Vince Young overrated?

[jsarno]

Of course most of you know I am one of the few people in the world that thinks that Vince Young is just a glorified Mike Vick or Kordell Stewart, but he proved yet again that he is overrated. They needed Kerry freakin Collins to come in to tie that game up after Young went down with an injury. (although they still lost)

Yes, they are 3-2, but as I have pointed out before, they would have lost had Scobee not got hurt in week 1 vs the Jags because the Jags were in the redzone twice and couldn't kick field goals that would have won them the game. The other two wins were vs doormats in Atlanta and New Orleans.

Young in 5 games has thrown for a meezly 703 yards, 3 td's and 6 ints. He does have 129 yards and 1 td rushing. As many analysts have pointed out, it's Tennessee's D that is winning them games. Vince Young is not doing anything to help.

Looking at the stats:
He is dead last in passing yards in regards to ANY player with 5 or more starts.
He's dead last in TD passes for any player with 5 or more starts.
He's 8th worst in the entire league in int's.
He is dead last in passing yards per game for any starter playing 5 or more games.
He has the 2nd worst passer rating for starters with 5 or more starts at 68.0. (Brees is only one worse but he will pass Young soon) Young ranks 39th overall in passer rating, and there are only 32 teams. WOW.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 2,249 yards for the season.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 9 tds for the season.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 19 int's for the season.
2249 yards, 9 tds and 19 ints makes him the worst QB this league has seen in a while.

So how many people still think he's a great player?

[Duffman003]

I'm not a big Vince Young fan, but it's only his second year in the NFL and he still has a lot of room to improve and probably will become a very good quarterback in the future

[12thMan]

I don't know how you could conclude he's overated in just his second season. He's still as green as grass.

Now if what you're getting at is that Campbell is a better quarterback, I think the jury's still out on that one. But there are pluses and minuses to be argued to be honest.

You're certainly not going to convince anyone in the state of Tennessee that Jason Campbell is better than Vince Young, that's for sure. However, I would take Campbell over Young any day of the week.

[Skins fan 44]

Vince was my starting QB and I benched him yesterday and started JC. I would say that I made a good choice. Vince showed some good signs last year and I think he has alot of potiential.

[jbcjr14]

And the most important stat of all??????? What is their record? 3-2 without near the weapons most teams have on the offensive side of the ball. I believe he will be fine and he has that special something about him that drives him and wins football games whether he plays poorly or not.

[Defensewins]

Jsarno
Why do you hate?
You must be one of those bitter Matt Leinart fans that all but guaranteed Leinart would be a better pro thatn Young. That turned out to be wrong.
Young is still the best young QB regardless of how you spin the stats. You can't get around the fact the he just wins. Stats are for losers.
I would rather win the Superbowl and have JC, CP and SM be the worst rated players in the league. Just win baby.

[MTK]

c'mon not this again

[djnemo65]

Even if he his ovverrated I'm not sure that that's such a pressing issue that it deserves its own thread every month or so.

That being said, last time I checked Tennessee was a team that lost most of the meager offensive weaponry it had last year and was supposed to regress as a result...and hasn't. You can trot out all the stats on Young you want but they'll never tell the whole story. To not understand that some guys transcend stats is to not understand sports.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by jsarno

Of course most of you know I am one of the few people in the world that thinks that Vince Young is just a glorified Mike Vick or Kordell Stewart, but he proved yet again that he is overrated. They needed Kerry freakin Collins to come in to tie that game up after Young went down with an injury. (although they still lost)

Yes, they are 3-2, but as I have pointed out before, they would have lost had Scobee not got hurt in week 1 vs the Jags because the Jags were in the redzone twice and couldn't kick field goals that would have won them the game. The other two wins were vs doormats in Atlanta and New Orleans.

Young in 5 games has thrown for a meezly 703 yards, 3 td's and 6 ints. He does have 129 yards and 1 td rushing. As many analysts have pointed out, it's Tennessee's D that is winning them games. Vince Young is not doing anything to help.

