Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

The men who witnessed this man take his life are most likely still in shock, they need time to digest what has just occurred.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;969550]I agree, sometimes the NFL IMO gets a little selfish, how does Romeo coach tomorrow? Or even sleep tonight? Seriously that's bush league IMO[/quote]

I believe it was Pioli who said to play the game today, because he didn't want to let the fans down. I think the fans would understand if they postponed this one, if I'm Romeo Crennel I'd be having a hard time thinking about coaching today.

Well the league could have overruled him and cancelled the game.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=redskins5044;969572]Well the league could have overruled him and cancelled the game.[/quote]

Could've/should've/would've. Read an article that said the ruling sentiment amongst the players was that they should play, to distract themselves from the pain. If that's how they feel I support it.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

Like others have said, they should cancel this game a least for a day. If you're KC how do you feel like playing a football game today? So sad.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=mooby;969573]Could've/should've/would've. Read an article that said the ruling sentiment amongst the players was that they should play, to distract themselves from the pain. If that's how they feel I support it.[/quote]

Most of these guys live by the regimented daily life football gives them. And often we have seen grief stricken players come out and play their best as they can focus on their work, instead of dealing (at that moment) with the painful reality.

sudden tragic death won't be overcome in one day, one week, or even one year. Short of just cancelling it, no amount of delay would change the emotional baggage that the Chiefs will be dealing with for the rest of the year.

That it happens so close to ST21's death anniversary I would think as Redskins fans we could understand a team's need to unite and drive forward under those circumstances.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/12/01/report-chiefs-captains-wanted-to-play-as-scheduled/]Report: Chiefs captains wanted to play as scheduled | ProFootballTalk[/url]

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=HailGreen28;969534]I think it's to their credit that they didn't.

Sorry if my sarcasm meter didn't pick that up. Still broken.[/quote]

Not even remotely being sarcastic. They should have been reporting on it

As for today's game. I can't imagine what it will be like even for the fans to walk through the parking lot. A tragic event all around.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

interesting take by Tom Jackson this morning...He's more concerned about Cassandra the murdered than girlfriend and her now parentless infant than if Belcher was a "good teamate and all that"...Said to remember Belcher was a murderer.

I tell ya, gotta agree. The man shouldnt be [B]celebrated[/B] today at all. Its certainly is tragic

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

This whole thing hits home with me as I lost a very close friend of mine about 5 years ago to the exact same thing. He shot his wife, and then turned the gun on himself while their 5 year old was outside playing. His kid runs into the house, and then goes next door to where the in-laws were living because he knew something was wrong.

It really is a shame. It saddens me that my friend is gone, but it also angers me he decided to murder his wife and leave his only child a orphan.

[url=http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/8177317.html]Boy Finds Parents Dead[/url]

I used to watch Redskins games with him and I think about him quite often during football season. :( I also agree with Chico (and Tom Jackson) that this day shouldn't be to mourn or celebrate Belcher's life as he was a murderer in the end.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=RGIII;969541]If I was his mother I'd be facing murder charges.[/quote]Self defence (or defense of another) should be a valid legal defense here.

I agree that we should not celebrate the death of a murderer. At the same time, something clearly was wrong with Belcher. I dont know his motivation but it seems he was consumed by remorse when the reality of what he had done confronted him.

In the end, it is simply a tragedy that left two young people dead and a child orphaned.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

God forgive these people. I'll try to do the same.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

Think the NFL is running comercials on domestic violence against women. Just don't understand how someone could do something like this.

[QUOTE=mooby;969573]Could've/should've/would've. Read an article that said the ruling sentiment amongst the players was that they should play, to distract themselves from the pain. If that's how they feel I support it.[/QUOTE]

That's how most players would probably feel. The NFL is a business and players are employees, the NFL has to look at it from a overall effect it had on the whole organization. Sometimes in life you are told what to do by your boss and you listen no matter how you feel.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

Very sad stuff happening in the NFL today.

Right on NFL.com's front page, they are now reporting that a groundskeeper for the Cleveland Browns was found dead at the facility, he had hung himself in a maintenance shed or something like that.

I fear that this is the beginning of a string of tragedies involving NFL teams, i just think that two deaths like this in the same day is a grisly sign of what could come. I pray that is not the case but it sure seems that way....

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

They actually interviewed Vinny for a reference on how another team handled the death of a player at which point I thought, finally something where Vinny can actually contribute which he did for the most part. Talking about the differences in the timeline since it was at the beginning of the week not the day before a game and how they brought in counselors to talk with the team. Even talking about how close Landry was to Taylor and how Sean carpooled with him to practice and games.

Then of course in typical Vinny fashion he screwed it up revealing how Landry had cried after Sean's death, which is obviously normal. I'm sure a lot of us shed tears after the death of 21 but you don't just go on radio and mention someone specifically crying. Heck even Spoelstra in his blunder with the Heat knew not to name names.

[QUOTE=Dirtbag59;969608]They actually interviewed Vinny for a reference on how another team handled the death of a player at which point I thought, finally something where Vinny can actually contribute which he did for the most part. Talking about the differences in the timeline since it was at the beginning of the week not the day before a game and how they brought in counselors to talk with the team. Even talking about how close Landry was to Taylor and how Sean carpooled with him to practice and games.

