Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=88Commanders00;1367054]I bet you the gop get rids of the fill buster if the Dems fillibustering stops or slow downs Trump agenda.[/quote]

I'll take that bet.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Giantone;1367055]The one thing the GOP has never been smart at is realizing that some of the dumb stuff they do always comes back to bite them in the ass.[/quote]

Jeez this is literally the complete opposite of what has happened in the last 20 years. I mean seriously. Dems always accused the GOP that they would sink the filibuster and then Harry Ried decided to do it despite McConnel warning him it would come back to haunt him and sooner than he could imagine. And that is exactly what happened. McConnel again is opposing the ending of the last bit of the filibuster and although no longer the leader he retains the support to stop any dumping of it by MAGA. So, for at least 2 years the filibuster is safe (if MAGA strengthens their position in 2026 then all bets are off).

You guys just can't admit you were wrong about Sinema. She saved the Dems asses because she had what the rest of her colleagues didn't - foresight. Oh, and she also saved the Dems from their stupid court expansion scheme. It would be 13 Justices now if they had succeeded and Trump would have responded by adding 5-10 more (of the most extreme variety).

We will have imo opinion a Russian agent in charge the next four years, but if the Dems had their way the even limited checks on him that are in place wouldn't be there.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

I am not a fan of Simena and frankly don't care whether she saves the dems asses because they get what they deserve. Her voting record has been anti civil liberties, anti environment which by default means bad for the economy so she really doesn't have the interest of Americans.

As for the filibuster I agree with 88. McConnel has 0 influence over the senate anymore and even if he did he would gladly get rid of the the filibuster. He is part of the reason our government is for the corporations and not for the people so I doubt he would do anything other than pushing his agenda through.

I am willing to let Trump push through his agenda it will go one of two ways a. it will be an abysmal failure for the American people like his first term was and he will get owned by the likes of Biden or whoever the dems are dumb enough to put up in 2028 or b. he actually does something that will benefit the American people and I will gladly eat some crow.

Are there other possibilities? Sure but those are the two most probable.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=nonniey;1367058]Jeez this is literally the complete opposite of what has happened in the last 20 years. I mean seriously. Dems always accused the GOP that they would sink the filibuster and then Harry Ried decided to do it despite McConnel warning him it would come back to haunt him and sooner than he could imagine. And that is exactly what happened. McConnel again is opposing the ending of the last bit of the filibuster and although no longer the leader he retains the support to stop any dumping of it by MAGA. So, for at least 2 years the filibuster is safe (if MAGA strengthens their position in 2026 then all bets are off).

1)You guys just can't admit you were wrong about Sinema. She saved the Dems asses because she had what the rest of her colleagues didn't - foresight. Oh, and 2) she also saved the Dems from their stupid court expansion scheme. It would be 13 Justices now if they had succeeded and Trump would have responded by adding 5-10 more (of the most extreme variety).

[B]We will have imo opinion a Russian agent in charge the next four years,[/B] but if the Dems had their way the even limited checks on him that are in place wouldn't be there.[/quote]
1)Not a Dem to start.

2)She didn't stop the expansion of the SC Biden said he wouldn't do it when he was campaigning the last time so there is that

3)trump is a Russian agent.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

We have reached the “trump is a Russian agent” level of cope.

Lololololol

I just went to Reddit and they have 3 front page threads/conspiracy theories of how trump stole the election, trump cheated and my favorite: the election machines were hacked and results changed

So basically just like 2016 when he won the first time

Reddit never change

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1367070]I am not a fan of Simena and frankly don't care whether she saves the dems asses because they get what they deserve. Her voting record has been anti civil liberties, anti environment which by default means bad for the economy so she really doesn't have the interest of Americans.

As for the filibuster I agree with 88. McConnel has 0 influence over the senate anymore and even if he did he would gladly get rid of the the filibuster. He is part of the reason our government is for the corporations and not for the people so I doubt he would do anything other than pushing his agenda through.

I am willing to let Trump push through his agenda it will go one of two ways a. it will be an abysmal failure for the American people like his first term was and he will get owned by the likes of Biden or whoever the dems are dumb enough to put up in 2028 or b. he actually does something that will benefit the American people and I will gladly eat some crow.

