Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1158138]I said I think both coordinators should return next year, but I'd hope to see a drastic improvement in the red zone. Touchdowns and defense win championships.

There are always coaches available, including people we probably haven't heard about.[/quote]

On defense the logical choice would be Perry Fewell....on offense the Redskins could have Gruden call the plays... it's too much of a gamble for both of these idiots to return in 2017...., there's no guarantee the red zone offense would be better.

The coordinators
 

Keep Barry until we see what he can do with a tad bit of talent

Re: The coordinators
 

I feel that regardless if you keep Barry or bring in someone new, you need a significant upgrade in team speed. It was awful on Thanksgiving watch Dak run into the endzone while having Preston Smith and Will Compton chase him only to gain no ground on him. Also with increased team speed, it would allow players to make mistakes, but the ability to recover. I believe playing Cravens at safety, over Donte Whitner, these next four games would be a step in the right direction. It might not be a long term solution but would at least help the next four games, in my opinion.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=redskins4lif;1158152]I feel that regardless if you keep Barry or bring in someone new, you need a significant upgrade in team speed. It was awful on Thanksgiving watch Dak run into the endzone while having Preston Smith and Will Compton chase him only to gain no ground on him. Also with increased team speed, it would allow players to make mistakes, but the ability to recover. I believe playing Cravens at safety, over Donte Whitner, these next four games would be a step in the right direction. It might not be a long term solution but would at least help the next four games, in my opinion.[/quote]

Yea that would work.
Or we could have the ability to collapse the pocket and lay a slobberknocker on him for a 10 yard loss.

Re: The coordinators
 

[QUOTE=JPPT1974;1158140]Yeah as just give them time to really catch their act together. It starts with the Kirk Cousins and if the team lets him leave in FA, it would be a huge blow. But really think it is about trying to get to the next level and beyond.[/QUOTE]



[IMG]http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/e77b3fd795a7c3c97eb5ceacc206c235.jpg[/IMG]

Re: The coordinators
 

I don't think I can take another year of Barry. It comes down to the struggles on 3rd down. Last week was the back breaker. He should have came off the bus blitzing Palmer. And although he did blitz more, he wasn't really doing it on 3rd down, when it mattered most. He should have had the same game plan the Cardinals did and make Palmer uncomfortable. Watch this week, he'll let Wentz sit back in the pocket on 3rd down and only rush 4. It looks like he coaches scared on 3rd down. There is no reason why he shouldn't be getting after a rookie QB with shit wr's this week. He won't do it. He has to go.

Re: The coordinators
 

I don't have a huge problem with the Red Zone issues at the moment. We are still top 10 in points per drive in the NFL.

Biggest issues is we are LAST IN DRIVES PER GAME. Which means our defense NEVER gets off the field. So every drive must result in points.

I don't think people understand how great our offense has been this year. It's remarkable

The coordinators
 

If our defense was halfway decent we are 10-2 at least.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=punch it in;1158177]If our defense was halfway decent we are 10-2 at least.[/quote]

Agreed. Only game we really didn't have a chance to win was week 1 against Pittsburg. Other than that, all our losses are a few "coulda shoulda woulda" away from being wins...

What really bothers me with our defense is that in each and every single game, there is a moment when they seem to all be on fire and make some key stops... only to collapse a few minutes later on crucial drives!

That's frustrating but would tend to show this defense is only a few pieces away from being just good enough to allow this offense to make this team a really scary one.

Re: The coordinators
 

For starters, I can care less what our coordinators names are...I just want to see this team win.

But for argument's sake, if we're condemning Barry because he hasn't raised mediocre players to another level, can't the very same argument be made against McVay?

Prove to me that McVay has "schemed" his mediocre run blocking line in order to improve Red Zone scoring? Heck, we rarely call a running play down there & when we do, it's usually just stuffed.

I realize defending Barry gets a lot tougher & my main point on that is the talent drop off between offense & defense. To be honest, Scott McL's moves on that side of the ball just haven't panned out this year. Outside of CB, most areas are down.

Team speed is a big issue, especially at ILB and S.

In Barry's defense though, even though he gets ripped for not blitzing enough, this team is 7th in sacks and just one sack from tying for 4th place.

If Barry is the one who told McL to avoid Defense in the draft and sign Ziggy and Bruton, then I'm in agreement...time for him to go.

