Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;886356]So could we compare some of the interest in Hoyer by NFL clubs to Schuab when he was traded out of ATL. Highly regarded but never had a chance to play.[/quote]That's probably a good comp, though Schaub was clearly better regarded on draft day.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=artmonkforhallofamein07;886356]So could we compare some of the interest in Hoyer by NFL clubs to Schuab when he was traded out of ATL. Highly regarded but never had a chance to play.[/quote]

And Matt Flynn is Kevin Kolb.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/post/would-peyton-manning-avoid-redskins-because-of-eli/2012/02/13/gIQAVHSJBR_blog.html]Would Peyton Manning avoid Redskins because of Eli? - DC Sports Bog - The Washington Post[/url]

Mark Schrleth's view on Peyton vs his brother twice a year. I like this one.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=GTripp0012;886354]Re: rawness, that is what I gathered from you (that you were downgrading him on it), but I feel like a lot of others have concluded that because he can get so much better than he is, his flaws aren't significant issues. Whereas evaluations seem to be far more terminal on Foles, Cousins, and Moore. It's almost like we've reached a point where college productivity is being held against players: Tannehill is getting pushed up somewhat because he lacks it. That, to me, is backwards.[/quote]I can't speak to why or how anyone else ranks the prospects.
But I'm not grading Tannehill on upside which seems to be what you suggest above.

(I'm simplifying a great deal here for the sake of brevity)
Cousins and Moore for me have physical limitations that guide their rankings.
Foles compared to Tannhell gives equal tier arm talent but without the wheels.

College production isn't a major factor for my QB assessments one way or another.
I'm not a big stats guy when it comes to judging QBs.
Sure they're valuable when assessing somethings like efficiency.
But imo stats are tricky as an assessment tool because the stats are too enmeshed with the scheme, coaching and surrounding talent to make an accurate measure about the prospect by leaning heavily on stats.

[quote]With Weeden, I don't think he can ever overcome his age, so I'm not rating him like I believe he can. I think you can take Weeden, plug him into your system, enjoy having a strong armed quarterback in the Joe Flacco mold, and just deal with the fact that he's going to be a two read guy in the pros.[/quote]This is where we diverge.
Although I think Weeden has 'plus' arm talent I don't think its on the elite NFL level which is where I put Flacco's.
I see Weeden as a less mobile but stronger armed Andy Dalton.
Regardless of how many reads or how far along any QB prospect is right now; to have success at the next level they're all gonna have to become more effecient multiple progression read QBs.
Whether its Weeden or any other prospect.

[quote=GT]I like Brock Osweiler, but Tannehill was the better college player of the two. Ergo, he's the better pro prospect, even though he's giving tools up in the comparison.[/quote]I agree that Tannehill is a much better prospect then Brock but for me it has little to do with the differences in their college production.


[quote=GT]It seems to me that there are only a couple of QBs in this class that don't throw on the move well, but that seems to be a primary positive that follows Tannehill, because he played wide receiver for years.[/quote]There are different levels of apptitude when it comes to the different QB traits.
If prospect X does something better then prospect Y you diminish they're separation when you say 'they all do X well'.
Imo for evaluations purposes its important to look at how the prospects stack up next to each other not just in general.
While it may be true that most of the QBs in this class throw the ball decent on the run.
Luck, Griffin, Tannehill and Wilson throw it better on the run the rest of the prospects therefore in that one aspect (out of the many measureables) they rank higher.

[quote=GT]He's a much better athlete than Foles, but I just feel like if evaluators came out and said "that is why I believe the older prospect (Tannehill) has more upside," that it wouldn't fly against criticism. They are all gifted players physically.[/quote]Again in a comparative assessment if both QBs throw the ball the same yet Tannehill is a remarkably better athlete that can throw better on the run and make plays with his legs it makes him that much better of a prospect.