Then of course in typical Vinny fashion he screwed it up revealing how Landry had cried after Sean's death, which is obviously normal. I'm sure a lot of us shed tears after the death of 21 but you don't just go on radio and mention someone specifically crying. Heck even Spoelstra in his blunder with the Heat knew not to name names.[/QUOTE]

Situations totally different, this guy murdered his GF and then killed himself at team facility in front of members of chiefs.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

Shades of the Ray Carruth murders. Belcher must've had some serious demons. I doubt this is brain injury related. Too early in his career to have that kind of brain damage.

Totally assuming (meaning I'm probably completely wrong), when someone kills their partner and then themselves, it sounds like some sort of ensuing breakup. Going to render a guess that the girlfriend may have threatened to leave and take the baby with her.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

In reports, they had stated that he and his girlfriend had been arguing all night since she had come home "Late" from a concert the night before the shooting....

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=redskins5044;969614]Situations totally different, this guy murdered his GF and then killed himself at team facility in front of members of chiefs.[/quote]

True but the underlying topic is the same. How do teams deal with a tragedies that result in death. They were different types no doubt. Murder suicide is worlds different from a guy defending his family from a home invasion. However disbelief, grief, sadness, confusion, etc. All those emotions still come into play.

The main challenge for the Chiefs is how do they reconcile the teammate they thought they knew with the guy who committed an absolutely heinous act.

[QUOTE=Dirtbag59;969633]True but the underlying topic is the same. How do teams deal with a tragedies that result in death. They were different types no doubt. Murder suicide is worlds different from a guy defending his family from a home invasion. However disbelief, grief, sadness, confusion, etc. All those emotions still come into play.

The main challenge for the Chiefs is how do they reconcile the teammate they thought they knew with the guy who committed an absolutely heinous act.[/QUOTE]

Only thing similar is someone died, but everyone in this world at one time or another has to deal with death. That's just the way life is, but for people to witness someone kill themselves in a public place at their work center is totally different.

Some people might be affected by that for the rest of their life.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[url=http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8701601/clark-hunt-owner-kansas-city-chiefs-says-many-people-hurting-wake-jovan-belcher-murder-suicide]Clark Hunt, owner of Kansas City Chiefs says 'so many people are hurting' in wake of Jovan Belcher murder-suicide - ESPN[/url]


Romeo's post game press conference.

[url=http://www.nfl.com/videos/auto/0ap2000000104340/Romeo-Crennel-It-was-a-total-team-victory]Romeo Crennel: 'It was a total team victory' - NFL Videos[/url]

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=SolidSnake84;969606]Very sad stuff happening in the NFL today.

Right on NFL.com's front page, they are now reporting that a groundskeeper for the Cleveland Browns was found dead at the facility, he had hung himself in a maintenance shed or something like that.

I fear that this is the beginning of a string of tragedies involving NFL teams, i just think that two deaths like this in the same day is a grisly sign of what could come. I pray that is not the case but it sure seems that way....[/quote]
[url=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2241928/Browns-employee-suicide-NFL-grounds-keeper-kills-day-Kansas-City-player-committed-suicide-Arrowhead-Stadium.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490]Browns employee suicide: NFL grounds keeper kills himself on same day Kansas City player committed suicide at Arrowhead Stadium | Mail Online[/url]

If I'm correct that's now three people who have killed themself at an NFL facility this season.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

Brady Quinn had maybe his best day ever as an NFL QB on the field yesterday...and yet he easily topped it with his post game presser

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

I don't know how true this is coming from the NY Post:

[url=http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/girlfriend_running_friends_belcher_OGIdPQMQWl3vKf4Jasj5EP]Chiefs linebacker Belcher struggled with head injuries, alcohol and painkillers before he snapped and killed girlfriend: report - NYPOST.com[/url]

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=SmootSmack;969805]Brady Quinn had maybe his best day ever as an NFL QB on the field yesterday...and yet he easily topped it with his post game presser[/quote]

I was thinking the same thing when I heard it. Very well spoken by him.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

PK said it best in his MMQB column about being in Piolis shoes when belcher has a gun and says I want to speak to coach crennel and coach gibbs...you have no idea what he's going to do with that gun and your coaches whom this man in distress is trying to talk to..

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[url=http://www.kansascity.com/2012/12/04/3946159/belcher-shot-himself-as-kc-police.html]Exclusive: As troubles at home simmered, Chiefs tried to help Javon Belcher - KansasCity.com[/url]

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[url=http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-around-the-league/0ap2000000105854/NFL-to-provide-benefits-for-Jovan-Belcher-s-daughter]NFL to provide benefits for Jovan Belcher's daughter - NFL Videos[/url]


Good to hear that little girl will be taken care of financially. Let's hope her caretaker isn't some leech and steal all her money.





