Re: Post Indy Game Thoughts
 

[quote=NC_Skins;933826]It really is hard to gauge how well our guys played due to the lack of talent they were playing against. The Colts were a #1 draft pick team for a reason and much of the talent that was on it has vacated this off-season. Their defense is atrocious and hasn't been able to stop the run in over a decade.

I would prefer to measure their play on the Buffalo and Chicago games as compared to this. I would like to see RGIII connect on a few long passes though.[/quote]

I agree the colts are really really bad, Luck is gonna need some.

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[quote=NC_Skins;933826]I would prefer to measure their play on the Buffalo and Chicago games as compared to this. I would like to see RGIII connect on a few long passes though.[/quote]Yeah, if the Chicago game's any indication: Our OL and secondary is gonna be eaten alive at times, and it's going to be another long season for us. Here's hoping for better, when real games are played.

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LB group continues to show they are good and deep.

WR group is starting to make some noise. Although I agree with the earlier comment that Hankerson is being pushed for his starting position. Not sure Hankerson has earned his starting spot by his play on the game field, more like it was given to him. Josh Morgan and Briscoe are intriguing and they are producing. Garcon needs a legitimate threat on the other side and Hankerson has shown very little.

M.Williams days as our starting FS might be numbered. Luck targeted him as the weak link the entire time Madieu was in the game. Immediately after Luck's 31 yard TD Madieu was removed; T. Jackson slid over to FS from SS and Gomes came in at SS. That line up looked and played more solid. It is a matter of time and the health of T. Jackson before he is our FS. He showed skill yesterday on the field.
I have been critical of Josh Wilson in the past, but yesterday he played a really sound game. Not just his coverage skills, which were good, but his run support and tackling were great. He is a smart player and understands how to take correct angles when tackling. Teams will still try and exploit his lack of height.

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[quote=Bucket;933832]PG is our best WR on the team at the moment. There is a reason why RG3 keeps throwing his direction. I believe he's been targeted the most in preseason when the starters are out there.

I do think that Shanny's are babying RG3 at the moment and that could be because it's preseason and he's trying to evaluate others but besides the 3 long throws yesterday, there hasn't been a lot of long passes. RG3 threw 17 passes yesterday and didn't even throw for 100 yards.

I believe the same can be said about the other games as well. Game 2 he threw 14 for 50 yards?

A lot of underneath and short throws..[/quote]

We've had QB stat lines in the 150-250 yard range for too long, especially during the Campbell era. It's a 300-400 yard league now.

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impressed w morris, jackson, and briscoe

still want to see more from our secondary, and a lot more from our o-line

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Hopefully beating up on a really bad team gives the team some confidence going into the season but there hasn't been game planning yet or defenses gearing to take away specific offensive plays. IMO a lot this season depends on offensive playcalling. Yes Rex forced a lot last season but the playcalling was abysmal. The one thing preseason can't tell us is if Kyle will remain patient in the calls.
Griffin can make all the throws. Morris is improving drastically in blitz pick up and could be a great contributor if not starter. IMO Garcon, Moss, Cooley and Davis will alternately have big games this season but I doubt there'll be a 1000 yd receiver on the team. Hankerson and Paul drop too many and Briscoe is still raw on his routes for any to top 100 yd games.
Defensively the front seven looks great and I wouldn't be surprised if a LB cut doesn't wind up on someone elses roster before the season starts. Dropped ints are a big concern for me. We need to some short fields this year.

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[quote=rypper11;933845]IMO Garcon, Moss, Cooley and Davis will alternately have big games this season but I doubt there'll be a 1000 yd receiver on the team.[/quote]

Oh see i think your so wrong there. It looks like Garcon and RG3 have some real chemistry. If both players play all 16 games i see garcon going for over 80 catches and over 1100 yards. Because they connect a lot and Garcon can easily average over 14 yards a catch with his RAC ability.

