Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=wolfeskins;578871]campbell [B]does[/B] need to pick up his play, plain and simple. some people on here like to make excuses for him, the o-line was not perfect, the play calling was not perfect, the receivers routs were not perfect, the weather was not perfect and on and on. bottom line is things are not gonna be perfect, including campbell's play, but he does need to show some improvement. i know he hasn't played much and it's only preseason but he needs to step it up.[/quote]

Its not just on here excuses are being made. How long can Zorn and Campbell keep it up with the excuses. Until the team has more discipiline and Zorns steps up to the plate and takes the reins, what are you really going to expect.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

I only care about winning. If Campbell can take care of the ball and manage the offense well enough for us to win then I'm fine with him as our QB. If not, he needs to go.

I have no illusions about his capabilities. Best case, he can probably play at the level Trent Dilfer did with the Ravens when they rode their defense to a Super Bowl win. Like that team, we'll need to win with our defense.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;578920]I only care about winning. If Campbell can take care of the ball and manage the offense well enough for us to win then I'm fine with him as our QB. If not, he needs to go.

I have no illusions about his capabilities. Best case, he can probably play at the level Trent Dilfer did with the Ravens when they rode their defense to a Super Bowl win. Like that team, we'll need to win with our defense.[/quote]

Couldn't agree more. I'm emotionally indifferent to whoever lines up over center. I just want that person to be successful, woever they are, and agree that JC could do enough (or avoid enough mistakes) to win the Super Bowl assuming we have a dominant defense, running game and pass protection. I have serious doubts he can do much more and haven't seen anything from him to make me think he could actually "carry" the team on his back if it became necessary. But then again, we all know what happened to Dilfer after he won the Super Bowl. We've also seen guys like Brian Griese throw 19TDs against 4 INTs only to become a career back-up. There are only 10-15 QBs who are likely to be starters their entire careers. You have to be special to have that kind of job security.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=Chico23231;578780]Good point, the strong suit of the offense is the run blocking and Portis getting consistent positive yards...that was reassuring.

I did like the attempts down the field, that first one Kelly had beat coverage, JC waited a little late to let it go...next week will be crucial to see progress in the offense. We will get a chance to see if offense can get some rhythm. [B]3 points for the starting offense in two preseason games does not show the kinda growth I expect at this point.[/B][/quote]

I'm not thrilled with the output by the first team offense thus far either, but the reality is, it has only been four-five series against two of the best defenses in the league (one of them THE best). In a regular season game against these teams, I wouldn't expect to score on every drive. I'd expect some three and outs, a decent drive here and there, and not a lot of points. That is pretty much what has happened.

I think a lot of people are jumping the gun here. Let's see what happens in week 1 and then can get excited about it.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=Chico23231;578780]

I did like the attempts down the field, that first one Kelly had beat coverage, JC waited a little late to let it go...next week will be crucial to see progress in the offense. We will get a chance to see if offense can get some rhythm. 3 points for the starting offense in two preseason games does not show the kinda growth I expect at this point.[/quote]
He threw it on his third hitch step, but short because he miscalculated Kelly's speed.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=44Deezel;578935]Couldn't agree more. I'm emotionally indifferent to whoever lines up over center. I just want that person to be successful, woever they are, and agree that JC could do enough (or avoid enough mistakes) to win the Super Bowl assuming we have a dominant defense, running game and pass protection. I have serious doubts he can do much more and haven't seen anything from him to make me think he could actually "carry" the team on his back if it became necessary. But then again, we all know what happened to Dilfer after he won the Super Bowl. We've also seen guys like Brian Griese throw 19TDs against 4 INTs only to become a career back-up. There are only 10-15 QBs who are likely to be starters their entire careers. You have to be special to have that kind of job security.[/quote]

Great post. Of course, if JC could turn it on like Rypien did in 91, say, that wouldn't hurt either, with this D ;).

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

How many regular season games would you give Campbell to show he deserves to be the starter?