[quote=GT]Mostly, I just can't rectify "having the physical tools to be a first round pick" with being the consensus third best guy in the class. It sure seems like someone missed a step somewhere.[/quote]Well, that's not the argument I'm making, so I don't know what to tell you about that line of thought.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SBXVII;886352]Weren't you one of the ones who said the same thing when I suggested we get Andy Dalton? yeah, I'm pretty sure you were. Just pointing out how wrong you an be. ;)[/quote]

I didn't like Dalton because he was a Ginger. Any problems I had with Dalton had little if anything to do with his playing ability.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;886366]I didn't like Dalton because he was a Ginger. Any problems I had with Dalton had little if anything to do with his playing ability.[/quote]

Did you know no ginger has ever won the superbowl? Those people just dont have what it takes.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

Im talking QBs here

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=30gut;886364]There are different levels of apptitude when it comes to the different QB traits.
If prospect X does something better then prospect Y you diminish they're separation when you say 'they all do X well'.
Imo for evaluations purposes its important to look at how the prospects stack up next to each other not just in general.
While it may be true that most of the QBs in this class throw the ball decent on the run.
Luck, Griffin, Tannehill and Wilson throw it better on the run the rest of the prospects therefore in that one aspect (out of the many measureables) they rank higher.[/quote]I think that "he throws the ball well on the run" is a different assertion than "he throws on the run considerably better than most of this class." The former shows up in most Tannehill scouting reports. The latter is a more controversial position. If I'm attempting to diminish the separation it is only because I feel comfortable grouping with what I would consider to be a secondary skill, based on there not being enough passing attempts on the move to determine relative proficiency.

Regardless, it's not fair to ask you to represent the opinion of the masses, instead of your own evaluations, although that's basically what I'm asking. I'm trying to get educated on what has separated Ryan Tannehill from most of the class. I think you've helped with that.

What I was hoping for is someone to come out and say "this is what you're missing GTripp" and then explain why I've completely overlooked something in my Tannehill evaluation that no one else in this class offers (Luck/Griffin excluded). Thing is, I'm more convinced than ever that the separation between Tannehill and like four other guys is not based on things that would be reflected on an NFL field, but more in the fact that he looks the part.

I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying that comparing his ability to throw on the run to that of Russell Wilson does little to explain why he his draft stock hasn't yet taken a huge blow because of the things he struggles with, like throwing some of the deeper routes with timing and accuracy.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=GTripp0012;886373]What I was hoping for is someone to come out and say "this is what you're missing GTripp" and then explain why I've completely overlooked something in my Tannehill evaluation that no one else in this class offers (Luck/Griffin excluded). Thing is, I'm more convinced than ever that the separation between Tannehill and like four other guys is not based on things that would be reflected on an NFL field, but more in the fact that he looks the part.

I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying that comparing his ability to throw on the run to that of Russell Wilson does little to explain why he his draft stock hasn't yet taken a huge blow because of the things he struggles with, like throwing some of the deeper routes with timing and accuracy.[/quote]
Well that's because I'm not saying Tannehill's ability to throw on the run alone is what separates him from the other prospects, although it is a part of it, and I don't agree that he struggles throwing the deeper routes.
I tend to look at prospects the way many coaches do: don't tell me what they can't do, tell me what they can.
And btw, comparing him to Wilson is a [I]compliment[/I] in my book.
Wilson is my favorite QB prospect in the draft but I think his height is going to be a huge hurdle preventing him from getting the same opportunity to lead a franchise compared to the over 6' QBs. (but that's a whole different discussion)

First off I don't think the gaps between the QBs in any draft are quite as large as the media and the league in general makes them out to be.
When you're talking about draftable QB prospects were already talking about the cream of the cream.
So often times were merely splitting hairs except those hairs represent several draft slots worth of difference.
But again I digress.