[url=http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8713273/jovan-belcher-mom-begs-dying-woman-live-911-call]Jovan Belcher's mom begs dying woman to live while on 911 call - ESPN[/url]

Heartbreaking. Would be tough for any mother to have to suffer this.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

The weird indirect link back to the redskins that no one seems to remember is Bryan Kehl. He was the backup ilb to Belcher in kc just days before the incident.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

It's harsh to say, and not that this would ever happen, but the best thing for that little girl (who is only three months old and would never know) would be for her to be adopted by loving and devoted stragers and her name changed. She would be better off growing up never knowing what happened to her parents. No matter what suport she gets now from family, knowing that your father murdererd your mother strikes me as impossible to recover from.

The whole thing is so awful.

I think its horrible they had a tribute in his locker. The dude is a murderer. He has ****ed up his daughters life who has lost both her parents forever. His own mother cannot be rite after seeing this. The coach and the gm. Not to mention all of his girlfriends friends and family. No sympathy whatsoever for this guy only the people he has hurt and traumatized. This is nothing, i repeat, nothing - like Junior Seau. This guy is a coward in every sense of the word.

[QUOTE=Chico23231;969589]interesting take by Tom Jackson this morning...He's more concerned about Cassandra the murdered than girlfriend and her now parentless infant than if Belcher was a "good teamate and all that"...Said to remember Belcher was a murderer.

I tell ya, gotta agree. The man shouldnt be [B]celebrated[/B] today at all. Its certainly is tragic[/QUOTE]

Good for Tom Jackson. So glad you posted this. So true. Ive been bothered all week by the talk about Belcher. The only thing tragic is that he killed someone, traumatized others, and orphaned his little girl. How dare they celebrate or speak of him as anything other than a selfish and cold blooded killer.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

I'm sure it's extremely difficult for his friends and teammates to suddenly just forget everything they shared with him that none of us did

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=punch it in;971925]The only thing tragic is that he killed someone, traumatized others, and orphaned his little girl. How dare they celebrate or speak of him as anything other than a selfish and cold blooded killer.[/quote]

Because to them he was a friend, a teammate, a family member...someone who mattered to them. Ultimately what he did in the end defines him but to the people who knew him there's no switch to forget all the stuff they loved.

To you, someone who didn't know him, its easy to just define him as a killer because that's all you know of him.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=FRPLG;971966]Because to them he was a friend, a teammate, a family member...someone who mattered to them. Ultimately what he did in the end defines him but to the people who knew him there's no switch to forget all the stuff they loved.

To you, someone who didn't know him, its easy to just define him as a killer because that's all you know of him.[/quote]

Well said.

It's a tragedy from many different angles.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=FRPLG;971966]Because to them he was a friend, a teammate, a family member...someone who mattered to them. Ultimately what he did in the end defines him but to the people who knew him there's no switch to forget all the stuff they loved.

To you, someone who didn't know him, its easy to just define him as a killer because that's all you know of him.[/quote]

Very well said.

I'm sick of these mindless babbling morons that talk about him being a coward, a killer, etc., etc. all to win an argument on the internet (you should see the comments section on ESPN.com, ridiculous).

This whole situation is a tragedy for everyone involved. Part of that tragedy is whatever went wrong in the mind of Belcher that drove him to commit such terrible act.

It's just sad situation all around.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=FRPLG;971966]Because to them he was a friend, a teammate, a family member...someone who mattered to them. Ultimately what he did in the end defines him but to the people who knew him there's no switch to forget all the stuff they loved.

To you, someone who didn't know him, its easy to just define him as a killer because that's all you know of him.[/quote]

Although internally, it might be hard for them to reconcile what their friend and team mate did, having a tribute at his locker is incredibly inappropriate.

If one of your friends from work were secretly a terrorist and strapped c4 to his body, walked on a schoolbus, and blew everyone up, would you hold a memorial for him at work? You knew him as a nice guy, and it would be hard for you to reconcile your friendship with him with his last actions, but out of respect for those he killed and general human decency, you wouldnt memorialize him in any public way.

its understandable that theyre having a hard time coping with Belchers actions and death, but by setting up a tribute at Belchers locker, the Chiefs have shown gross disrespect to his victims family.

Re: KC Chiefs' Player Commits Murder-Suicide
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;972003]Although internally, it might be hard for them to reconcile what their friend and team mate did, having a tribute at his locker is incredibly inappropriate.

If one of your friends from work were secretly a terrorist and strapped c4 to his body, walked on a schoolbus, and blew everyone up, would you hold a memorial for him at work? You knew him as a nice guy, and it would be hard for you to reconcile your friendship with him with his last actions, but out of respect for those he killed and general human decency, you wouldnt memorialize him in any public way.

its understandable that theyre having a hard time coping with Belchers actions and death, but by setting up a tribute at Belchers locker, the Chiefs have shown gross disrespect to his victims family.[/quote]

I hadn't heard they had a tribute to him. I'd have to see what "tribute" meant. But I can definitely see how it could be disrespectful. My point is that it isn't just a binary decision. You are what you've done. ALL of what you've done.

BTW...in my opinion equating murdering in the heat of the moment to executing a premeditated terrorist attack that kills dozens of innocent bystanders is a little off. Not that either is "better" but they're not the same thing at all. One takes actual pure evil...the other takes...well whatever it takes in whatever the given circumstance is.