Are there other possibilities? Sure but those are the two most probable.[/quote]

If you think McConnel would gladly end the filibuster or has 0 influence in the Senate then you don't have even a teaspoon of knowledge about McConnel. McConnel although he retaliated against Reid for ending the filibuster for Judicial appointments has always been the champion of the filibuster. If Ried hadn't done what he did the Dems would have had more Justices on the court.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367094]We have reached the “trump is a Russian agent” level of cope.

Lololololol

I just went to Reddit and they have 3 front page threads/conspiracy theories of how trump stole the election, trump cheated and my favorite: the election machines were hacked and results changed

So basically just like 2016 when he won the first time

Reddit never change[/quote]

Reached it?? I've had that opinion of him since his first go around.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

I predicted that Trump would win the election and understand that people thought he did a decent job at least his first three years in office, particularly on pocketbook issues, which have been impacted by the Covid spending of both Trump and Biden the past few years.

Doesn't mean that I'm not disappointed that GOP voters chose him overwhelmingly over DeSantis and Haley, especially after J6.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=nonniey;1367349]If you think McConnel would gladly end the filibuster or has 0 influence in the Senate then you don't have even a teaspoon of knowledge about McConnel. McConnel although he retaliated against Reid for ending the filibuster for Judicial appointments has always been the champion of the filibuster. If Ried hadn't done what he did the Dems would have had more Justices on the court.[/quote]

Considering he wants corruption in campaign finances and refused to do anything about dark money influencing our government, I can't see why you have a modicum of faith in him.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=hail2commanders;1367359]I predicted that Trump would win the election and understand that people thought he did a decent job at least his first three years in office, particularly on pocketbook issues, which have been impacted by the Covid spending of both Trump and Biden the past few years.

Doesn't mean that I'm not disappointed that GOP voters chose him overwhelmingly over DeSantis and Haley, especially after J6.[/quote]

I am going to disagree with you on the pocket book issues:

The TCJA is highly regressive and favors owners of capital instead of workers.

He removed regulations that defended overtime pay and removed regulations that prevented tips from being taken by employers. This alone cost workers 12 billion a year.

Required arbitration between employers and employees instead of allowing them to go to court

Removing regulations on workplace illness and injury.

Removing the individual mandate of the ACA caused an immediate increase of 3 million uninsured with expectations to be 13 million by 2026. Out of pocket increases will be $33 billion.

I think there was a perception he is better economically but it just doesn't jive

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1367374]
I think there was a perception he is better economically but it just doesn't jive[/quote]

Yeah Balt, unfortunately perceptions win the day.

Kind of like when people ask how the economy is and 75 percent say it sucks, but when you ask how they are doing personally and the same 75 percent say "great!" Makes no sense.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[url]https://youtu.be/FN3q8jZ04_E?si=K9P8shDEvJsABbh0[/url]

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[url]https://www.politico.com/news/2024/11/10/biden-step-down-appoint-harris-jamal-simmons-argues-00188633[/url]

Biden should step down and let Harris finish his term, Jamal Simmons argues


Lolololol please do this. She’s never earned a thing and would be on brand. Democrats are very unserious people.

I see the corporate media and some Dems were trying to bully Sotomeyer off the court before Trump came in…that would have been another disaster.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=88Commanders00;1367383][url]https://youtu.be/FN3q8jZ04_E?si=K9P8shDEvJsABbh0[/url][/quote]

Burr was pretty good.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1367374]

[B]Removing the individual mandate of the ACA caused an immediate increase of 3 million uninsured with expectations to be 13 million by 2026. Out of pocket increases will be $33 billion.[/B]

I think there was a perception he is better economically but it just doesn't jive[/quote]

I believe had the Dems pushed this that could have made a difference.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1367374]I am going to disagree with you on the pocket book issues:

The TCJA is highly regressive and favors owners of capital instead of workers.

He removed regulations that defended overtime pay and removed regulations that prevented tips from being taken by employers. This alone cost workers 12 billion a year.

Required arbitration between employers and employees instead of allowing them to go to court

Removing regulations on workplace illness and injury.