Its hard to explain to someone what they're missing when they look at prospect because I don't know you're full assessment of him.
And in general if you don't see or acknowledge a trait in a prospect its doubtful anyone is going be able to get you to see it. (e.g. Locker vs Gabbert last year)

but re:"this is what you're missing GTripp"
To my eye [I][B]Tannehill[/B][/I] has as much if not more physical talent then [I]Luck[/I].
Imo he has better arm talent then Luck, he's more athletic, he can throw equally as well on the run (which is a critically important trait that some elite QBs possess Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Mike Vick, Ben Rothlisberger etc), they're about on the same level in throwing motion, I think Tannehill has a slightly quicker release and for me the most critical assest for me is playmaking.
Tannehill can can extends plays with his legs by evading pressure and can also gain chunks of yards that extend drives with his legs.
The main attributes that prevent Tannehill from being in the same tier as Luck are attainable for Tannehill through coaching and experience.
Tannehill simply lacks 'command'.

Also, specific to the Redskins Tannehill has experience with the both the verbiage and the concepts of [I][B]this[/B][/I] offense because he played in a variant of this offense under Mike Sherman.
So Tannehill already has some conceptual understanding of [I][B]this[/B][/I] offense and has experience executing the rhythm passing elements (scripted footwork linked with route combinations and timing) and knows how to execute the staple boot-action passing elements of the offense.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

I can't believe we are even having this discussion.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;886366]I didn't like Dalton because he was a Ginger. Any problems I had with Dalton had little if anything to do with his playing ability.[/quote]

ROFLMAO. You kill me. So your a Ginger-sist?

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

If Peyton is cleared by the team doctors I would rather take Peyton Manning and select another quarterback in the later rds. Next season you have Matt Barkley and Landry Jones coming out.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=skins89moss;886396]If Peyton is cleared by the team doctors I would rather take Peyton Manning and select another quarterback in the later rds. Next season you have Matt Barkley and Landry Jones coming out.[/quote]

So what? We would have to trade away everything to get into the top 5 next year just like this year. And going that route you would have a raw, low round QB prospect who isn't ready to play and when Peyton get's the knockout blow for his career somewhere in the first 3 weeks, then what do we have for the rest of the season? Rex Grossman. No thank you.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=skins89moss;886396]If Peyton is cleared by the team doctors I would rather take Peyton Manning and select another quarterback in the later rds. Next season you have Matt Barkley and Landry Jones coming out.[/quote]

.....always next year....

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[QUOTE=Son Of Man;886399].....always next year....[/QUOTE]

I see you've been reading Dirtbag's blog.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;886414]I see you've been reading Dirtbag's blog.[/quote]

lol! I always think of Dirtbag when someone mentions next year's qb crop.

Seriously though, if B. Allen ever wanted to use his father's mantra, our QB situation is pretty appropriate for it - 'the future is now!'

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=skins89moss;886396]If Peyton is cleared by the team doctors I would rather take Peyton Manning and select another quarterback in the later rds. Next season you have Matt Barkley and Landry Jones coming out.[/quote]

Matt Barkley will be the number 1 pick and Landry Jones wasn't that great of a prospect to begin with. This is the big class. Next years class will be worse. Maybe Tyler Wilson stays hot but if he's a top 5 pick then we'll have to trade up to get him which will probably cost a pretty penny. If Tyler Wilson goes cold no one will want him then it will be all about the 2014 class.

Either way the 2013 QB class is projecting to be much weaker depth and talent wise then 2012. Heck from what I've seen the 2013 class has the potential to be downright ugly.

2013: Matt Barkley, Tyler Wilson, Landry Jones............EJ Manual?

vs

2012: Andrew Luck, RGIII, Ryan Tannehill, Brock Osweiler, Nick Foles, Brandon Weeden.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=NM Redskin;886360]And Matt Flynn is Kevin Kolb.[/quote]


AAAAAAAAAAAAAA. (thats my buzzer sound) No I think not. Kolb played in something like 15 games and pretty much sucked in all of them. Which is why I was not rooting for the Skins to make a play. Also why I'm happy we didn't make a play. The Cards just found out what almost most of us should have known.... Kolb sucks.

