Re: Skins Wins - predictions go here
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228338]To be fair, Keenum also had Diggs, Thielen, and the best 3rd down defense of all time. We have none of those things.[/quote]

Minnesota had all those things last year and they managed to win one more game than we did (and tied another game that they should have lost).

We have a good defense with potential to be great, and while who knows about our wideouts, they are young and unproven, and maybe, just maybe we get lucky and find a diamond in the rough.

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228344]Minnesota had all those things last year and they managed to win one more game than we did (and tied another game that they should have lost).

We have a good defense with potential to be great, and while who knows about our wideouts, they are young and unproven, and maybe, just maybe we get lucky and find a diamond in the rough.[/quote]

but last year they had Kurt, so they were SB bound!

:drink

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;1228339]stats from Pro-Football
Diggs was a 5th round pick going into his 3rd year, never had a 1000 yard season, and had 7 touchdowns his first two years, and started 20 out of 32 games his first two seasons.

Thielen went undrafted in 2013, and was cut and put on the Vikings practice squad, then started 14 games from 2014-2016
his stat line for his seasons before 2017
yr tgt rec td
2014-13-8-137-1
2015-18-12-144-0
2016-92-69-967-5


in 2017 their respective stats were:
Diggs-started 14 games -95-64-849-8
Thielen-started 16 games-142-91-1276-4

My point is they weren't really "DIGGS and THIELEN" till Keenum got there. They might have had potential, but his play helped bring it out.

Maybe he does the same with our potential WR's

as for defense, we will see, I think our defense will be special (in a good way) this year.[/quote]

And we have no one on our team that has even come close to 849 WR yards at WR let alone 1200, Case had that one year of 21 TDs and 7 Ints but outside of that, has been just a waste of space. Yes our defense has potential but like Brain Billick said potential will get you fired

Re: Skins Wins - predictions go here
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228347]And we have no one on our team that has even come close to 849 WR yards at WR let alone 1200, Case had that one year of 21 TDs and 7 Ints but outside of that, has been just a waste of space. Yes our defense has potential but like Brain Billick said potential will get you fired[/quote]

I'm not hired, so they aren't firing me. We don't have a clue what our WR's are capable of, now that we have cleared out most of the deadwood. Maybe they are more of the same, but at least in preseason the ones that played flashed good stuff.

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228344]Minnesota had all those things last year and they managed to win one more game than we did (and tied another game that they should have lost).

We have a good defense with potential to be great, and while who knows about our wideouts, they are young and unproven, and maybe, just maybe we get lucky and find a diamond in the rough.[/quote]

Their defense took a major step back last year too, the 2018 defense was no where near as good as the 2017 one. I hope we find a diamond in the rough, but I am just not expecting anything special from Case Keenum.

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[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228350]Their defense took a major step back last year too, the 2018 defense was no where near as good as the 2017 one. I hope we find a diamond in the rough, but I am just not expecting anything special from Case Keenum.[/quote]

I wouldn't call this a major step back; but it is a step back.

Vikes 2018 Defense:
#4 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#9 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#17 Takeaways

Vikes 2017 Defense:
#1 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#1 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#23 Takeaways

The funny thing is that from 2017 to 2018, the Vikes offensive rankings went down in yards (#11 to #20) and points (#10 to #19), but went up in giveaways (#30 vs. #16).

And yes, I need a life if I'm looking this stuff up.

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[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;1228336]We as Redskins fans have been spoiled in one aspect of football for the past 30 years.
LT
From the Hogs, to Lachey to Samuels to Williams we have had a near nonstop top tier LT protecting our QBs. Other teams have won far more with far less lines. Green Bay comes to mind off the top.

Not saying OL doesn't matter, but it also doesnt doom the season if you can compensate for it with your RB and QB positions.

I think our RBs will find and exploit creases, and just as importantly, I think Keenum showed up in Minnesota that he can guide an offense behind a weaker OL.

We may not be an offensive juggernaut with Penn at LT, but we are not going to be a deadzone either.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]Meh. I hear where you are coming from but I've watched this team forever and if we cant pass block, we ain't winning 4 games.

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228353]I wouldn't call this a major step back; but it is a step back.

