Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1252759]Lol 18 murdered in a single day in a US city and nobody gives a flying fuck and nobody should...got it.

Yet a some bullshit 75 year old gets pushed down after he put his hands on a cop = panties in a bunch.

Lol amazing[/quote]

What was the Republican solution to citizen on citizen violence that they apparently haven't been able to enact yet? Just curious because I wasn't aware that was an easily solvable problem.

LEO on citizen violence is easy to make noise about because LEO are trusted with higher authority. They have the authority to end a citizen's life on their word alone, which is exactly what would've happened if somebody didn't film Floyd's death. 10 out of 10 times a judge is going to take an officer's word over a citizen's.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=mooby;1252780]What was the Republican solution to citizen on citizen violence that they apparently haven't been able to enact yet? Just curious because I wasn't aware that was an easily solvable problem.

LEO on citizen violence is easy to make noise about because LEO are trusted with higher authority. They have the authority to end a citizen's life on their word alone, which is exactly what would've happened if somebody didn't film Floyd's death. 10 out of 10 times a judge is going to take an officer's word over a citizen's.[/quote]

Hard to legislate making people value life. Definitely no easy fix. Most of the changes need to be made individually and at the community level, not in state capitals/DC.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=MTK;1252775]I read that at least 8 people have lost eyes due to rubber bullets and cops are apparently aiming for the head


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/quote]

Yeah cops are aiming for eyes...I’m sure

Look if you don’t want to be a cyclops, how about not riot? That would be nice

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1252783]Yeah cops are aiming for eyes...I’m sure

Look if you don’t want to be a cyclops, how about not riot? That would be nice[/quote]

So you think no peaceful protesters have been injured? Just rioters and looters?

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

Yeah I tend to believe headshots are intentional. Cops know what they're doing with a gun.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=mooby;1252780]What was the Republican solution to citizen on citizen violence that they apparently haven't been able to enact yet? Just curious because I wasn't aware that was an easily solvable problem.

LEO on citizen violence is easy to make noise about because LEO are trusted with higher authority. They have the authority to end a citizen's life on their word alone, which is exactly what would've happened if somebody didn't film Floyd's death. 10 out of 10 times a judge is going to take an officer's word over a citizen's.[/quote]

“Citizen on citizen violence” or 87 shootings with 18 murders within 24 hours. Don’t try to make it pretty, it ain’t and it’s a fuckin embarrassment.

Policy wise there is a lot id do...but fuck that mooby, let’s talk about woke-actions and power to the people:

Well first thing we are gonna do is march, then make some signs, maybe riot and loot some shoe stores, ( BYOSP)bring your own spray paint and vandalize, yell “defund gang activity”, some smoke weed, and then do the same thing tomorrow. You in?

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=MTK;1252785]Yeah I tend to believe headshots are intentional. Cops know what they're doing with a gun.[/quote]

Look we are all mad and demand change for the injustice over the muder of George Floyd. But we need to stop with the cop hate, it’s a bit much. They are not using these tactics on peaceful protest. A lot of the protest have been violent with attacks on police as well as looting and rioting...it will not be tolerated...it’s that simple. Peaceful protest or run the risk of rubber bullets.

I see a lot of folks in the pictures wearing them like a lil badge of courage...they def gonna be showing them off to friends.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[URL="https://www.businessinsider.com/nypd-officer-shoves-woman-george-floyd-protests-video-2020-5"]NYPD officer violently shoves woman during George Floyd protest, prompting city councilman to call for assault charge[/URL]

What about this? Was she rioting?

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

Without even doing any research, my knowledge of ballistics from being a life long gun owner and being able to shoot right off my back porch tells me rubber bullets are probably less accurate than a bullet fired from a smooth bore pre civil war muzzle loading rifle. As trained with other weapons cops are aiming for center mass, bullet paths from rubber bullets are erratic and can end up in a very wide pattern.

Of course cop hating liberals that would not know a 9mm from a pellet pistol know more about ballistics than I do. They believe cops can easily hit someone in the eye on purpose with a rubber bullet, probably because that is what the liberal media leads them to believe.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1252790]Without even doing any research, my knowledge of ballistics from being a life long gun owner and being able to shoot right off my back porch tells me rubber bullets are probably less accurate than a bullet fired from a smooth bore pre civil war muzzle loading rifle. As trained with other weapons cops are aiming for center mass, bullet paths from rubber bullets are erratic and can end up in a very wide pattern.

Of course cop hating liberals that would not know a 9mm from a pellet pistol know more about ballistics than I do. They believe cops can easily hit someone in the eye on purpose with a rubber bullet, probably because that is what the liberal media leads them to believe.[/quote]

Excellent point Bob.

I agree with you.

If rubber bullets are so erratic and inaccurate that it is forseeable and likely that they will cause headshots and blindness and brain bleeding and loss of testicles, despite aiming for center mass .... then they should not be used.

On people standing ... during the daytime .. with their hands up.

Or journalists clearly identifying themselves as press.

This is America, not Iran or China.

Good point Bob.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1252790]Without even doing any research, my knowledge of ballistics from being a life long gun owner and being able to shoot right off my back porch tells me rubber bullets are probably less accurate than a bullet fired from a smooth bore pre civil war muzzle loading rifle. As trained with other weapons cops are aiming for center mass, bullet paths from rubber bullets are erratic and can end up in a very wide pattern.