[B]Removing the individual mandate of the ACA caused an immediate increase of 3 million uninsured with expectations to be 13 million by 2026. Out of pocket increases will be $33 billion.[/B]

I think there was a perception he is better economically but it just doesn't jive[/quote]

Were do you get your so called facts.


Uninsured Americans on the rise, as 27 million don't have healthcare. WASHINGTON (TND) — The CDCsaid the number of Americans without health insurance has gone up so far in 2024, breaking a streak of record low-figures.Aug 6, 2024

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Fishingfool;1367472]Were do you get your so called facts.


Uninsured Americans on the rise, as 27 million don't have healthcare. WASHINGTON (TND) — The CDCsaid the number of Americans without health insurance has gone up so far in 2024, breaking a streak of record low-figures.Aug 6, 2024[/quote]

I don't know how many people from that list is due to removing components of the ACA and rolling out the ACHA in 2017/18 but it could mean there were bigger loses than estimated during his first term.

[url]https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53300[/url]

[url]https://www.epi.org/publication/the-33-billion-hidden-tax-in-the-american-health-care-act-higher-deductibles-and-copays/[/url]

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367422]Burr was pretty good.[/quote]

LOL........................

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/g8AlYGN.png[/IMG]

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[B][SIZE="5"]WTF???[/SIZE][/B]


[url]https://apnews.com/[/url]


Associated Press
Trump's defense choice stuns the Pentagon and raises questions about the Fox News host's experience


By nominating Pete Hegseth, Trump is tapping someone largely inexperienced and untested on the global stage to take over the world’s most powerful military.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367419][url]https://www.politico.com/news/2024/11/10/biden-step-down-appoint-harris-jamal-simmons-argues-00188633[/url]

Biden should step down and let Harris finish his term, Jamal Simmons argues


Lolololol please do this. She’s never earned a thing and would be on brand. Democrats are very unserious people.

I see the corporate media and some Dems were trying to bully Sotomeyer off the court before Trump came in…that would have been another disaster.[/quote]

I read that article the incredibly woke are doing such a disservice. As for Sotomayor. They really think they could fast track a supreme court nominee at the end of Biden's term during a lame duck period? It took them over a year to get their last nominee through. Morons

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=nonniey;1366867]Main culprits in the Dem loss aren't Republicans. The loss is primarily on Biden for deciding to run for reelection in the first place followed by Harris for moving left (ie Walsh pick) when she already had the perception of being too far left and the Dems in general for not comprehending wokeness is intensely disliked by many of the minorities they had relied on (That trans commercial saying she was for They/Them and Trump was for you was extremely effective).[/quote]


Holy shit. You pretty much nailed it here. A big takeaway from this is Biden's decision to run again. That should have never happened at the age of 80. My guess is it's his family that talked him into that bullshit. It was obvious that man didn't need to be running anything, but retired and spending time with his family.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

My thoughts on this election.

People want to point to one thing as being the key thing that killed the Dems this election but it really is a mix of factors.


1) Economy. People blamed the Biden admin for inflation, even though it wasn't his fault, much like it's not Trump's fault for covid. Biden/Harris didn't do a good job relaying that information to voters. He was too busy bragging about the bridges being built with the Infrastructure plan.

2) Immigration. A 20 point swing from latino men over to Trump, knowing he wants a mass deportation. Tells me that many of the legal latins here are mad about people jumping the line, while they had to wait their turn. I just hope they don't cry when many of their family members get deported. Biden also fucked up waiting till June 2024 to initiate the executive order that essentially halted the border crossings. Why not in year 1? Dumb move.

3) Perception of wokeness. Dems haven't used the whole pro-noun or defund the police bullshit in a couple years, but that doesn't mean the stench of it hasn't resided. That ad with the they/them was brutal and affective. According to some test panels, it swayed voters in those groups by 2.5%. That's enough to win an election, especially if it's close. Whoever is coming up with this shit need to be fired and never be allowed to work in politics again.


Biden really screwed the pooch running again. My guess it was his family that talked him into this bullshit and his ego wouldn't allow him to just pull out. It had to take the Dem party to yank his ass kicking and screaming to replace him. We better than Pelosi and crew for doing it because this election wouldn't have been remotely close if Biden had ran. There was a reason Trump was begging to have him back. If Biden had stayed, you probably are looking at losing all those 5 swing state senators as well.