Vikes 2018 Defense:
#4 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#9 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#17 Takeaways

Vikes 2017 Defense:
#1 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#1 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#23 Takeaways

[B]The funny thing is that from 2017 to 2018, the Vikes offensive rankings went down in yards (#11 to #20) and points (#10 to #19), but went up in giveaways (#30 vs. #16).
[/B]
And yes, I need a life if I'm looking this stuff up.[/quote]

the magic of kirk cousins

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4-12 and please do not play Haskins for one second until we have a better o line or we will go 4-12 for a while.

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Run the damn ball...Mix up the playcalling on 1st down....look too get the RB more involved in passing game (Guice,CT)....scheme out the tells on offense based on personnel groupings....run more playaction....

I don't see why the offense cant be better. Plus the Schreff and Moses both healthy.

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[QUOTE=Chico23231;1228360]Run the damn ball...Mix up the playcalling on 1st down....look too get the RB more involved in passing game (Guice,CT)....scheme out the tells on offense based on personnel groupings....run more playaction....



I don't see why the offense cant be better. Plus the Schreff and Moses both healthy.[/QUOTE]



Because we have no Left side of the line, no quarterback, Reed is hurt again, and we have nothing but question marks at wr. Oh n Gruden sucks and will not do anything you mentioned....
This is going to be thee most putrid offense we have seen since Brunell

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If TW comes around, Reed plays, One or two of our wr’s is better than average, Guice is a stud and AP has another solid year than with our D we can shock some people. Our ST’s scares the hell out of me. The STC is going to turn out to be one of the worst hires in our history and that is saying alot.
Our DC and HC scare the hell out of me too, and of course the Case Keenum factor.

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[quote=JGisLordOfTheRings;1228354]Meh. I hear where you are coming from but I've watched this team forever and if we cant pass block, we ain't winning 4 games.[/quote]

Pass blocking in the regular season is different from in the preseason. In the preseason, you didn't see chip blocks or protection schemes designed to aid the team's weakness. You saw each player going one on one and putting on tape their strengths and weaknesses for our coaching staff. You also saw Haskins and Keenum practicing play action on every handoff, but I don't think we saw many real play action passes.

The point is, the pass blocking will be aided by many different things, and the offense has enough potent weapons to give the defense pause from pinning their ears back and going for the qb on 1st and 2nd. Now when we end up in 3rd and long because Flowers or Reed held, then the drives will be killed.

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[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;1228370]Pass blocking in the regular season is different from in the preseason. In the preseason, you didn't see chip blocks or protection schemes designed to aid the team's weakness. You saw each player going one on one and putting on tape their strengths and weaknesses for our coaching staff. You also saw Haskins and Keenum practicing play action on every handoff, but I don't think we saw many real play action passes.



The point is, the pass blocking will be aided by many different things, and the offense has enough potent weapons to give the defense pause from pinning their ears back and going for the qb on 1st and 2nd. Now when we end up in 3rd and long because Flowers or Reed held, then the drives will be killed.[/QUOTE]Good assessment. Your last line is where I am at. There us no way Flowers isn't going to get someone hurt, end up on Cmon Man for being generally terrible and making us all question why he is playing after week 2.

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[quote=JGisLordOfTheRings;1228372]Good assessment. Your last line is where I am at. There us no way Flowers isn't going to get someone hurt, end up on Cmon Man for being generally terrible and making us all question why he is playing after week 2.[/quote]

I think he is playing for his run blocking ability. I wouldn't be surprised to see Martin subbing in on 3rd and long (and getting us delay of game penalties as Flowers chugs off the field)

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[quote=Chico23231;1228360]Run the damn ball...Mix up the playcalling on 1st down....look too get the RB more involved in passing game (Guice,CT)....scheme out the tells on offense based on personnel groupings....run more playaction....

[B]I don't see why the offense cant be better. Plus the Schreff and Moses both healthy[/B].[/quote]

scheme is inconsistent and easy to read - jay is a bum to me/

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228353]I wouldn't call this a major step back; but it is a step back.

Vikes 2018 Defense:
#4 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#9 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#17 Takeaways

Vikes 2017 Defense:
#1 Yds Allowed, Yds/Game Allowed
#1 Pts Allowed, Pts/Game Allowed
#23 Takeaways

The funny thing is that from 2017 to 2018, the Vikes offensive rankings went down in yards (#11 to #20) and points (#10 to #19), but went up in giveaways (#30 vs. #16).

