No. 1 Pass Defense

diehardskin2982 · 12-06-2009, 10:17 PM

Now that the Saints game is over, how do you feel about our secondary? Alot of fans and the DC media led us to believe that the secondary is not as good as the rating suggest. Brees had 419 yards, 2td, 1 int.

I feel the secondary did a good job, considering who they where facing. They didn't score get out of control. The two touchdowns that brees threw came off plays against Landry, who is out of position. Considering that our number 1corner Hall was out and so was Tryon, I think our secondary is as good as advertized. For me In don't care how many yard you throw on the field, to me it's all about redzone defense, and in my opinion the secondary and the defense as a whole did very well.

GMScud · 12-06-2009, 10:24 PM

That #1 pass D rating is based solely on yardage. We don't really intercept passes, and our coverage gets help from the solid pass rush we've had pretty much all year (I know that's a two-way street). We've allowed some long TD passes in crucial situations.

Drew Brees is the best QB in the NFC, maybe the league. He torches secondaries all the time.

GTripp can probably give us a good assessment of the pass coverage unit. My opinion is that it's above average, but certainly not top notch. We don't take the ball away enough.

WaldSkins · 12-06-2009, 10:25 PM

I know Smoot didn't show us much of anything today.

SmootSmack · 12-06-2009, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WaldSkins

I know Smoot didn't show us much of anything today.

I'll try harder next time

These were, I believe, the 2nd most yards passing allowed by the Redskins D since Boomer Esiason passed for over 500 against us with the Cardinals.

All in all, we did ok though considering Barnes and Westbrook played a lot more than they ever have before

WaldSkins · 12-06-2009, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'll try harder next time

These were, I believe, the 2nd most yards passing allowed by the Redskins D since Boomer Esiason passed for over 500 against us with the Cardinals.

All in all, we did ok though considering Barnes and Westbrook played a lot more than they ever have before

As i typed it up, for some reason i thought you would respond to my Smoot comment.

skinster · 12-06-2009, 10:45 PM

419 yards is alot....

takethecake · 12-06-2009, 10:46 PM

Well I do think that the #1 rating is misleading, but that doesn't mean I think the secondary is poor. Up until the last few games where the skins offense has been competitive, teams have been able to go up by a TD and just focus on burning the clock. Its not that they can't pass on the skins, its just that they haven't had to. The really damning evidence is as GMScud mentioned, they don't force turnovers and they allow the big plays when they really need a stop.

I don't think the defense needs a complete overhaul though. I'm not a landry fan - he really just makes too many bonehead moves - but I love reed doughty and we've got an above average selection of CBs. I'd be in favor of trading landry and trying to pick up a true coverage safety in the draft to play FS with kareem moore. I'm also not sold on greg blache. I think he's given more credit than he really deserves... I mean I don't think we can solely blame the players for the disturbing amount of blown coverages this season. I wouldn't be too sad to see him go.

GTripp0012 · 12-07-2009, 01:28 AM

"Pass Defense" includes pass rush, and when you include our pass rush, which is legitimately top five or six in the NFL, the total product is a unit that is above average at pass defense.

But the coverage units are horrendous. There are worse units in the NFL, but those teams only have like two or three wins or something, which means that they suck and we don't. I've seen the worst defense in modern Redskins history (2006), and our pass coverage might have been better then. That year was Carlos Rogers playing mediocre ball, Adam Archuleta and Sean Taylor fighting to see who could take a worse pursuit angle on any given play, and even with Minnesota relieving us of our Smoot burden, we trotted out Kenny Wright for 16 games.

When Springs was in the lineup, that 2006 team was better at coverage than this team is, and they ranked 31st in the NFL. Of course, Springs wasn't healthy at all that season, and without him, I'd say Rogers and Wright is a worse tandem than Rogers and Hall. And I'd take Tryon over Mike Rumph anyday. And I'd take Doughty over Archuleta. So while there's no big edge for the 2009 team here, I guess things could always be worse.

GTripp0012 · 12-07-2009, 01:35 AM

And part of the suckitude of the safeties might simply be Landry playing in a role that doesn't suit him, but it's not like we don't have the talent to compensate for this. At least, I think we do.

tryfuhl · 12-07-2009, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

There are worse units in the NFL, but those teams only have like two or three wins or something, which means that they suck and we don't.

Sounds like another team I know.

tryfuhl · 12-07-2009, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

And part of the suckitude of the safeties might simply be Landry playing in a role that doesn't suit him, but it's not like we don't have the talent to compensate for this. At least, I think we do.

I don't see us getting rid of Landry after the year unless a D-minded coach comes in and maybe if someone offers us something first. Maybe 2009 for Landry can be the 2006 that ST had. I'd be interested to hear how much he studies assignments and game film of us as well as the opponents.

FRPLG · 12-07-2009, 09:06 AM

The Landry project is wearing real thin. We're not going to have agood secondary with him as FS. He shows me little to think he can ever be an elite FS. It is time to move him back to SS and find even an average FS.

FRPLG · 12-07-2009, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

And part of the suckitude of the safeties might simply be Landry playing in a role that doesn't suit him, but it's not like we don't have the talent to compensate for this. At least, I think we do.