Say what you will, but Harris ran a very good campaign giving the fact she was only given 100 days to run it. She pulled up those horrendous numbers to dead even with Trump and did it in only 100 days. Biden just simply waited too late for the Dems to have a chance.

There were two major errors from her and they were major:

1) She said she wouldn't have done anything different while on the View. Her job was to separate herself from Biden, she failed to do that b/c she didn't want to throw him under the bus. It cost her.

2) Her campaign not responding to the Trangender ad. According to reports, Bill Clinton himself told her campaign that they needed to respond to it, and they completely ignored it. Major fuckup.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367419][url]https://www.politico.com/news/2024/11/10/biden-step-down-appoint-harris-jamal-simmons-argues-00188633[/url]

Biden should step down and let Harris finish his term, Jamal Simmons argues


Lolololol please do this. She’s never earned a thing and would be on brand. Democrats are very unserious people.

I see the corporate media and some Dems were trying to bully Sotomeyer off the court before Trump came in…that would have been another disaster.[/quote]


That's an insult to Harris. She wouldn't do it anyway. Also, you keep saying that she hasn't earned anything, but you do realize she had to win elections for DA/AG/Senator/VP?? You daft or just trolling Punch? Hard to tell.

Dems got the RBG flashbacks with Sotomeyer, but it really doesn't make a bit of difference. What the fuck is the difference between 7-2 and 6-3 in conservative favor. They aren't going to rule your way in any scenario. Maybe these fucks should have showed up back in 2016. They still not learning lessons.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=nonniey;1367058]Jeez this is literally the complete opposite of what has happened in the last 20 years. I mean seriously. Dems always accused the GOP that they would sink the filibuster and then Harry Ried decided to do it despite McConnel warning him it would come back to haunt him and sooner than he could imagine. And that is exactly what happened. McConnel again is opposing the ending of the last bit of the filibuster and although no longer the leader he retains the support to stop any dumping of it by MAGA. So, for at least 2 years the filibuster is safe (if MAGA strengthens their position in 2026 then all bets are off).[/quote]

With John Thune possibly becoming senate leader you might be right about the filibuster staying in place for a republican he is relatively pragmatic

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1367821]With John Thune possibly becoming senate leader you might be right about the filibuster staying in place for a republican he is relatively pragmatic[/quote]

The fact of the matter is this: Republicans have protected the filibuster while all democrats have attacked it sans 2 folks.

The filibuster should remain in place. Major legislation need a clear majority

I’ve already heard lying democrats saying now we need for it to remain and suddenly it’s not a racist relic anymore.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1367582]That's an insult to Harris. She wouldn't do it anyway. Also, you keep saying that she hasn't earned anything, but you do realize she had to win elections for DA/AG/Senator/VP?? You daft or just trolling Punch? Hard to tell.

Dems got the RBG flashbacks with Sotomeyer, but it really doesn't make a bit of difference. What the fuck is the difference between 7-2 and 6-3 in conservative favor. They aren't going to rule your way in any scenario. Maybe these fucks should have showed up back in 2016. They still not learning lessons.[/quote]

I’m not gonna get into her rise in California, but it clearly wasn’t earned. In the primary when she ran, she didn’t get a vote. Clyburn installed her as VP as a condition for endorsement to Biden which was the deciding factor to overcome Bernie Sanders. It was only because of her race unfortunately, but this was the condition of a Clyburn/Obama decision.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367825]I’m not gonna get into her rise in California, but it clearly wasn’t earned. In the primary when she ran, she didn’t get a vote. Clyburn installed her as VP as a condition for endorsement to Biden which was the deciding factor to overcome Bernie Sanders. It was only because of her race unfortunately, but this was the condition of a Clyburn/Obama decision.[/quote]

Her rise? She was voted in by the people Chico. She didn't sleep with every single voter if that is what you are implying. Every single stage she was voted in by the people. Admit she earned it. Period. She was more qualified to be those spots than JD was for his.

