Ravens v Commanders game thread

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by EdmundDorf

I think they are asking Martin to do a lot more, the same stupid way they did with Jamin Davis, dumping 3 positions worth of information at once and seeing how much he can absorb. Forbes is only being asked to be an outside corner. And for some guys it takes a little longer to get used to NFL speed. His film doesn't show him being afraid to tackle. He is the #7 or #8 DB right now so it is not like they desperately need him to be a day 1 starter.

No they definitely do not need him to start day one. Thank God. It just irks me because we need an interior lineman desperately to be a day one starter and they were on the board, but we drafted a depth guy at d back.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

Agreed. Overreacting to pre-season works both ways: don't panic when we look bad, but don't pop the champagne just yet when some of our starters on D got embarrassed by a bunch of 2s and 3s, and when all our 1s on O couldn't get it in the endzone against their 2nd and 3rd stringers...

Watched the 1st quarter so far, Sam looked pretty good, minus that really bad sack he took on the first drive. But yeah, he looks confortable, throws a good ball, seems to have a nice connection with both Terry and Cole Turner, makes good decisions. Promising for sure.

Oline is worrying, they looked decent only because they were facing back ups. Sam Cosmi was man handled on the first play of the game. My worry is if we're not able to establish a run game, we'll end up asking too much from Howell, which could cost us against good defense.

It's only the pre-season but I didn't like seeing both Forbes and Jartavius Martin missing tackles on the first drive (Forbes made up for on the next drive).

I'm not sure how you can come away from that game with the idea that the O-line is "worrying". They dominated. Does that mean they will dominate against the Ravens #1s, or anyone else's #1s? Maybe... Maybe not... But the fact that they did dominate, is encouraging.

[EdmundDorf]

Originally Posted by punch it in

No they definitely do not need him to start day one. Thank God. It just irks me because we need an interior lineman desperately to be a day one starter and they were on the board, but we drafted a depth guy at d back.

Yes I totally agree with you on that. Arguably 2 years in a row Ron has done that. Heard somewhere that they tried to trade up to get Avila but didn't want to pay the price being asked to move into the top 5 of the second round. If true, given that they spent the 3rd and 4th picks on linemen who likely wont see the field this year or next, feels like they weren't agressive enough. I have heard Mayhew regretting not being aggressive enough in the draft, but that is always in hindsight. Wonder if Ron held him back from that. I also think Ron is way too dedicated to position flex which makes me wonder if he passes up on much better players who don't have flex in favour of projects.

[EdmundDorf]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I'm not sure how you can come away from that game with the idea that the O-line is "worrying". They dominated. Does that mean they will dominate against the Ravens #1s, or anyone else's #1s? Maybe... Maybe not... But the fact that they did dominate, is encouraging.

I think the interior is better than some give it credit for, but the tackles still worry me a bit. They are not much better than Lucas, if at all, which begs the question of their offseason strategy. Still bugs me that we could have taken Darrisaw when we drafted Jamin Davis. To my mind OTs are far more valuable than LBs in the first round

[sdskinsfan2001]

I'm definitely struggling with this myself, but we can't hold it against Martin for us picking him over a lineman. Not like he broke into the war-room and demanded we draft him.

We chose to pick him so he deserves to get a reasonable timeframe to be judged by. 2 pre-season games isn't reasonable.

[FrenchSkin]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

I'm not sure how you can come away from that game with the idea that the O-line is "worrying". They dominated. Does that mean they will dominate against the Ravens #1s, or anyone else's #1s? Maybe... Maybe not... But the fact that they did dominate, is encouraging.

I have now watched the full game and I wouldn't call what I saw from the Oline "domination".
Pre-season is for individual evaluation, but to get a sense of where a squad is at, I tend to focus on the first drive, when they're more likely to face NFL-ish opposition... And that first drive didn't look good for them. I liked that Sam overcame the sack and all, but against subpar opposition, I don't think the Oline looked great.
From the second drive only, once Baltimore only had 2s and 3s in there, they managed to give some time to Sam on most snaps.
Plus there's wasn't any clear lanes in the running game, just watch our first two snaps... we were worried about our left side, but our right side seems to be struggling the most, Wylie hasn't looked great so far and I'm not sure Sam Cosmi is better suited to play guard.

If you wanna say that "worrying" is too strong of a word, that's fine, but with our offensive weapons, and how well Sam seems to be developing, I don't like the idea of potentially not having a reliable run game and not being able to handle NFL level pass rush.