Looking at the stats:
He is dead last in passing yards in regards to ANY player with 5 or more starts.
He's dead last in TD passes for any player with 5 or more starts.
He's 8th worst in the entire league in int's.
He is dead last in passing yards per game for any starter playing 5 or more games.
He has the 2nd worst passer rating for starters with 5 or more starts at 68.0. (Brees is only one worse but he will pass Young soon) Young ranks 39th overall in passer rating, and there are only 32 teams. WOW.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 2,249 yards for the season.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 9 tds for the season.
He is on pace to throw for a pitiful 19 int's for the season.
2249 yards, 9 tds and 19 ints makes him the worst QB this league has seen in a while.

So how many people still think he's a great player?

Did Vince Young kick your dog or something?

The jury is still out on the guy. I don't think anyone thinks the guy is a great qb. Who said that??? He has no WR's to speak of and he still a young qb as far as total starts go. Judge the guy in his 3rd year.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by jbcjr14

And the most important stat of all??????? What is their record? 3-2 without near the weapons most teams have on the offensive side of the ball. I believe he will be fine and he has that special something about him that drives him and wins football games whether he plays poorly or not.

Isn't having the No. 2 defense in football a weapon? Is it not the biggest weapon a team can have (exception of course to the No. 1 defense) with regards to winning games?

News flash: Vince Young has that.

You can't play poorly and be the reason your team wins. You just can't make that argument and be taken seriously.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Jsarno
Why do you hate?
You must be one of those bitter Matt Leinart fans that all but guaranteed Leinart would be a better pro thatn Young. That turned out to be wrong.
Young is still the best young QB regardless of how you spin the stats. You can't get around the fact the he just wins. Stats are for losers.
I would rather win the Superbowl and have JC, CP and SM be the worst rated players in the league. Just win baby.

So he's a Vince Young hater, and your a VY fanboy? How can you attack him for having a position equally as radical as yours?

For the record, Leinart had a better rookie year than Young, and neither played well in the first quarter of this season. So if you consult the facts, you can't say that Young is a better pro thus far than Leinart.

I understand that facts are for losers and emotions are wayyyy cooler and allow one to be blissfully ignorant about football, but I tend to get edgy when people ignore facts and try to make "holier than thou" arguments. Those pretty much suck.

Nothing personal, but if you are going to defend your boy, I think there should be an argument there that isn't a personal attack.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Did Vince Young kick your dog or something?

The jury is still out on the guy. I don't think anyone thinks the guy is a great qb. Who said that??? He has no WR's to speak of and he still a young qb as far as total starts go. Judge the guy in his 3rd year.

I think the media as a collective believes its a done deal that he was the best QB in the 2006 draft.

My opinion is that he has a long way to go to prove he isn't the worst of the first rounders. However, with Leinart out for the year, and with Cutler having a good year, this debate will stretch well beyond this year.

I think there's definately some positives about him that we never saw in Stewart or Vick, and I think that's a bad comparison on Jsarno's part. The point is that VY was the 3rd overall pick, and 1st QB off the board...and he just hasn't thrown the ball very well yet. He's making good strides in completion percentage this year, and thats a start, but his Y/A is awful.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

So he's a Vince Young hater, and your a VY fanboy? How can you attack him for having a position equally as radical as yours?

For the record, Leinart had a better rookie year than Young, and neither played well in the first quarter of this season. So if you consult the facts, you can't say that Young is a better pro thus far than Leinart.

I understand that facts are for losers and emotions are wayyyy cooler and allow one to be blissfully ignorant about football, but I tend to get edgy when people ignore facts and try to make "holier than thou" arguments. Those pretty much suck.

Nothing personal, but if you are going to defend your boy, I think there should be an argument there that isn't a personal attack.