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griffin iii to garcon is going to be very prolific

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First, it was good to have a good win after the Bears killed us last week with the pass rush. I'm not as negative as GTripp seems to be, but I agree in principle -- in that we should all temper our expectations for this year -- but look forward to success for the next decade.

1) O-LINE: They did well this game. But the Colts pass rush is not as good as the Bears. And not as good as Dallas, Giants, and Eagles. At this point, RG3 is like every other QB on the planet -- he will struggle if the O-line struggles. He's dynamic and can run, but cannot evade multiple D-linemen coming in unprotected. I'm hoping they gel quickly, as they all have been injured & have not played together as a unit much. Hoping to upgrade here long-term if our youth doesn't develop quickly. Our cap hit killed us here and the secondary.

2) QB - RG3 has been good, and still developing. I loved seeing him take off running -- but pull up to deliver a crisp pass. Much rather see that than have him run & take the hits. The long ball should come with time & practice w our receivers. Rex is still a great QB most of the time -- that kills you with turnovers in key situations -- but doesn't deserve to be boo'ed. Was at the game & I was disappointed in our fans.

3) WR/TE - The deep balls were overthrown, but the bigger issue is the WR's did not have much separation. Briscoe seems like a keeper. Banks may be out. Hank dropped pass. Moss seems too old to be running back punts, I'm scared for him and beginning to think he has some injury clause in his contract. Why else does a 33yr old volunteer for punts? Glad to see Davis finally caught a pass - I'm not sure why we're not using Davis but can only assume we're testing the new guys & he will break out during the season. Watching Cooley catch that 5 yard pass and fall down -- was nostalgic but made me think about his $6 million contract.

3) SECONDARY - Still a concern, still making changes. Hopefully someone steps up. As we face the Brees, Mannings, Romos, Vicks of the world -- we're going to need our 3rd and 4th string CBs and safeties to be much better with all of the multi-receiver offenses. Even the Colts were moving the ball on us, and Luck was on pace for a ~300 yd passing game. Will be a long season.

4) MORRIS - Welcome to the roster. True to form, any Shanahan RB seems to do well with the zone blocking. Good game, but at this point they're interchangeable.


Will say that Fletcher makes our defense better, glad he's back & healthy.

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[quote=GTripp0012;933811]What do you guys think of RG3 through the preseason? About expected? A little better than?[/quote]

It's too tough to tell cause it's pre season and no one is game planning, mixing coverages and showing blitz packages. I will say this. He certainly doesn't look like Heath Shuler back there. We finally got to see that he's potentially a great deep ball thrower. Love the quick release, so far so good but I will reserve any real judgement until week one.

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My favorite free agent pick up other than garcon and morgan is Tanard Jackson he showed a little of what he can do last night, I think he brings some ball hawking skills that we havent had back there since Sean, he will create turnovers, I jut hope merriweather can have a good year as well which I think he can. My bigger concern is the o-line, although they played good last night.

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[quote=skinsfaninok;933778]1. GRIFFIN played very well, unfortunately he couldn't connect on a deep pass but it will come. He has all the tools to become an elite QB.
Andrew Luck is the real deal as well, he can move way better than ppl think and his accuracy is Manning like.

2. Trent Williams absolutely dominated the colts, both pass and run blocking. He's a top ten LT and continues to show it.

3. Defense played very well especially front 7. I think the starters had 3 sacks which is great. Wilson and hall played well as did Jackson.

[B]4. Morris is the new Starter no doubt, the guy isn't a star but he's Better than the rest of our backs. Roy helu could be but he can't stay healthy[/B].

5. We r deep at WR, a position we were so weak at a year ago. GARCON, Moss, Hank, Morgan, Briscoe. Not to mention our stacked TEs. Very excited[/quote]

I think he starts too. I love the way he runs. No nonsense, makes one cut and runs violent.

