the all encompassing 'discuss all things offseason' thread sponsored by Paintrain

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

That man must LOVE weed.

Explains sleeping in meetings and his lack of, well, moving and catching on the field.


What a waste of talent. He COULD have been one of the top TEs in the NFL if he didn't decide to smoke his life and career away.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

We have to be hell we have no talent

And we also have the money to do it.


I trust Bruce a hell of a lot more than Vinny with Dan's money.

Man, the Facebook comments on that ESPN article were painful to read. First one..."RGIII is a bust!"

[MTK]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Jay Gruden: 'Foolish' to make RGIII a pocket passer - NFL.com




So, he wants to use RGIII in a way that Shanahan did, which Robert absolutely hated. RGIII wants to be a pocket passer, and he hated the read option plays. Now you have a coach who's already not on the same page as his "franchise" QB in terms of direction. This is going to be a cluster fuck.


What the hell is with bringing all these guys in from Tampa Bay. Doug Williams? What exactly about his career (beyond player) as a coach/personnel guy that makes him qualified to be in this organization. We are NOT going in the right direction.

He said 3-4 RO plays a game. Nothing crazy. Put away the jump to conclusions mat.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Jay Gruden: 'Foolish' to make RGIII a pocket passer - NFL.com




So, he wants to use RGIII in a way that Shanahan did, which Robert absolutely hated. RGIII wants to be a pocket passer, and he hated the read option plays. Now you have a coach who's already not on the same page as his "franchise" QB in terms of direction. This is going to be a cluster fuck.


What the hell is with bringing all these guys in from Tampa Bay. Doug Williams? What exactly about his career (beyond player) as a coach/personnel guy that makes him qualified to be in this organization. We are NOT going in the right direction.

Yeah I don't get this whole Tampa shit, and Doug Williams got fired at grambling so how is he qualified for an NFL job?? I agree I don't think we will be any good under Dan , I've lost all faith in the franchise, sorry to admit it but I have. I'm a fan of course and I'll watch but I'm not excited about the future at all. Mike and co. Killed it for me.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by Monkeydad

And we also have the money to do it.


I trust Bruce a hell of a lot more than Vinny with Dan's money.

Man, the Facebook comments on that ESPN article were painful to read. First one..."RGIII is a bust!"

Yeah he's a bust alright.... Idiots

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Jay Gruden: 'Foolish' to make RGIII a pocket passer - NFL.com




So, he wants to use RGIII in a way that Shanahan did, which Robert absolutely hated. RGIII wants to be a pocket passer, and he hated the read option plays. Now you have a coach who's already not on the same page as his "franchise" QB in terms of direction. This is going to be a cluster fuck.


What the hell is with bringing all these guys in from Tampa Bay. Doug Williams? What exactly about his career (beyond player) as a coach/personnel guy that makes him qualified to be in this organization. We are NOT going in the right direction.

Bruce Allen did some good things in Tampa Bay as the GM. He also had Oakland as a SB contender for many years. All around the league people bring in who they're comfortable with. Let's give it a chance.

As far as RG3...what does he do better at this point of his career? Stand in the pocket and be Tom Brady? Or run zone read option? I'm sure Gruden has plans to improve him in being a better passer but it would be silly not to use his mobility. RG3 also needs to just do what the coach says and keep his mouth shut. Wilson, Kap and Newton run read option. Are they complaining? No.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah I don't get this whole Tampa shit, and Doug Williams got fired at grambling so how is he qualified for an NFL job?? I agree I don't think we will be any good under Dan , I've lost all faith in the franchise, sorry to admit it but I have. I'm a fan of course and I'll watch but I'm not excited about the future at all. Mike and co. Killed it for me.

Context is everything. Williams was fired at Grambling because he accepted a donation from a program supporter to upgrade their facilities and the school president said the funds should have been applied to the general fund of the university. Doug Williams says fundraising groups were reason for his firing - NFL.com

He also served 6 years for the Bucs in their front office including the Director of Pro Scouting before going back to Grambling as the coach. Doug Williams, Tampa Bay Buccaneers split for a second time | Tampa Bay Times

I get the skepticism of all things under Snyder (though I don't get the Allen skepticism yet) but a little accuracy in the conversation can't be a bad thing.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Context is everything. Williams was fired at Grambling because he accepted a donation from a program supporter to upgrade their facilities and the school president said the funds should have been applied to the general fund of the university. Doug Williams says fundraising groups were reason for his firing - NFL.com

He also served 6 years for the Bucs in their front office including the Director of Pro Scouting before going back to Grambling as the coach. Doug Williams, Tampa Bay Buccaneers split for a second time | Tampa Bay Times

I get the skepticism of all things under Snyder (though I don't get the Allen skepticism yet) but a little accuracy in the conversation can't be a bad thing.