But, if he's playing the talent that he is handed, I'm not sure many DC's besides the top 2-3 coordinators would really have much of an improvement.

Again, I won't lose sleep on who our coordinators are, but I think trashing Barry is a little unfair.

Re: The coordinators
 

^ agreed.

Re: The coordinators
 

Well, I'm in the replace Barry camp, but AFAIC our main defensive woes fall on McCloo.
I'd rather use "good" guys that I acquire than take a chance on "molding" some third stringers into first stringers.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158184]For starters, I can care less what our coordinators names are...I just want to see this team win.

But for argument's sake, if we're condemning Barry because he hasn't raised mediocre players to another level, can't the very same argument be made against McVay?

Prove to me that McVay has "schemed" his mediocre run blocking line in order to improve Red Zone scoring? Heck, we rarely call a running play down there & when we do, it's usually just stuffed.

I realize defending Barry gets a lot tougher & my main point on that is the talent drop off between offense & defense. To be honest, Scott McL's moves on that side of the ball just haven't panned out this year. Outside of CB, most areas are down.

Team speed is a big issue, especially at ILB and S.

[B]In Barry's defense though, even though he gets ripped for not blitzing enough, this team is 7th in sacks and just one sack from tying for 4th place.
[/B]
If Barry is the one who told McL to avoid Defense in the draft and sign Ziggy and Bruton, then I'm in agreement...time for him to go.

[B]But, if he's playing the talent that he is handed, I'm not sure many DC's besides the top 2-3 coordinators would really have much of an improvement.[/B]

Again, I won't lose sleep on who our coordinators are, but I think trashing Barry is a little unfair.[/quote]

Absolutely true!

We also have to keep in mind he's a "young" defensive coordinator: second year!
To me he's learning, and we've seen some improvement, he's being more creative, bringing pressure, trying to adjust.
But he can only do so much. And when your safeties suck, it's hard to move people around. You don't want to leave receivers one on one against Whitner... or Blackmon... or Fuller... or Dunbar (even if I love the guy and he's improved a lot)... or Compton ... or even Cravens who is doing a good job in coverage, but not a great one.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158184]Team speed is a big issue, especially at ILB and S. [/quote]

This is a [U]huge[/U] issue. Week after week I see Joe Barry put players in position to make plays but they just can't get there in time to make a play because of lack of foot speed. That is not Joe Barry's fault.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=FrenchSkin;1158200]Absolutely true!

We also have to keep in mind he's a "young" defensive coordinator: second year!
To me he's learning, and we've seen some improvement, he's being more creative, bringing pressure, trying to adjust.
But he can only do so much. And when your safeties suck, it's hard to move people around. You don't want to leave receivers one on one against Whitner... or Blackmon... or Fuller... or Dunbar (even if I love the guy and he's improved a lot)... or Compton ... or even Cravens who is doing a good job in coverage, but not a great one.[/quote]

Speaking of Dunbar, has anyone else noticed he is an INCH away from a pick whenever someone makes a catch on him? He's usually step-for-step, but his hands JUST miss the ball. It's uncanny.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;1158215]Speaking of Dunbar, has anyone else noticed he is an INCH away from a pick whenever someone makes a catch on him? He's usually step-for-step, but his hands JUST miss the ball. It's uncanny.[/quote]

Right. That's what I meant when I said he's improved a lot. But I think these days with how the passing plays are officiated, only the great corners know how to play physical enough to make a play on the ball and still not get flagged. This has become tricky! They need to take the risk to get flagged, but play it safe enough to not get flagged at each play...

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=Bangee7;1158184]For starters, I can care less what our coordinators names are...I just want to see this team win.

Team speed is a big issue, especially at ILB and S.

[B]In Barry's defense though, even though he gets ripped for not blitzing enough, this team is 7th in sacks and just one sack from tying for 4th place.[/B]

If Barry is the one who told McL to avoid Defense in the draft and sign Ziggy and Bruton, then I'm in agreement...time for him to go.

But, if he's playing the talent that he is handed, I'm not sure many DC's besides the top 2-3 coordinators would really have much of an improvement.

Again, I won't lose sleep on who our coordinators are, but I think trashing Barry is a little unfair.[/quote]

Wow I did not know the defense was ranked that high in so many areas? Considering the derth of talent that is impressive.