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I can't see why we couldn't go 8-8 or even above .500. Everyone is sharp on both sides of the ball pretty much. Do you guys think we try to trade Hightower? Can we trade Hightower? I like AH, but I don't think we can have 4 RBs as we lack depth in other areas.

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The Redskins will make the playoffs this year, laugh all you want. They were 5-11 last year, lost many close games, had many injuries and shitty QB play. This year we have a rookie QB who is light years better than last year, a better OL, WR, TE, LB, DL and depth. The only weakness and it actually could be an improvent is the secondary, but it is still flawed somewhat.

[QUOTE=SFREDSKIN;933908]The Redskins will make the playoffs this year, laugh all you want. They were 5-11 last year, lost many close games, had many injuries and shitty QB play. This year we have a rookie QB who is light years better than last year, a better OL, WR, TE, LB, DL and depth. The only weakness and it actually could be an improvent is the secondary, but it is still flawed somewhat.[/QUOTE]

Amen bro! I say 9-7 but idk if that's enough

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[quote=That Guy;933788]it was a good showing against a BAD team. lots to like, but i still want to see it translate to the saints game ;)[/quote]

We will eat up their D, or we could at least, it is not much to fear without Smith, and Vilma.

That is really a test to see how far our D has come.

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there is no excuse not to put up points against N.O.. If we don't come out with at least 21 points I'd be worried

Re: Post Indy Game Thoughts
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;933919]there is no excuse not to put up points against N.O.. If we don't come out with at least 21 points I'd be worried[/quote]

Yeah, but it's gonna take 40 to beat them.

[QUOTE=JoeRedskin;933938]Yeah, but it's gonna take 40 to beat them.[/QUOTE]

True

Re: Post Indy Game Thoughts
 

Opening with the Saints away is a tough way to start a season.

[QUOTE=artmonkforhallofamein07;933950]Opening with the Saints away is a tough way to start a season.[/QUOTE]

Not after we go there and steal a win. Every season there is a surprise win on opening day, why not be us?

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[quote=skinsfaninok;933955]Not after we go there and steal a win. Every season there is a surprise win on opening day, why not be us?[/quote]

F yeah.

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[quote=skinsfaninok;933955]Not after we go there and steal a win. Every season there is a surprise win on opening day, why not be us?[/quote]

I expect us to win that game against a team who's missing their best coaches and half their defense, a new guard, and different wideouts. Especially if sproles is hurt still.

[QUOTE=CultBrennan59;933968]I expect us to win that game against a team who's missing their best coaches and half their defense, a new guard, and different wideouts. Especially if sproles is hurt still.[/QUOTE]

Exactly.. only thing is keeping them off them field

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Thought the win over Indy showed some real good things. RGIII has elite talent. We have a great competition going at WR. Morgan has already flashed some awesomeness and Hankerson seems to have great hands. The last two WRs to make the final cut should have great potential.

Morris...deserves his own paragraph. Ran against the first teamers behind a pretty underwhelming line and consistently gained ground. Hopefully next year between a fully recovered Hightower, Morris and healed up Helu as our change-of-pace threat we'll be a dominant rushing offense.

And the defense is already solid as long as Fletcher is on the field. If the secondary can tighten things up it could be a special defense.

...definitely looking forward to the opener :)

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Lot's of optimism around here. Indy is a bad football team people. They won 2 games last year. Anyone remember the Bears game? Their 1st team against ours?

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Indy isn't the same team that went 2-14. Who knows if they're any better yet, but just saying it's not the same team at all.

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[quote=skinsfan69;934085]Lot's of optimism around here. Indy is a bad football team people. They won 2 games last year. Anyone remember the Bears game? Their 1st team against ours?[/quote]

so we crushed them like we should have...i think its a positive when we beat a team we should beat.

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[quote=skinsfaninok;933783]How about Niles Paul returning kicks??? He's a TE?? Lol geez I really don't remember having so much speed on our team than we do now.[/quote]

I loved it. He's huge and can bowl over the backup WRs and CBs that the other teams use as gunners. We saw the damage he can cause in kickoff collisions last year (Rams game) so lets give him the ball to run over people...no flags!