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=insideman;578915]Its not just on here excuses are being made. How long can Zorn and Campbell keep it up with the excuses. Until the team has more discipiline and Zorns steps up to the plate and takes the reins, what are you really going to expect.[/quote]

Considering last season and what we have seen so far its pretty obvious that the Skins woud be incredibly lucky to have JC turn out like Dilfer. I dont think he will even get to that level. I think Zorn will stick with JC no matter what and it likely will cost him his job.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

JC is already better than Dilfer.

Let's look at Qb rating, shall we? Dilfer had a career rating around 70. Only twice in his career did he have years with ratings above 80. In the Super Bowl season of 2000, his rating was 76.6.

JC has a career qb rating of 80. Last year JC had a rating of 84. JC's worst rating was 76, the same as Dilfer's Super Bowl year rating.

So, as we see, in his worst year JC was better than Dilfer was on average for his entire career. JC's worst year coincides in terms of ratings with Dilfer's Super Bowl year.

Let's get some real perspective on JC, please.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

Dilfer sucked, but had the stifling D. We do not have a stifling D.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

I keep hearing people say all we need for Jason Campbell to do is manage the game. Then they go on to point to the Ravens stellar Super Bowl defensive unit as evidence that you can win championships in the NFL with a mediocre quarterback and a top notch defense. While that may be true, it's the exception and not the rule in the NFL.

I think that logic is flawed on two fronts. First, that Raven's defensive unit could arguably go down as the most dominate defensive unit of all time. Possibly. We're talking a few Hall of Famers on that team too. In no way does the Redskins current defensive unit resemble that Ravens Super Bowl team.

Secondly, isn't that what the Redskins were doing last year anyway. Get a lead and sit on it? It's not that Jason can't manage a game, the offense just became too predictable down the stretch. I don't care how well you manage a game in the NFL, you still need more points than the other team. The Ravens Super Bowl defensive unit could actually score touchdowns when the offense didn't. If the Redskins can't put up more than 21 points per game this year, I don't care how much Campbell has improved we won't win that many games.

The two starting quarterbacks in last year's Super Bowl, had more fumbles and lost fumbles than Jason Campbell. Campbell had a total of 7 fumbles last season and lost only one. Roughly half the number he had the previous year. Big Ben had 14 fumbles last season and lost seven. Kurt Warner had 11 fumbles and lost seven. I think it's worth noting that Campbell only had six interceptions as well. Compared to Warner and Big Ben, Campbell is taking care of the ball.

So it's not just about managing the game, but managing the momentum of the game. Campbell needs to take more risks with the ball and let the chips fall where they may. Now whether that's a coaching decision or a Jason Campbell decision, I don't know. But we will soon find out.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

Ah, what would we do in DC without a QB controversy?

JC has to win games. I know that's trite and obvious, but there you have it. However he manages to do that, fine. If it's Dilfer-like and we win, great. If it's more gunslinger, also great. Most likely it's between the two. Taking risks is all well and good, but TOs kill ya. But not taking shots kills ya too. What a world.

Here's my feeling about any controversy: Collins is a passable backup, but he does not have the arm to win for us. I don't know if Zorn "Loves JC"--he's stuck with him, IMO. So trying to keep his spirits up, shield him in the press, whatever. I assume that behind closed doors he is doing whatever he can to get JC better. It's really his only hope: Collins can come in for a few wins at best, but that's it. It's JC or bust this year.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=Counter-Tre;578978]How many regular season games would you give Campbell to show he deserves to be the starter?[/quote]

At this rate 2 or 3. I think thats enough games for him to show something and yet still early enough to salvage the season.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

I'm not really convinced that that QB rating is the absolute best way to measure QB's.

that said, dilfer sucked. I mean, come on.

Re: "Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"
 

[quote=That Guy;578993]I'm not really convinced that that QB rating is the absolute best way to measure QB's.

that said, dilfer sucked. I mean, come on.[/quote]

Fair enough. I was trying to keep the post relatively short so I used ratings rather than trotting out tons of different stats.

You summarized the point well.