Flynn on the other hand only has had 2 games and did fairly well in the first and awesome in the second. Managed the game well against a stout defense is not Kolb like.

My last point, our options at QB in the FA are limited to only a few half decent QB's and out of them 1 is aged and recovering (PM), 1 is going to take a draft pick (Hoyer), and 1 is definitely back up material and no better then Grossman(Orton), and 1 that is simply an unknown no draft pick requiring FA (Flynn). My reasoning for Flynn is because he's still young, healthy, knows the WCO, has shown he can play in the NFL and can manage a game pretty well, and can make all the throws. Pick him up with the understanding he'll challenge for starting position and draft a Rookie. make them battle it out in preseason and play the best candidate. This way we'd have 2 relatively young QB's that are healthy and can play for the future of this team.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[QUOTE=30gut;886364]

This is where we diverge.
Although I think Weeden has 'plus' arm talent I don't think its on the elite NFL level which is where I put Flacco's.
I see Weeden as a less mobile but stronger armed Andy Dalton.
Regardless of how many reads or how far along any QB prospect is right now; [B]to have success at the next level they're all gonna have to become more effecient multiple progression read QBs[/B].
Whether its Weeden or any other prospect.
QUOTE]

Which includes RGIII. His knock is he stares down his receivers, does not go through his progressions well. Usually only throwing to his first read rarely making it to his second before taking off running. He's gunna need a lot of work on this.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886312]Josh Johnson would likely not be a starter

Nor would Jimmy Clausen for that matter

Yeah I believe Hoyer is the main under the radar guy not being talked about

annnnnnnddddddd Mark Sanchez! :)

Seriously though, I just feel like Manning's not coming here because I don't get the sense there is a strong "passion" to bring him here from the group of decision makers. They're probably more passionate about Orton (they did nearly acquire him twice after all), relatively speaking. And...truthishly...Hoyer and Clausen are two names that always kind of stay in the conversation while others tend to come and go

So I could see trade a 3rd for Hoyer, sign Clausen, use the 2nd to get a Foles/Cousins type[/quote]

So, you are saying the sources you have are telling you that our front office, of the washington redskins.............ahem, let me clear my throat, ahem.......okay.....ugh, uh uh hmmmmmmmm, alright, Im ready, is more passionate about Kyle orton, hold up, let me wipe the bit of vomit from around my crusty bottom lip........., ok, as I was saying, they are more passionate about Kyle Orton, than Peyton Manning.

If that is the truth, than the ego of the front office, sorry to say, is completely out of fvckin hand.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=Mechanix544;886428]So, you are saying the sources you have are telling you that our front office, of the washington redskins.............ahem, let me clear my throat, ahem.......okay.....ugh, uh uh hmmmmmmmm, alright, Im ready, is more passionate about Kyle orton, hold up, let me wipe the bit of vomit from around my crusty bottom lip........., ok, as I was saying, they are more passionate about Kyle Orton, than Peyton Manning.

Well, lemme say something. Your sources ****IN SUCK. If that is the truth, than the ego of the front office, sorry to say, is completely out of fvckin hand.[/quote]

Boy, this really came out of left field. I'm not a huge fan of Orton either but it's a moot point if Manning can't return. Besides, even if we sign Orton it doesn't mean they plan on him being here long term.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

there, I prettied it up.

No disrespect to SS, but if they indeed are "passionate" in any way about Kyle Orton, well, I dunno. I guess it makes me want to cry. We can do better than Kyle Orton people. Arent the fans 0f the washington redskins due for some good qb play? Dont just settle for (fill in the blank) when talking about your next qb, GO AND GET HIM!!!!!!

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

Well, Orton certainly comes with a lot less risk. Let's not think that Orton solves the QB dilemma. We'll still draft someone. And there's still the chance PM stays in Indy, or simply chooses another team.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=Mechanix544;886431]there, I prettied it up.