Of course cop hating liberals that would not know a 9mm from a pellet pistol know more about ballistics than I do. They believe cops can easily hit someone in the eye on purpose with a rubber bullet, probably because that is what the liberal media leads them to believe.[/quote]

You've got some good info here too bad it's ruined by being an asshole. I didn't realize how inaccuarate they are... given the lack of accuracy I'd say that creates more problems potentially with possibly hitting innocent bystanders or... eyeballs.

[URL="https://www.fastcompany.com/90512287/the-lethal-history-of-rubber-bullets-and-why-they-should-never-be-used-on-peaceful-protesters"]The lethal history of rubber bullets—and why they should never be used on peaceful protesters[/URL]

From the article:

[quote]With erratic flight, you have two problems. First, the bullet could hit anywhere on the target’s body (it could also hit anyone standing near the intended target, anywhere on their body). Whereas the torso and legs are considered the safest areas to strike, bullets that fly up toward the neck or face can easily kill.

Michele Heisler is the medical director of Physicians for Human Rights and a professor of internal medicine and public health at the University of Michigan. She has been on the ground in Turkey to examine people who have been shot with less-lethal munitions. Heisler calls these scenes “horrific.” She has seen how even well-placed, perfectly executed shots still cause blunt trauma, which can do more than bruise or even break a bone: She’s witnessed these rounds do internal damage to organs like the lungs and heart and injure nerve bundles in limbs, necessitating amputation.

“I don’t know why, they do seem to directly hit people’s eyes [a lot]. It hits your eye and ruptures the eyeball, or the globe . . . basically, your eyeball explodes,” she says. But the terrifying truth is that someone losing their sight to a less-lethal round may have actually gotten lucky. “The eye is a very open entry point to the brain,” she adds, which is a primary route for these less-lethal rounds to kill.[/quote]

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=MTK;1252789][URL="https://www.businessinsider.com/nypd-officer-shoves-woman-george-floyd-protests-video-2020-5"]NYPD officer violently shoves woman during George Floyd protest, prompting city councilman to call for assault charge[/URL]

What about this? Was she rioting?[/quote]

Yeah I can’t pull the video, but I’ll say there is never an absolute...but a strong majority of police are trying to do the right thing.

Police here are in a no win situation after the Floyd murder...I’ve read complaints in both Minnesota and Chicago of “Where are the cops”...like if they are there it’s a problem, if they aren’t it’s a problem...I seen some assaulted and not fighting back, which is amazing restraint. Heck several police have been killed

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

I’d like the cops to bring out a cannon with a loaded grape-shot of rubber bullets and when those rioters start doing their rioting citizen-actions, angle the cannon towards the ground and pull the string. As the tens of rubber bullets released from the cannon Blast, they pick up more speed from the ricochet into the looters. At the lower trajectory they peg more balls and muffs than eyes.

Simple risk solution to reduce pirate accidents for looters

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1252793]Yeah I can’t pull the video, but I’ll say there is never an absolute...[B]but a strong majority of police are trying to do the right thing[/B].

Police here are in a no win situation after the Floyd murder...I’ve read complaints in both Minnesota and Chicago of “Where are the cops”...like if they are there it’s a problem, if they aren’t it’s a problem...I seen some assaulted and not fighting back, which is amazing restraint. Heck several police have been killed[/quote]

For the record I agree. Despite what some think a liberal like myself does not hate cops and love criminals. My ex father in law was a NYC cop back in the day.

Re: When is Enough ,Enough?
 

[quote=Chico23231;1252787]“Citizen on citizen violence” or 87 shootings with 18 murders within 24 hours. Don’t try to make it pretty, it ain’t and it’s a fuckin embarrassment.

Policy wise there is a lot id do...but fuck that mooby, let’s talk about woke-actions and power to the people:

Well first thing we are gonna do is march, then make some signs, maybe riot and loot some shoe stores, ( BYOSP)bring your own spray paint and vandalize, yell “defund gang activity”, some smoke weed, and then do the same thing tomorrow. You in?[/quote]

Why can't you separate the peaceful protesters from the looters and rioters? The ones trying to use Floyd's death to have a discussion on police reform are the not the same ones robbing stores and smashing shit at night.

I'm not smart enough to have the solution, but I agree with whoever said it starts with the community. That doesn't mean there isn't room for police to do their jobs better. I mean soldiers in war zones (where literally they have to assume that everybody around them wants to inflict harm on them) have stricter ROE than cops here (who get to enjoy the heavy-conservative thin blue line endorsement).

And for the record, the idea that I'm anti-cop is asinine. If you know or knew what I do for a living, the people I interact with every day, there's no wiggle room for being anti-cop at my job. That doesn't mean I don't think there isn't room for improvement in their job. Being entrusted with the authority they have means they have to be held to a higher standard. We need cops. That's an absolute, no room for negotiation on my part. We also need them to stop killing citizens unnecessarily.

And finally, it's the actions of a few that outweigh the good work of many. Much like any profession, or ideology, whether we're talking cops, rioters/protesters, terrorists/religious extremists, Democrats, or Republicans, it's the extreme ones that get the most shine. And their words and actions always manage to rise above the level headed ones who only want to make a positive impact on their community.