And yes, I need a life if I'm looking this stuff up.[/quote]


You have a life, I appreciate you looking it up. As far as the major step back it is the 3rd down efficiency rate. Now I thought they were stupid to give Cousins that money but that is their problem now. Giveaways are big but didn't Keenum have 15 ints last year??

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[quote=Meks;1228374]scheme is inconsistent and easy to read - jay is a bum to me/[/quote]

Kevin O'Connell needs to step up and show his worth

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[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228376]You have a life, I appreciate you looking it up. As far as the major step back it is the 3rd down efficiency rate. Now I thought they were stupid to give Cousins that money but that is their problem now. Giveaways are big but didn't Keenum have 15 ints last year??[/quote]

Case's giveaways numbers were terrible last year in Denver: 15 INTs and 8 Fumbles. However, his numbers in 2017 with the Vikes were 7 INTs and 1 fumble.

I keep bringing the 2017 Vikings because there is a slight chance the Redskins could somehow create a similar environment, where Case can game manage the team to a winning record:

- Wide Receivers: Diggs and Theilen broke out in 2017, the season prior to that, they were average young wideouts that no one knew about. This is a long shot, but maybe we have one or two of the young wideouts breakout in the same manner.

- Running Game: Guice, AP, and CT are a much much much better running game than Lativius Murray, McKinnon, and the 4 games that Dalvin Cook played in 2017.

- Offensive Line: Minnesota has had issues with their offensive line for several seasons, a lot of Vikings fans were complaining last season how they spent so much money on the QB position without spending money on the o-line (sounds familiar?).

- Defense: As you pointed out, the Vikes 2017 defense was elite; I don't think our defense is elite right now, but they do have top 10 or even top 5 potential.

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[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;1228373]I think he is playing for his run blocking ability. I wouldn't be surprised to see Martin subbing in on 3rd and long (and getting us delay of game penalties as Flowers chugs off the field)[/QUOTE]I'm with you. I would be completely alright with us becoming Navy football this year. Run the ball every damn play, throw it a few times a game. What do we have to lose? This is more than likely a lost season regardless.

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[QUOTE=Ruhskins;1228384]Case's giveaways numbers were terrible last year in Denver: 15 INTs and 8 Fumbles. However, his numbers in 2017 with the Vikes were 7 INTs and 1 fumble.



I keep bringing the 2017 Vikings because there is a slight chance the Redskins could somehow create a similar environment, where Case can game manage the team to a winning record:



- Wide Receivers: Diggs and Theilen broke out in 2017, the season prior to that, they were average young wideouts that no one knew about. This is a long shot, but maybe we have one or two of the young wideouts breakout in the same manner.



- Running Game: Guice, AP, and CT are a much much much better running game than Lativius Murray, McKinnon, and the 4 games that Dalvin Cook played in 2017.



- Offensive Line: Minnesota has had issues with their offensive line for several seasons, a lot of Vikings fans were complaining last season how they spent so much money on the QB position without spending money on the o-line (sounds familiar?).



- Defense: As you pointed out, the Vikes 2017 defense was elite; I don't think our defense is elite right now, but they do have top 10 or even top 5 potential.[/QUOTE]The proof will be in the games but the people posting like chicken littles are ignoring the fact that this team does have several strong areas, and if TW does come back then our line gets instantly better. TW Flowers our C Scherff Moses when healthy is a strong line.

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228384]Case's giveaways numbers were terrible last year in Denver: 15 INTs and 8 Fumbles. However, his numbers in 2017 with the Vikes were 7 INTs and 1 fumble.

I keep bringing the 2017 Vikings because there is a slight chance the Redskins could somehow create a similar environment, where Case can game manage the team to a winning record:

- Wide Receivers: Diggs and Theilen broke out in 2017, the season prior to that, they were average young wideouts that no one knew about. This is a long shot, but maybe we have one or two of the young wideouts breakout in the same manner.

- Running Game: Guice, AP, and CT are a much much much better running game than Lativius Murray, McKinnon, and the 4 games that Dalvin Cook played in 2017.

- Offensive Line: Minnesota has had issues with their offensive line for several seasons, a lot of Vikings fans were complaining last season how they spent so much money on the QB position without spending money on the o-line (sounds familiar?).