No disrespect to SS, but if they indeed are "passionate" in any way about Kyle Orton, well, I dunno. I guess it makes me want to cry. We can do better than Kyle Orton people. Arent the fans 0f the washington redskins due for some good qb play? Dont just settle for (fill in the blank) when talking about your next qb, GO AND GET HIM!!!!!![/quote]

Agree 1000%. Only way Orton makes any sense at all is if they intend to get RG3 in the draft. Orton is fine to start for a month or so if RG3 is not ready on opening day but if they are counting on him for anything more then that then it's a disaster IMO.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

Let me clarify, universally (meaning within the key decision makers) there are fewer concerns about Orton than Manning. The biggest advocate for Manning probably has the least say. I'm not sure they're rah rah for either, quite honestly

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

If we sign Orton then I'm going to puke. There's a reason he's on his 3rd team. As much as I'd hate to give up a pick, I'd rather them go get someone who hasn't had a chance ( Hoyer, Flynn) then bring in Orton.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

i wouldn't mind signing orton as a backup

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SkinzWin;886397]So what? [B]We would have to trade away everything to get into the top 5 next year just like this year.[/B] And going that route you would have a raw, low round QB prospect who isn't ready to play and when Peyton get's the knockout blow for his career somewhere in the first 3 weeks, then what do we have for the rest of the season? Rex Grossman. No thank you.[/quote]

Agree. If somebody told you, that you had a greater than 50% shot of winning the lottery you would probably pay a high price for that ticket. Drafting a franchise QB is kind of like that. The risk is there, but the upside is worth it. In order to succeed in the playoffs you need a franchise QB. The teams that don’t have one are a revolving door getting into the playoffs every so often then having a few years not being there, with minimal success in the playoffs. In order to have longevity you need that QB. I think they have to make a play for RG3.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=skinsfan69;886464]If we sign Orton then I'm going to puke. There's a reason he's on his 3rd team. As much as I'd hate to give up a pick, I'd rather them go get someone who hasn't had a chance ( Hoyer, Flynn) then bring in Orton.[/quote]

Let me pose this question to you

Manning and trade down to get Tannehill and an additional pick in the 2nd/3rd

or

Orton and trade up to get RG3 and lose a 1st/2nd

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886471]Let me pose this question to you

Manning and trade down to get Tannehill and an additional pick in the 2nd/3rd

or

Orton and trade up to get RG3 and lose a 1st/2nd[/quote]

Option 2.....all day.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

orton/rg3. manning is done

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886471]Let me pose this question to you

Manning and trade down to get Tannehill and an additional pick in the 2nd/3rd

or

Orton and trade up to get RG3 and lose a 1st/2nd[/quote]

#2 all day.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886471]Let me pose this question to you

Manning and trade down to get Tannehill and an additional pick in the 2nd/3rd

or

Orton and trade up to get RG3 and lose a 1st/2nd[/quote]

Sounds like in your opinion signing Orton is an indication that the skins will make a serious push for RG3.

Those are really the only 2 workable options to me. Orton is not enough of an immediate upgrade to pair with any sort of developmental QB and if they get Manning spending extra resources to move up for RG3 is highly unlikely.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=30gut;886378]but re:"this is what you're missing GTripp"
To my eye [I][B]Tannehill[/B][/I] has as much if not more physical talent then [I]Luck[/I].
Imo he has better arm talent then Luck, he's more athletic, he can throw equally as well on the run (which is a critically important trait that some elite QBs possess Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Mike Vick, Ben Rothlisberger etc), they're about on the same level in throwing motion, I think Tannehill has a slightly quicker release and for me the most critical assest for me is playmaking.
Tannehill can can extends plays with his legs by evading pressure and can also gain chunks of yards that extend drives with his legs.
The main attributes that prevent Tannehill from being in the same tier as Luck are attainable for Tannehill through coaching and experience.
Tannehill simply lacks 'command'.[/quote]This probably is as close as I was hoping to get to understanding "why Tannehill?" I don't think the Ryan Tannehill who played at Texas A&M showed much of any of this, certainly I don't think he's in the same category with his arm or even with his athleticism that Andrew Luck is.