Bernie Sanders wasn't going to win jack shit. Progressive left have some popular ideas and some not-so popular ideas. You aren't going to win elections calling yourself a democratic socialist. Period. People don't understand the difference and you just get labeled a socialist.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

An excellent article by SE Cupp.

[url]https://tribunecontentagency.com/article/s-e-cupp-dems-blame-everything-but-themselves-for-losing/[/url]

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[B][SIZE="5"]Trump Judge Blocks Overtime Pay For 4 Million Workers[/SIZE][/B]



I wonder how many who voted for trump this will effect .

[url]https://news.yahoo.com/news/trump-judge-blocks-overtime-pay-212709546.html[/url]

On Friday a federal judge in Texas struck down a new rule from the Biden administration aimed at extending overtime protections to millions of workers.

Judge Sean D. Jordan of the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas ruled that the Labor Department went beyond its authority in issuing the regulation earlier this year. He granted summary judgment to the state of Texas, which had sued to stop the rule from taking effect.

The overtime rule is one of the furthest-reaching economic reforms that President Joe Biden has pursued unilaterally through the federal rulemaking process. It would dramatically expand the share of workers who are entitled to time-and-a-half pay when they work more than 40 hours in a week.

But thanks to court battles like the one in Texas, the regulation’s future was in doubt even before Donald Trump, who has broadly promised to undo Biden’s agenda, won the presidential election.

Jordan, who Trump nominated to the bench in 2019 during his first term in the White House, had temporarily blocked the overtime rule from moving forward in Texas in June. His latest order halts the regulation across the country, leaving the current, stricter overtime rules intact.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Coff;1366967]Trump has no intention to carry out the mass deportations, imho. Like the wall, it’s just a ruse to drum up support among those easily manipulated by nativism. By some estimates, 40% of agricultural workers in the US are undocumented. Mass deportations would cause a disruption to the industry’s workforce that would bankrupt farms and food processing plants from coast to coast; we’d no longer be talking inflation, we’d be talking empty shelves. Trump understands this and doesn’t intend on doing it. He’s going to feign an attempt at deportation, there will be an immediate challenge in the courts, and instead of fighting them, he’ll blame liberals for getting in the way. In doing so, he’ll not only avoid criticism for failing to deliver on a BS campaign promise, he’ll actually solidify the support of those who fell for it in the first place.[/quote]

I agree with this in part. He'll most likely will focus on the big cities LA/NYC/Chicago in liberal states, and leave the farmers in Wyoming/Idaho/Iowa alone. If not, he'll find out very soon the consequences of fucking around. That said, if a guy like Stephen Miller is at it, I wouldn't put it past him to do it all.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1366983]Like it or not President Trump is an iconic figure now….right now in the early 21st century, the most historic, most recognized, most talked about, most wildly covered around the world….for better or for worst. He is an icon. [/quote]

Most people do not view him in a good way. In fact, Harris favorability was higher than Trumps. The Republican party is definitely the party of Trump. It change from the glory worshiping of Reagan to bowing down before dear leader Trump. Notice, both were celebrities/actors.

Chico,

Here is the thing. What happens when Trump is no longer there. Trumpism doesn't exist without Trump. Nobody has that celebrity status or charisma (good or bad) like he has. JD Vance sure hasn't got it, neither does Nikki Haley, Don Jr. etc.....

Nobody does. Like Reagan, they aren't going to be able to duplicate that success. I heard that in one state, there were 70,000 votes for Trump that didn't select any of the down ballot races. That tells you they were there voting for Trump and Trump only. Once he's gone, you can say goodbye to those voters again.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

So wait, the economy is good now? It somehow magically got better in two weeks. ROFL

[url]https://www.politico.com/news/2024/11/17/republicans-trump-win-economy-election-security-confidence-00189941[/url]

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1367944]Most people do not view him in a good way. In fact, Harris favorability was higher than Trumps. The Republican party is definitely the party of Trump. It change from the glory worshiping of Reagan to bowing down before dear leader Trump. Notice, both were celebrities/actors.

Chico,

Here is the thing. What happens when Trump is no longer there. Trumpism doesn't exist without Trump. Nobody has that celebrity status or charisma (good or bad) like he has. JD Vance sure hasn't got it, neither does Nikki Haley, Don Jr. etc.....