Thank you. Well said.

[MTK]

Gruden: "It's a 16-game grind. You don't want him getting hit 15, 20 times a game on read options. You have to keep your stars healthy."

"I don't anticipate running a lot of read option," he said. "I think if you use it three or four times a game, you'll have more success than if you try to feature your whole offense around it. It's not just tough on the quarterback taking hits, it's tough on the tackles with their aiming points, where are they going. It's something you have to practice a lot to get very good at."

"My goal in training camp is to see how much he can develop as a drop-back passer."

Jay Gruden wants RGIII to succeed in the pocket. | SportsonEarth.com : Dan Pompei Article

[DynamiteRave]

I don't think RG3 is cut out to be a purely pocket passer. I think we need to almost completely ditch the RO, but keep bootlegs and rollouts, which still showcases RG3's running ability if need be.

There are pocket passers, balanced and scramblers. If RG3 doesn't want to be a scrambler, he needs to be a balanced guy.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah I don't get this whole Tampa shit, and Doug Williams got fired at grambling so how is he qualified for an NFL job?? I agree I don't think we will be any good under Dan , I've lost all faith in the franchise, sorry to admit it but I have. I'm a fan of course and I'll watch but I'm not excited about the future at all. Mike and co. Killed it for me.

I think that bringing Doug Williams into the FO would be an outstanding move. Adding trained eyes and expertise regarding talent can only help.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by DynamiteRave

I don't think RG3 is cut out to be a purely pocket passer. I think we need to almost completely ditch the RO, but keep bootlegs and rollouts, which still showcases RG3's running ability if need be.

There are pocket passers, balanced and scramblers. If RG3 doesn't want to be a scrambler, he needs to be a balanced guy.

Would you say that Aaron Rodgers is "balanced"? I think that Rodgers is a good model for Gryphon's development.

[Ruhskins]

Honestly, people need to chill the f*ck out about what is going on this offseason. Jay Gruden is hiring people from his network, just like every other NFL HC does. Bruce Allen is doing the same with the front office. It happens all the time in the NFL and most of the time outside the NFL.

Allen has been a competent GM in his career and so far I'm fine with most of the things he has done with the team. He's not Vinny Cerrator or Jerry Jones. The fanbase b*tched 24/7 about how we didn't have a true GM or we didn't have football people running the team. Well, we now have both (we even had that during MS tenure here).

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Gruden: "It's a 16-game grind. You don't want him getting hit 15, 20 times a game on read options. You have to keep your stars healthy."

"I don't anticipate running a lot of read option," he said. "I think if you use it three or four times a game, you'll have more success than if you try to feature your whole offense around it. It's not just tough on the quarterback taking hits, it's tough on the tackles with their aiming points, where are they going. It's something you have to practice a lot to get very good at."

"My goal in training camp is to see how much he can develop as a drop-back passer."

Jay Gruden wants RGIII to succeed in the pocket. | SportsonEarth.com : Dan Pompei Article

I think part of the confusion is that he told King that he'd be foolish to turn RG3 into a 'pocket passer' but then told Pompeii that he needs to develop him as a 'drop back passer'. Those are two different skills.

I got from it that he wants to develop the 'drop back' skillset, proper footwork, reading defenses, going thru progressions, etc. but not turn him into a 'pocket' passer standing there patting the ball while the play develops.

I don't think he will be calling many QB runs or read option plays at all.

[DynamiteRave]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Would you say that Aaron Rodgers is "balanced"? I think that Rodgers is a good model for Gryphon's development.

I think most QBs are balanced.. The only purely pocket passers in the league (guys you want to throw first and run last) I think are:

Peyton
Brady
Worthlisberger
Flacco

Maybe others to be added.