I also read this morning that Santana Moss personally asked to be put on punt returns. He's slimmed down and is faster than the last couple of years and reportedly told the coaches "I'm here if Brandon Banks stubs a toe."

I think Banks might be out despite his big return game last week. We have so many options.

Austin saw a lot more action this week. I don't remember seeing Robinson.

If I had to bet on the WRs, we're going with:

Garcon
Moss
Hankerson
Morgan
Briscoe
Robinson


Kick and punt returns will be handled by any of: Robinson/Paul/Moss/Richard Crawford.

Banks is still doing what he does on returns, but Coach Shanahan CLEARLY said he needs to produce as a WR to make the team. 2 catches, 7 yards in 3 games and he has had plenty of targets.

Aldrick Robinson has 8 catches for 132 yards and a TD, including a 49-yard long. Banks and Robinson have identical 25.5 yard averages on kick returns. Briscoe has a team-leading 2 TD catches. Moss, Garcon, Paul, Morgan and Robinson all have 1.


Side note...Alfred Morris is the man. He's our guy, with Hightower on passing downs until Helu comes back...I like that setup.

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[quote=skinsfan69;934085]Lot's of optimism around here. Indy is a bad football team people. They won 2 games last year. Anyone remember the Bears game? Their 1st team against ours?[/quote]

Bad teams we played last season:

Cardinals, W 22-21
Rams, W 17-10
[B]Bills, L 23-0[/B]
[B]Dolphins, L 20-9[/B]
Seahawks, W 23-17
[B]Vikings, L 33-26
[/B]

See the reason for excitement now? Even our wins against the worst teams in the league, we couldn't take them by more than 7 points. I just re-watched that Cardinals win last week and it was a nail-biter.

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[quote=Monkeydad;934094]Bad teams we played last season:

Cardinals, W 22-21
Rams, W 17-10
[B]Bills, L 23-0[/B]
[B]Dolphins, L 20-9[/B]
Seahawks, W 23-17
[B]Vikings, L 33-26[/B]


See the reason for excitement now? Even our wins against the worst teams in the league, we couldn't take them by more than 7 points. I just re-watched that Cardinals win last week and it was a nail-biter.[/quote]

I think we're better on paper but paper doesn't win games. Not getting my hopes up after a convincing win over a bad team in pre season. If we lose to New Orleans, which I think we will, I want to see a close game in which the offense scores points. Then I'll have some optimism. We've been down the pre season hype road before. See Osaka.

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[quote=GTripp0012;933811]What do you guys think of RG3 through the preseason? About expected? A little better than?[/quote]Reaffirmation:

o quick release
o quick feet
o escapability
o long ball distance
o touch
o velocity to throw the deep sideline out
o ability to go throw progressions
o poise

I felt Griffin was very closely (too) managed through preseason.
They seemed very averse to letting him throw against tough coverages and they limited his pure drop back rhythm passing reps.

I can't wait to see the shotgun/pistol read option elements of the offense.

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[quote=30gut;934122]Reaffirmation:

o quick release
o quick feet
o escapability
o long ball distance
o touch
o velocity to throw the deep sideline out
o ability to go throw progressions
o poise

I felt Griffin was very closely (too) managed through preseason.
They seemed very averse to letting him throw against tough coverages and they limited his pure drop back rhythm passing reps.

I can't wait to see the shotgun/pistol read option elements of the offense.[/quote]
Yeah I agree, one thing I really noticed this preseason was how contained Mike and Kyle kept RG3 this preseason. You could tell on a couple of plays where RG3 would take off and run. They only did to my knowledge one bootleg play. 1 screen play. And they did what looked like a QB option but with the RB taking the ball regardless. When the season starts in less than 2 weeks, the shanahans will unleash the beast.