Nobody does. Like Reagan, they aren't going to be able to duplicate that success. I heard that in one state, there were 70,000 votes for Trump that didn't select any of the down ballot races. That tells you they were there voting for Trump and Trump only. Once he's gone, you can say goodbye to those voters again.[/quote]

All this aside, it will be Trump remembered over Bush, Clinton and Obama in history from this period of time. Modern day Grover Cleveland feat with a comeback like this was amazing despite every measurement you and others name. He defied everything and persevered.

He’s an American Icon, this election solidifies the status.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

Plenty of people who voted for him know he's garbage, but they don't care as long as they own the libs even when it comes to voting against their own best interests. We have a big problem when it comes to critical thinking in this country.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367978]All this aside, it will be Trump remembered over Bush, Clinton and Obama in history from this period of time. Modern day Grover Cleveland feat with a comeback like this was amazing despite every measurement you and others name. He defied everything and persevered.

He’s an American Icon, this election solidifies the status.[/quote]

You think a convicted sexual predator as President will be remember before the First African American President?

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Giantone;1367992]You think a convicted sexual predator as President will be remember before the First African American President?[/quote]

That’s a great historic asterisk with no achievements other than the direct delivery of Trump to the White House twice without a back to back. Gen X voters who delivered Obama terms effectively ushered out Obama’s legacy moving to back Trump a second time. And did so in damaging fashion.

It’s a full rejection of identity politics and purist elitism which Obama’s Democrat party embraced over a common sense middle class.

It matters that Trump had to overcome a strong opposition within the federal government he inherited who effectively, along with an opposition press, tried to throw him out of office with no substantive evidence or crime committed. Couple that with lawfare , DOJ prosecution, struggles within his own party, a lab leaked world wide Pandemic and multiple assassination attempts. Sorry he overcame all that…this is politics, nobody’s overcome that before.

Plus, he’s simply more interesting.

Story isn’t over, gotta mend a nation and deliver

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367978]All this aside, it will be Trump remembered over Bush, Clinton and Obama in history from this period of time. Modern day Grover Cleveland feat with a comeback like this was amazing despite every measurement you and others name. He defied everything and persevered.

He’s an American Icon, this election solidifies the status.[/quote]

That's not remotely true. Many of his voters actually hate him, but somehow convince themselves he's better than the Dems. My own mother doesn't like him, and still votes R because she's always voted R.


I think his cult members will remember him fondly but not the rest of civilization. Think about it, EVERY single member of his original cabinet did not endorse him except for Nikki Haley. That's unprecedented.

This comeback was due to inflation spiking. Had it not, he wouldn't be walking into the office come January. We all know that.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=Chico23231;1367978]All this aside, it will be Trump remembered over Bush, Clinton and Obama in history from this period of time. Modern day Grover Cleveland feat with a comeback like this was amazing despite every measurement you and others name. He defied everything and persevered.

He’s an American Icon, this election solidifies the status.[/quote]

I'm sure but remembered in the same vein as Nero being more well known than Trajan, Hadrian and Marcus Aurelious. Question for you on this bit "....with no substantive evidence or crime committed." Were you just talking about the time before he lost the election in 2020? If so, somewhat true but after that election there was a shit load of substantive evidence of criminal activity on his part during that period. Had the Dems not nominated such a passive AG who never moved on the case, it is likely he'd have been tried for those crimes.

Re: Election Day November 5,2024
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1367994]That's not remotely true. Many of his voters actually hate him, but somehow convince themselves he's better than the Dems. My own mother doesn't like him, and still votes R because she's always voted R.


I think his cult members will remember him fondly but not the rest of civilization. Think about it, EVERY single member of his original cabinet did not endorse him except for Nikki Haley. That's unprecedented.

This comeback was due to inflation spiking. Had it not, he wouldn't be walking into the office come January. We all know that.[/quote]

Wokeism which was tied to the Dems also played a substantial part, but that was an oncoming train that was heading their way for over a decade (and I'm still not sure the Dems learned that lesson given their reaction to Dem Congressman Moulton highlighting that problem).