Re: The coordinators
 

Barry is a bum coordinator. Period! He clueless when it comes to situational football.

Re: The coordinators
 

So, just throwing this out there ...

Anyone else realize that the recently fired Gus Bradley has connections to Jay Gruden, Bruce Allen [I][B]and[/B][/I] Scot McC?

- Bradley was TBay's LB coach from 2006-08 while BA was the GM (2004 - 08) and Gruden an offensive assistant (2002 -08).

- Bradley was Seahawks DC from 2009 - 12 while Scot McC a Senior Personnel Assistant (2010-2013).

In addition, per Twitter sources, Bradley was first hired into the pros by Monte Kiffin as a Quality Control Coach for TBay and was subsequently promoted to LB coach based on Joe Barry's suggestion when JB went to Detroit and, after Barry fired by Detroit and Bradley went to Seattle, Barry was rehired for as TBay's LB coach for the 2009 season.

If Barry doesn't turn it around in the next three games, I can see - and would have no problems with - Bradley being our next DC.

Re: The coordinators
 

Given that Bradley coached the Seattle defense to dominance with players acquired based on Scot McC's drafting, seems to me to be a very good match.

Re: The coordinators
 

Was Gus's success in Seattle due to the players he had or his own coaching? Seems like they did just fine without him at the Defensive helm..

Re: The coordinators
 

First thing I thought when hearing about Bradley is he should be on our short list if we make a change.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;1159120]Given that Bradley coached the Seattle defense to dominance with players acquired based on Scot McC's drafting, seems to me to be a very good match.[/quote]

That's an excellent point you made.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1158096]If McVay can't fix his red zone issues then he has to go. I'm sorry but getting all the way down the field and not scoring touchdowns with this talent is unacceptable. We score a lot but should score even more.

From last year thru the first part of this year I've been one of Barry's worst critics. He isn't aggressive enough for me. But the last few weeks, I've stopped blaming him for everything. We just don't have much talent on defense. If we had the same offensive talent as defensive we'd be a 4-12 team.

I think they should both come back next year. McVay works on his red zone calling and Barry gets another chance with more talent. Hopefully they can both improve.

I'm starting to like Jay Gruden, I hope he sticks around for awhile.[/quote]

McCloughan has to draft primarily defensive talent outside of a new running back....I truly don't want Barry to remain beyond this season. But I understand that he receives all sorts of blame that should go to the GM for lack of talent on defense. I think McCloughan has done an excellent job in finding football players to make this team competitive though...

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=MTK;1159128]First thing I thought when hearing about Bradley is he should be on our short list if we make a change.[/quote]

id say make it day 1 after the offseason, unless we win the Super bowl. Then Barry can stay another year, cause I need a reason to bitch after a super bowl win.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=MTK;1159128]First thing I thought when hearing about Bradley is he should be on our short list if we make a change.[/quote]

I would definitely bring him in for an interview, but if I'm not mistaken Gruden has total control over his coaching staff, and McC doesn't get involved with that. I'm sure McC would recommend Bradley based off Seattle, but ultimately it's up to Gruden.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=REDSKINS4ever;1159136]McCloughan has to draft primarily defensive talent outside of a new running back....I truly don't want Barry to remain beyond this season. But I understand that he receives all sorts of blame that should go to the GM for lack of talent on defense. I think McCloughan has done an excellent job in finding football players to make this team competitive though...[/quote]

Should we use a draft pick on a running back? I mean i thought all of us were pretty happy with "Fat" Rob even though he isn't really fast, but i feel like he is our perfect bruising running back that we haven't had for a long time...

Re: The coordinators
 

Either Fat Rob or Jones won't be here next year. They are too similar. Based on what I've seen Jones is gone. Any RB draft pick would be later though. I think the guy from Georgia replaces Jones. Besides drafting a guy that can play G/C every pick should be defensive guys. Let's give Barry a fair deck to play with.

Re: The coordinators
 

Joe Barry needs to go ASAP. Last night was a prime example, he's too scared to bring the heat and just let's every QB sit back and have all day to throw. Cam could have stood back there all night and had 500 yards passing if he really wanted too.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;1159569]Joe Barry needs to go ASAP. Last night was a prime example, he's too scared to bring the heat and just let's every QB sit back and have all day to throw. Cam could have stood back there all night and had 500 yards passing if he really wanted too.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk[/quote]

Barry isn't the one I'm mad at from this game...