[EdmundDorf]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

I'm definitely struggling with this myself, but we can't hold it against Martin for us picking him over a lineman. Not like he broke into the war-room and demanded we draft him.

We chose to pick him so he deserves to get a reasonable timeframe to be judged by. 2 pre-season games isn't reasonable.

100% great post

[FrenchSkin]

To be clear overall I'm very encouraged by what I'm seeing, obviously Sam Howell is the big positive in term of what we're learning from these pre-season games, I think you also can credit EB for 2 successful 2min drives, our receiving corps is looking good, and you can hope our defense will be good.
Still think concerns about the Oline are fair.

[skinsfan69]

What got me about Martin was he looked like he just didn't belong out there. He whiffed on a couple of routine tackles. If you're a safety and a high pick you at least gotta blow shit up.

That is what I like about Forrest and Curl. They're going to smack the shit out of you. Martin didn't look like he was bout that action. Then he got beat for a td but Johnson threw it late. Not sure what they saw in that guy for a 2nd rounder when you needed a o-linemen in the worst way.

And you gotta move on from Wildgoose.

We may have found our TE in Turner.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by sdskinsfan2001

Forbes is a tough SOB. He throws his body around with wreckless abandonment. That 3rd and 1 stop was super-impressive.

For a guy that skinny that is willing to put his body in there tells me one thing. He's got heart.

[MTK]

I think everyone can chill with the weight thing now with Forbes. He can play.

[sdskinsfan2001]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

I have now watched the full game and I wouldn't call what I saw from the Oline "domination".
Pre-season is for individual evaluation, but to get a sense of where a squad is at, I tend to focus on the first drive, when they're more likely to face NFL-ish opposition... And that first drive didn't look good for them. I liked that Sam overcame the sack and all, but against subpar opposition, I don't think the Oline looked great.
From the second drive only, once Baltimore only had 2s and 3s in there, they managed to give some time to Sam on most snaps.
Plus there's wasn't any clear lanes in the running game, just watch our first two snaps... we were worried about our left side, but our right side seems to be struggling the most, Wylie hasn't looked great so far and I'm not sure Sam Cosmi is better suited to play guard.

If you wanna say that "worrying" is too strong of a word, that's fine, but with our offensive weapons, and how well Sam seems to be developing, I don't like the idea of potentially not having a reliable run game and not being able to handle NFL level pass rush.

I wouldn't be surprised if Wylie and Cosmi switched positions at some point during the season.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by FrenchSkin

I have now watched the full game and I wouldn't call what I saw from the Oline "domination".
Pre-season is for individual evaluation, but to get a sense of where a squad is at, I tend to focus on the first drive, when they're more likely to face NFL-ish opposition... And that first drive didn't look good for them. I liked that Sam overcame the sack and all, but against subpar opposition, I don't think the Oline looked great.
From the second drive only, once Baltimore only had 2s and 3s in there, they managed to give some time to Sam on most snaps.
Plus there's wasn't any clear lanes in the running game, just watch our first two snaps... we were worried about our left side, but our right side seems to be struggling the most, Wylie hasn't looked great so far and I'm not sure Sam Cosmi is better suited to play guard.

If you wanna say that "worrying" is too strong of a word, that's fine, but with our offensive weapons, and how well Sam seems to be developing, I don't like the idea of potentially not having a reliable run game and not being able to handle NFL level pass rush.

Maybe "worrying" and "domination" are both too strong. They definitely gave him a clean pocket (by NFL standards) for the majority of his drop backs. I'm just saying it was encouraging. If Sam was running for his life - like TH was most of last year, then I'd be less encouraged, but he wasn't.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by MTK

I think everyone can chill with the weight thing now with Forbes. He can play.

Loved that hit. Energizing play for the defense. I gotta think the starting DL guys standing on the sidelines loved seeing the smallest guy on the field come up and deliver a hit.

Everything that makes Forbes good showed up on that play. He's small, but because he reads and recognizes so quickly he broke on that play before the RT could get to him and kick him out. So he arrived at the spot ahead of schedule, reducing his chance of getting smashed and injured, and he gave it everything he had on the hit and it turned out to be enough. 4th down. He makes up for his size by studying, reading, reacting, and getting to the spot first.

[Hoglips]

Originally Posted by EdmundDorf

I also think Ron is way too dedicated to position flex which makes me wonder if he passes up on much better players who don't have flex in favour of projects.

This. It seems to be his primary draft metric. Good to have, but I'd prefer to have mostly guys who are good at a specific position. Maybe that's naive...