But I don't know, maybe Tannehill has great success starts a mass trend of college receivers being converted to quarterback in the pros. It seems strange, but if the QB position is really as important as people think it is, you'd think some of these QB gurus would be open to trying more athletes at the position.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

option 2

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886471]Let me pose this question to you

Manning and trade down to get Tannehill and an additional pick in the 2nd/3rd

or

Orton and trade up to get RG3 and lose a 1st/2nd[/quote]

I would do neither. Losing two high draft picks is just too much. We're not good enough to give away picks. As I said, Qb's can be found later in the 1st round or 2nd round. Orton is just another Rex that doesn't know the system.

I wouldn't mind trading down but under NO circumstances do we bring Manning here. No more quick fix BS and then try and sell that crap to the fans. Manning is 36 years old with a bad neck. That's like buying a sports car with 150,000 miles. Only a matter of time before something goes wrong. Not a fan of Tannehill cause he's too raw. Draft Foles or Cousins, keep Rex and maybe try and sign Hoyer. So...next year you'd have a rookie qb, Hoyer and Rex.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=SmootSmack;886353]it's about future potential with Hoyer really. He's extremely well regarded by many NFL teams perhaps more so than Flynn in some cases.
[/quote]

I live in New England and listen to a lot of talk radio and we have late night sports talk on TV on Sundays. I can tell you the people (beat reporters, ex-players, etc) who cover and comment on the team feel that the team believes in Hoyer to a huge degree. Like they think they're sitting on a major asset, way better than Cassel was. And this isn't just "the coaches say he's good" talk, or a smokescreen, they are talking about a palpable sense they get from everywhere in the organization about Hoyer.

There is talk now that they are considering putting the first round tender on him. If you think about what that means, it means they are thinking it might not be worth risking losing him for "only" a 2nd round pick. And this is a guy who can walk for nothing in a year. So, essentially they are debating whether one year of Hoyer as a back-up is worth more than a 2nd round pick.

Just FWIW.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

Option 2 is actually worth considering if all we had to give up to get RGIII (in addition to our #6 overall) were a 1st or 2nd. However, i dont think thats remotely realistic. Moving up would likely cost much more, so i'll take option 1.

Option 2 would not do too much to help us now, and we'd be putting way too much (in terms of draft picks) into one player, that, while has loads of upside, is way too much of a risk.

Option 1 (assuming mannings healthy) would allow us to win now, add additional players, while giving our QB of the future time to develop. Its the best of both worlds. Win now and later.

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=celts32;886478]Sounds like in your opinion signing Orton is an indication that the skins will make a serious push for RG3.

Those are really the only 2 workable options to me. Orton is not enough of an immediate upgrade to pair with any sort of developmental QB and if they get Manning spending extra resources to move up for RG3 is highly unlikely.[/quote]

Not necessarily. I was just throwing it out there as an option. Of the two choices I'd prefer Manning (healthy), RT, and picks. Largely bc I don't think the gap between RG3 and RT is that big

Re: Peyton Manning or RGIII your choice
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;886492]Option 2 is actually worth considering if all we had to give up to get RGIII (in addition to our #6 overall) were a 1st or 2nd. However, i dont think thats remotely realistic. Moving up would likely cost much more, so i'll take option 1.

Option 2 would not do too much to help us now, and we'd be putting way too much (in terms of draft picks) into one player, that, while has loads of upside, is way too much of a risk.

Option 1 (assuming mannings healthy) would allow us to win now, add additional players, while giving our QB of the future time to develop. Its the best of both worlds. Win now and later.[/quote]

I agree, option 1 gives the team the best of both worlds.