Sure he could've bring more pressure, but defense made some stops.

Allowed two TD: one on a blown coverage, one were the Panthers got the ball on our 1 yard line following KC's fumble (following Vernon Davis shitty block).

Honestly I didn't expect that much out of them. Offense let them down big time, defense really did the best they could to keep this team in the game.

Re: The coordinators
 

Fire both coordinators. We can do better.

I'm not very happy with Jay Gruden, either. If he had quit after last night's putrid game, I wouldn't have minded one bit.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1159580]Fire both coordinators. We can do better.

I'm not very happy with Jay Gruden, either. If he had quit after last night's putrid game, I wouldn't have minded one bit.[/quote]

Well... that escalated quickly ^^

Last night was frustrating AF. But let's not forget we've had our two best seasons in many years, this year with a tough schedule, in an even tougher division, we can still make the playoffs, and with a good offseason and a few playmakers on defense (priority to DLs and safeties) we could be a legitimate contender next season.

Ne jetons le bébé avec l'eau du bain!

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;1159580]Fire both coordinators. We can do better.

I'm not very happy with Jay Gruden, either. If he had quit after last night's putrid game, I wouldn't have minded one bit.[/quote]

ha, ha...I feel the same way.

Ahh, the highs and LOWS of being a 'skins fan.

by the way...I'm officially on the band wagon now....

FIRE JOE BARRY!

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;1159162]Should we use a draft pick on a running back? I mean i thought all of us were pretty happy with "Fat" Rob even though he isn't really fast, but i feel like he is our perfect bruising running back that we haven't had for a long time...[/quote]

Dalvin Cook from Florida State is better than Kelley. I can see McCloughan drafting him.

The coordinators
 

[QUOTE=REDSKINS4ever;1159702]Dalvin Cook from Florida State is better than Kelley. I can see McCloughan drafting him.[/QUOTE]



Dalvin Cook is going to be a stud. Would love to have him. However there is no way he is there in round 5 and we best go with D for rounds 1-4!
If we pick offense in rounds 1-3 I do not think I will watch next year. I mean barring some miraculous turn around by the D this year that carries into the post season we just cannot afford to neglect the middle of our D again. I want a stud DT, and a stud MLB, and a stud DE in the first three freaking rounds. Would accept S or CB in there too. But we need serious upgrades at DT, MLB.

Re: The coordinators
 

If you do fire Barry do we even think about going back to a 4-3? I don't know that we can take another 1-2 years of personnel overhauling up front, even though we need it. Not to mention the impact it would have on Kerrigan/Murphy/Smith.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=mooby;1159728]If you do fire Barry do we even think about going back to a 4-3? I don't know that we can take another 1-2 years of personnel overhauling up front, even though we need it. Not to mention the impact it would have on Kerrigan/Murphy/Smith.[/quote]

I wouldn't worry about any impact the switch might have on Smith. He's practically useless now as an 3-4 OLB and he'd probably be useless as a 4-3 DE, as well.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=mooby;1159728]If you do fire Barry do we even think about going back to a 4-3? I don't know that we can take another 1-2 years of personnel overhauling up front, even though we need it. Not to mention the impact it would have on Kerrigan/Murphy/Smith.[/quote]

I wouldn't mind it. Like to see a shift back with sua Cravens on the outside, foster on the other side. Then we draft a fat beast DT, a thumper at middle linebacker and find a kam chancellor at strong safety. Kerrigan and Preston/Galette. Yes I'm giving junior another chance while resigning Trent Murphy.

We need to build up the middle folks on the defense, dt, ILB and strong safety.

It should be our primary focus this offseason

Re: The coordinators
 

They are already playing a significant amount of 4-3 defense. Kerrigan, Murphy, and Smith are in a 3 point stance, with Cravens at LB.

Re: The coordinators
 

[quote=Irrefutable;1159756]They are already playing a significant amount of 4-3 defense. Kerrigan, Murphy, and Smith are in a 3 point stance, with Cravens at LB.[/quote]

Very true. I'd say make it the base, replace ziggy with a bad ass dt, and a new MLB and a real strong safety. Up the middle.