I really think this is it. CBs getting burned is somewhat more palatable than watching our 4th year FS constantly get beat by the same type of moves and constantly try and tackle people missile style and miss half the time. Someone needs to learn him that he isn't as good a ST was and can't get away with the same crap. And some coach needs to figure out that he can't play FS. Why is it that Carlos gets beats by double mioves and gets benched while Landry gets beat by similar moves and never comes off the field?

redsk1 · 12-07-2009, 09:14 AM

I thought they played pretty good most of the game. I just don't know what to think of LL.

FRPLG · 12-07-2009, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redsk1

I thought they played pretty good most of the game. I just don't know what to think of LL.

I think GTripp has made a good argument more than once that he simply isn't very football smart. He isn't as football smart as even ST was. ST was no field genius but he did OK and made up for it with once-in-a-lifetime physical ability. LL has great physical ability and no head for the game. Maybe now we understand why our corners are told to give 12 yard cushions. LL needs that much extra time to process and figure out what to do.

12-06-2009, 10:24 PM	#2
GMScud Swearinger Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 12,626	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense That #1 pass D rating is based solely on yardage. We don't really intercept passes, and our coverage gets help from the solid pass rush we've had pretty much all year (I know that's a two-way street). We've allowed some long TD passes in crucial situations. Drew Brees is the best QB in the NFC, maybe the league. He torches secondaries all the time. GTripp can probably give us a good assessment of the pass coverage unit. My opinion is that it's above average, but certainly not top notch. We don't take the ball away enough. __________________ Tardy

12-06-2009, 10:25 PM	#3
WaldSkins Playmaker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Harrisburg, PA Age: 40 Posts: 2,726	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense I know Smoot didn't show us much of anything today. __________________ "I would change that around, Jesus isn't Cutler. I guarantee you Jesus couldnt thread the ball like Jay does."-Monksdown

12-06-2009, 10:45 PM	#6
skinster Impact Rookie Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 754	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense 419 yards is alot....

12-06-2009, 10:46 PM	#7
takethecake Special Teams Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Bethesda, MD Age: 36 Posts: 281	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense Well I do think that the #1 rating is misleading, but that doesn't mean I think the secondary is poor. Up until the last few games where the skins offense has been competitive, teams have been able to go up by a TD and just focus on burning the clock. Its not that they can't pass on the skins, its just that they haven't had to. The really damning evidence is as GMScud mentioned, they don't force turnovers and they allow the big plays when they really need a stop. I don't think the defense needs a complete overhaul though. I'm not a landry fan - he really just makes too many bonehead moves - but I love reed doughty and we've got an above average selection of CBs. I'd be in favor of trading landry and trying to pick up a true coverage safety in the draft to play FS with kareem moore. I'm also not sold on greg blache. I think he's given more credit than he really deserves... I mean I don't think we can solely blame the players for the disturbing amount of blown coverages this season. I wouldn't be too sad to see him go.

12-07-2009, 01:28 AM	#8
GTripp0012 Living Legend Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Evanston, IL Age: 36 Posts: 15,994	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense "Pass Defense" includes pass rush, and when you include our pass rush, which is legitimately top five or six in the NFL, the total product is a unit that is above average at pass defense. But the coverage units are horrendous. There are worse units in the NFL, but those teams only have like two or three wins or something, which means that they suck and we don't. I've seen the worst defense in modern Redskins history (2006), and our pass coverage might have been better then. That year was Carlos Rogers playing mediocre ball, Adam Archuleta and Sean Taylor fighting to see who could take a worse pursuit angle on any given play, and even with Minnesota relieving us of our Smoot burden, we trotted out Kenny Wright for 16 games. When Springs was in the lineup, that 2006 team was better at coverage than this team is, and they ranked 31st in the NFL. Of course, Springs wasn't healthy at all that season, and without him, I'd say Rogers and Wright is a worse tandem than Rogers and Hall. And I'd take Tryon over Mike Rumph anyday. And I'd take Doughty over Archuleta. So while there's no big edge for the 2009 team here, I guess things could always be worse. __________________ according to a source with knowledge of the situation.

12-06-2009, 10:17 PM	#1
diehardskin2982 Another Year, another mess. Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,581	No. 1 Pass Defense Now that the Saints game is over, how do you feel about our secondary? Alot of fans and the DC media led us to believe that the secondary is not as good as the rating suggest. Brees had 419 yards, 2td, 1 int. I feel the secondary did a good job, considering who they where facing. They didn't score get out of control. The two touchdowns that brees threw came off plays against Landry, who is out of position. Considering that our number 1corner Hall was out and so was Tryon, I think our secondary is as good as advertized. For me In don't care how many yard you throw on the field, to me it's all about redzone defense, and in my opinion the secondary and the defense as a whole did very well. __________________ That got ugly fast

12-07-2009, 01:35 AM	#9
GTripp0012 Living Legend Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Evanston, IL Age: 36 Posts: 15,994	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense And part of the suckitude of the safeties might simply be Landry playing in a role that doesn't suit him, but it's not like we don't have the talent to compensate for this. At least, I think we do. __________________ according to a source with knowledge of the situation.

12-07-2009, 09:06 AM	#12
FRPLG MVP Join Date: May 2004 Age: 45 Posts: 10,164	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense The Landry project is wearing real thin. We're not going to have agood secondary with him as FS. He shows me little to think he can ever be an elite FS. It is time to move him back to SS and find even an average FS.

12-07-2009, 09:14 AM	#14
redsk1 The Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,351	Re: No. 1 Pass Defense I thought they played pretty good most of the game. I just don't know what to think of LL.

No. 1 Pass Defense

Locker Room Main Forum