- Defense: As you pointed out, the Vikes 2017 defense was elite; I don't think our defense is elite right now, but they do have top 10 or even top 5 potential.[/quote]

The part about them being average is kinda pushing it a bit. Stefon Diggs career low in yards is 720 yards his rookie season, Paul Richardson who is our most accomplished WR right now, has a career high of 703 yards and is always hurt. Now I am on the side that Guice is going to be a monster, watched every game from him at LSU and was estatic when we drafted him. Thelien was more of an unkown but even before the breakout season he had 967 yards in 2016. Now do I think McLaurin, Harmon, Quinn, could breakout? Sure. Do I think our defense will be top 10 if everyone stays healthy? Yes. I actually think we can be top 3 in rush defense even in the NFC East. Do I think Keenum will be 2017 Keenum? Absolutely not, that was an outlier season and a complete 180 from everything he has been since entering the league. I think by game 5 Haskins will be in there and we will see the future unfold there.

Now it would be nice if we could strike it rich with one of our WRs though.

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;1228391]The proof will be in the games but the people posting like chicken littles are ignoring the fact that this team does have several strong areas, and if TW does come back then our line gets instantly better. TW Flowers our C Scherff Moses when healthy is a strong line.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk[/quote]

I agree we definitely have strong points on the team
Rush defense
Running game on offense
If Trent comes back 3 of the 5 OL spots are locked and Rouiller while not Travis Frederick or Alex Mack is no slouch. My main issue with the offense is we need someone to breakout on the offensive side of the ball WR wise.
McLaurin, Harmon, Quinn, Sims Jr., Davis, one of these guys has to breakout otherwise people will just stack 8 or 9 in the box like they have over the last two seasons because no one fears them

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[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228392]The part about them being average is kinda pushing it a bit. Stefon Diggs career low in yards is 720 yards his rookie season, Paul Richardson who is our most accomplished WR right now, has a career high of 703 yards and is always hurt. Now I am on the side that Guice is going to be a monster, watched every game from him at LSU and was estatic when we drafted him. Thelien was more of an unkown but even before the breakout season he had 967 yards in 2016. Now do I think McLaurin, Harmon, Quinn, could breakout? Sure. Do I think our defense will be top 10 if everyone stays healthy? Yes. I actually think we can be top 3 in rush defense even in the NFC East. Do I think Keenum will be 2017 Keenum? Absolutely not, that was an outlier season and a complete 180 from everything he has been since entering the league. I think by game 5 Haskins will be in there and we will see the future unfold there.

Now it would be nice if we could strike it rich with one of our WRs though.[/quote]

Agreed on the Thielen/Diggs comment, but the reason I mentioned them is that everyone acts like they were both the elite receivers going into 2017. I think in 2016, Kyle Rudolph was their go-to guy.

And you're right, 2017 Case was an outlier, but IMO all we need for him is to not screw up too much due to our running game and strong defense. As some have mentioned, it'll be up to the coaching staff to have a gameplan that can compensate for certain weaknesses in the team.

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[QUOTE=EARTHQUAKE2689;1228393]I agree we definitely have strong points on the team
Rush defense
Running game on offense
If Trent comes back 3 of the 5 OL spots are locked and Rouiller while not Travis Frederick or Alex Mack is no slouch. My main issue with the offense is we need someone to breakout on the offensive side of the ball WR wise.
McLaurin, Harmon, Quinn, Sims Jr., Davis, one of these guys has to breakout otherwise people will just stack 8 or 9 in the box like they have over the last two seasons because no one fears them[/QUOTE]I agree on WRs but I like the group.

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[quote=skinsfaninok;1228288]6 years 90 M for a RB?? WOW[/quote]

Now that the deal is done, I am just waiting for the BREAKING NEWS on Twitter that "Zeke tears ACL in first practice back with team".

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Zeke is basically the team, he is 24 has lead the league in rushing 2 years and probably would have been 3 if not for the suspension. He is the offense for the Cowboys regardless what Skip Bayless wants to say. I'd rather "overpay" for Zeke than overpay for an overrated QB any day. We all know chances are he wont get to that 6th year anyway. 50 million guaranteed especially off what Gurley got. It is what it is, I wish he would have waited until week 3 to get the deal done.

