehax.blogspot.com/2008/08/hack-olympics.html]Stryde Hax: Hack the Olympics![/url]
[url=http://strydehax.blogspot.com/2008/08/olympic-hacking-part-ii-lets-go-for.html]Stryde Hax: Olympic Hacking Part II - Let's go for the Gold[/url]

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

So now they're going to "investigate" this stuff based on that guys findings. Although this sorta seems like a BS investigation when they make comments like "We believe the matter will be put to rest and there's no question ... on the eligibility".

The biggest laod of crap was this little nugget from the cheating coach "It's not just me. The parents of our athletes are all very indignant," Lu said. "They have faced groundless suspicion. Why aren't they believed? Why are their children suspected? Their parents are very angry."

Are these the same parents that none of the children have seen for over a year? The same parents that were so isolated from their children that the gymnasts didn't even know if they had attended the games to see them compete?'

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

Yes, being a gymnast in China is equivalent to being in a boarding school. They are taken from their families.

Re: China Suspected of Foul Play in Olympic Gymnastics
 

[URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/02/AR2008080201271.html"]WP just ran an article[/URL] on China's "sports schools". IMO, they can have the medal count if this is what it takes to "compete".