Let me spell this out for you since you are obviously a little hyper sensitive and emotional about this. You mistakenly took my post as an attack. The expression 'Stats are for losers' comes from the situation of a player that plays on LOSING TEAM and has nothing to point to but his own individual stats, despite his teams being a big failure. So I was not attacking or calling your friend Jsarno a loser, I was calling the Cardinal TEAM losers. FACT #1.

FACT #2 is we are different when it comes to sports. I played a ton of sports during my life time. I played this game to win, not to be #1 in the stats department. By the way you cling to stats as the end all of fact, you might be more of a sports fan than an actual player. Stats are very misleading. Look at the Pats game this weekend. Randy Moss was doubled and received most of the attention of the Cowboys Defense. So his teammates benefited from it and a guy like Wes Welker had a career day. Well according to your non-bending "Stats Never Lie" theory Wes Welker is a better receiver than Randy Moss. We all know that is not the case. All of the Pats WR's benefited from playing opposite R. Moss and that does not show up on a stat sheet. Moss was statistically was 4th in receiveing that day, stats by themselves are not fact. You also have to consider who you are playing against when looking at stats.
Please don't take this as an attack on you. You asked me to back up my points with fact and I have. I am just stating a different opinion on the whole stats issue. However your comments on your highly emotional post challenging my football knowledge and calling me "blissfully ignorant" is a personal attack. Someone starting a thread every two weeks calling a QB on a winning team and singling him out is also an attack.
Football players are paid to win, not be #1 in stats.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I think the media as a collective believes its a done deal that he was the best QB in the 2006 draft.

My opinion is that he has a long way to go to prove he isn't the worst of the first rounders. However, with Leinart out for the year, and with Cutler having a good year, this debate will stretch well beyond this year.

I think there's definately some positives about him that we never saw in Stewart or Vick, and I think that's a bad comparison on Jsarno's part. The point is that VY was the 3rd overall pick, and 1st QB off the board...and he just hasn't thrown the ball very well yet. He's making good strides in completion percentage this year, and thats a start, but his Y/A is awful.

So far Leinart has not really shown me anything. He has been average, I guess. The problem is you have a two time NFL MVP and a SB winner sitting on the bench. Plus Warner has outplayed Leinart. On top of that you have a coach and an organization that wants to win now. All those things are going against Leinart and the other QB's in his class do not have to deal with that.

From what I have seen from Cutler and Young is they are up and down just like most young QB's are. Time will tell which of the three become a great NFL QB. My money is on Cutler. I think he shows the most upside of the three.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Let me spell this out for you since you are obviously a little hyper sensitive and emotional about this. You mistakenly took my post as an attack. The expression 'Stats are for losers' comes from the situation of a player that plays on LOSING TEAM and has nothing to point to but his own individual stats, despite his teams being a big failure. So I was not attacking or calling your friend Jsarno a loser, I was calling the Cardinal TEAM losers. FACT #1.

FACT #2 is we are different when it comes to sports. I played a ton of sports during my life time. I played this game to win, not to be #1 in the stats department. By the way you cling to stats as the end all of fact, you might be more of a sports fan than an actual player. Stats are very misleading. Look at the Pats game this weekend. Randy Moss was doubled and received most of the attention of the Cowboys Defense. So his teammates benefited from it and a guy like Wes Welker had a career day. Well according to your non-bending "Stats Never Lie" theory Wes Welker is a better receiver than Randy Moss. Well e all know that is not the case. All of the Pats WR's benefited from playing opposite R. Moss and that does not show up on a stat sheet. Moss was statistically was 4th in receiveing that day, stats by themselves are not fact. You also have to consider who you are playing against when looking at stas.
Please don't take this as an attack on you. You asked me to back up my points with fact and I have. I am just stating a different opinion on the whole stats issue. However your comments on your highly emotional post challenging my football knowledge and calling me "blissfully ignorant" is a personal attack. Someone starting a thread every two weeks calling a QB on a winning team and singling him out is also an attack.

Stats never ever ever tell the real story. I think JC should have a better competion % and two less INT's. But all of the drops have hurt him in both those areas. That is why I really never pay too much attention to it.