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[quote=Ruhskins;1228395]Agreed on the Thielen/Diggs comment, but the reason I mentioned them is that everyone acts like they were both the elite receivers going into 2017. I think in 2016, Kyle Rudolph was their go-to guy.

And you're right, 2017 Case was an outlier, but IMO all we need for him is to not screw up too much due to our running game and strong defense. As some have mentioned, it'll be up to the coaching staff to have a gameplan that can compensate for certain weaknesses in the team.[/quote]

I don't think they were elite then but they were better than what we have right now. It started with Kyle being their main guy but by the second half of the season the WRs had taken over. I have hope in the team with the exception of Case, he could prove me wrong but I am just waiting on Haskins to take over at this point

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[quote=sandtrapjack;1228280]Fair 'nuff.

Zekes deal will be done. Probably in the next 24 hours which puts him on the field week 1.

Look in the range of 6 years, 90 million. Dollars already agreed upon. Working to finalize structure.[/quote]

I give him a few weeks then the money goes to his little immature head and things go down hill. It might not happen this year because he has no time to let the money go to his head but it happens sooner then latter.

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I'm all ways very optimistic person so I said 10 wins. Why even watch if you think we will only win 6.

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[QUOTE=Back2RFK;1228407]I'm all ways very optimistic person so I said 10 wins. Why even watch if you think we will only win 6.[/QUOTE]



Same reason you look at a car accident when you drive by....

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[quote=Back2RFK;1228407]I'm all ways very optimistic person so I said 10 wins. Why even watch if you think we will only win 6.[/quote]

You must be disappointed a lot. For the Redskins be a 10 win team they will have to get big immediate contributions from new players. Whether they came from trades, the draft, or last year's class of injured rookies. It will take time for them to gel together as a team. Rookies usually struggle out of the gate, and the second year players like Guice are basically rookies cause they missed last season.

Combine the above with the early schedule this team starts 1-4. Then with the QB position Keenum isn't on his 6th team and traded for a 6th rounder because he is a solid NFL starter, he is a back up. Haskins is far from ready, a raw talent that needs work in the footwork department and learning to protect himself among other things.

I predicted 6-10. I will watch because I want to see this rookie class improve game to game giving hope for the future.

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People hammering Penn/Flowers need to wait and see how the line holds up.
I am not saying he will be TW, he won't but he also isn't a slouch when healthy.
I imagine in preseason he was knocking some of the rust off so yes we will have to actually see it to believe it, but his past 2 years hold hope that he will hold his own early on.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DGgIhwFWsAEnrGd.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://media.pff.com/2017/08/Penn.png[/IMG]

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Not as worried about Penn as I am flowers

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Umm I’m def worried. Trent needs to get back on the field

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[quote=CRedskinsRule;1228446]People hammering Penn/Flowers need to wait and see how the line holds up.
I am not saying he will be TW, he won't but he also isn't a slouch when healthy.
I imagine in preseason he was knocking some of the rust off so yes we will have to actually see it to believe it, but his past 2 years hold hope that he will hold his own early on.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DGgIhwFWsAEnrGd.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://media.pff.com/2017/08/Penn.png[/IMG][/quote]

Problem is he is 36, he could fall apart at the drop of a hat.

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Never quite understood all the hand wringing over Penn, he’s been a solid pro. We lose a lot with him athletically compared to Trent but he’s still solid. Can Flowers be at least as good as Lauvao? I hope so.


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[quote=MTK;1228456]Never quite understood all the hand wringing over Penn, he’s been a solid pro. We lose a lot with him athletically compared to Trent but he’s still solid. Can Flowers be at least as good as Lauvao? I hope so.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

maybe since he's "back at his natural position as a G" .... smh one can friggin dream

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[quote=skinsfaninok;1228449]Not as worried about Penn as I am flowers[/quote]

minus the holding calls, Flowers can stand and be a big old obstacle as long as the OT is competent. On pure passing downs the Skins pass protection plan better not be the left side handles the pressure without help.

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The problem with our offense is that defenses are going to bring 8 in the box, stacking everything forward to stop the run. Guice and AP are exciting but if there are no holes, there’s only so much they can do.

That forces Case to throw passes to try to keep the offense going. The OL must protect Keenum during the obvious passing downs. Will the OL hold up to a real pass rush / blitz?

Finally, we have talented and new WR. But it will take awhile for these rookie WR to get in the groove


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