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[quote=30gut;934122]Reaffirmation:

o quick release
o quick feet
o escapability
o long ball distance
o touch
o velocity to throw the deep sideline out
o ability to go throw progressions
o poise

I felt Griffin was very closely (too) managed through preseason.
They seemed very averse to letting him throw against tough coverages and they limited his pure drop back rhythm passing reps.

I can't wait to see the shotgun/pistol read option elements of the offense.[/quote]

I agree with this post all around. I was very disappointed in the way Gryphon was used in the preseason and I think we needed more practice of option plays in live situations. But, full disclosure, these comments reflect more my impatience to see him bring it and less a cogent critique of the Shanahans.

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[quote=GTripp0012;933791]On the other hand, the more I see of the Redskins offense, the more I'm convinced that its just not all that different from either of the last two years.....But I feel like at 9 positions on the offense (everything except QB and LT), the Redskins aren't improved and in some cases have taken a step back.[/quote]I think the base offense will be the same.
But, judging by all the off-season training camp reports there are going to be some read option elements added to the offense.

I think removing Jammal Brown from the line-up is addition by subtraction.
Not that Polumbus is a world beater just that he's slightly better then Brown.
I think depth along the OL has improved.
I think WR is the area we've improved the most outside of QB.
A healthy Tana + Garcon imo is an improvement over an injured Moss and Gaffney.
Briscoe and Morgan improve the depth and provide some bigger targets and
whatever Hankerson can bring is a bonus.

I think the running game has taken a step back due to injury.
I think Helu was the most complete back on the roster and he might be out of action for awhile losing him was a huge loss.
I like Royster too but he's also banged up with a knee.
THT is coming off a knee.
We enter the season with only 1 100% healthy RB.

I agree that the offenses pieces haven't improved by much outside of QB.
But, the improvement an elite QB prospect can provide is huge.

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[quote=REDSKINS4ever;933822]Griffin III played wonderfully in preseason. A 103.0 QB rating ain't bad.[/quote]

I think that rating is in part because of the conservative play calling. It's not always a good thing for a QB to go without throwing ints. I think all great QB's have their share of ints because they make plays happen by putting the ball in tight windows. If your always taking the easy stuff your not going to be an elite QB in the NFL.

I also think Morris is going to be our starting RB. It seems like flows down the line and knows when to make the cut a go up field. Our other RB's seem to try and force the play instead of waiting for it to form.

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[quote=firstdown;934177]I think that rating is in part because of the conservative play calling. It's not always a good thing for a QB to go without throwing ints. I[B] think all great QB's have their share of ints because they make plays happen by putting the ball in tight windows. If your always taking the easy stuff your not going to be an elite QB in the NFL.[/B]

I also think Morris is going to be our starting RB. It seems like flows down the line and knows when to make the cut a go up field. Our other RB's seem to try and force the play instead of waiting for it to form.[/quote]

I really hope RG3 is aggressive come week one. If he throws a few picks then so what cause I think he's going to make more positive than negative. Hell look at all the int's Eli and Peyton throw. Brady had 4 in one game last year.

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His rating is also a product of bland defensive pressure. The regular season is a different animal altogether. The only thing i've been impressed with through the preseason has been the lack of INTs. But i balance that excitement with his fumble.

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[quote=skinsfan69;934206]I really hope RG3 is aggressive come week one. If he throws a few picks then so what cause I think he's going to make more positive than negative. Hell look at all the int's Eli and Peyton throw. Brady had 4 in one game last year.[/quote]

I'm not looking for him to play like Brett F but I don't mind a few picks when he is trying to make plays.

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[quote=firstdown;934228]I'm not looking for him to play like Brett F but I don't mind a few picks when he is trying to make plays.[/quote]

Hey now. Other than the Wrangler commercials, Something about Mary, and his hair cut in Atlanta, what do you have against Brett Favre?