The official 2008 draft discussion thread

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

We don't really know if Thomas drops passes. We don't know if he runs good routes. We don't know if he's an NFL talent. Nothing he did in college suggests that he's good at anything football.

He's fast and strong. That much we know about him. He can jump, and move laterally very fast.

Sold? I'm not.

I'm not sold either. Too much of a risk IMO.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm totally baffled by this post. I think you spend too much time with your metrics and DVOAs and your DPARs that you overanalyze way too often and then you find yourself trying to convince us that we're better off with Tim Rattay, yet Devin Thomas has only shown the ability to run and jump

Smoot....I really really like Thomas but with your first pick you need to go with more of a sure thing. Don't you think?

[MTK]

Thomas was rated as first round talent and was projected to possibly go as high as #11 to Buffalo. I don't think he would have been a reach even at #21, to get him where we did was fantastic.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Are you serious? You don't disagree that Moss is at best an average wide receiver? Did you watch any games last year after he got back to being healthy? Bears, Giants, Vikings, Cowboys? I'm glad fans don't evaluate talent for this team at any level other than internet posts.

My how times have changed around here. I remember not too long ago there was a thread about how Randy Moss was done and Santana was better.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Thomas was rated as first round talent and was projected to possibly go as high as #11 to Buffalo. I don't think he would have been a reach even at #21, to get him where we did was fantastic.

I guess so. I just understand the overkill at wr.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

GRec Yds TD Lg Rec/G Avg/C Avg/G
13 79 1260 8 80 6.1 15.9 96.9

NONE of that shows he can play football? None?

Why do you come out if you are Devin Thomas? Why does it make any sense?

You've had a pretty nice season, but you haven't proved that it can be repeated. You have a year of eligibility left, why not return to school, get better at your trade, and help your college team win?

If nothing else, we can tell that Devin Thomas was more interested in a pay day than becoming the best wide receiver he can be. Perhaps I'm wrong on him, and he will be good enough to start in this league. But either way, I'm tired of adding players who are in it for the money.

Obviously to an extent, everyones in it for the money. But that didn't stop most players from waiting a year and improving themselves so that they could become the best they could be. Thomas doesn't seem to be worried about improving himself.

Malcolm Kelly came out early, but his touchdown production went from 2, to 10, to 9. He's done it multiple years and is a far superior prospect to Thomas.

I'm sorry to hate on your guy's parade with reality, but we took a guy on hype, and that rarely works out.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I guess so. I just understand the overkill at wr.

If Zorn intends on using a lot of 3 and 4 WR sets and rotating these guys in and out depending on the packages it makes sense. Not sure how you can have overkill when you look at the mediocre WR production we had last year. I think this draft indicates the shift in philosophy from Gibbs run first mentality to Zorn's offense which looks like it's going to be pass heavy.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Are you serious? You don't disagree that Moss is at best an average wide receiver? Did you watch any games last year after he got back to being healthy? Bears, Giants, Vikings, Cowboys? I'm glad fans don't evaluate talent for this team at any level other than internet posts.

Are you an NFL scout? Or are you just a fan who evaluates talent and posts your views on the internet? If your house is made of glass......

I think Moss has the ability to be dominant when healthy. In those last three games you mention Moss had 15 catches for 271 yards. That works out to a 16 game pace of 80 catches for 1445 yards. I distinctly remember Moss making great adjustments on the ball on two passes thrown along the sideline in the Giants game. I should mentioned that Moss caught 3 balls for 75 yards (a 25 yard avg.) on a night when Collins barely threw because it was so windy. I also remember Moss making a great adjustment on the ball and beating Vikings CB Marcus McCauley for a TD.

Moss undoubtedly has the initial explosiveness off the line, the straight-line speed, and agility you'd like to see from a burner. Moss is excellent at adjusting to the ball. Moss' only real problem is that he has trouble staying healthy (which is, admittedly, a big problem).

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Are you an NFL scout? Or are you just a fan who evaluates talent and posts your views on the internet? I'm not trying to be a d^&k, but if your house is made of glass......

I think Moss has the ability to be dominant when healthy. In those last three games you mentioned Moss had 15 catches for 271 yards. That works out to a 16 game pace of 80 catches for 1445 yards. I distinctly remember Moss making great adjustments on the ball on two passes thrown along the sideline in the Giants game. I should mentioned that Moss caught 3 balls for 75 yards (a 25 yard avg.) on a night when Collins barely threw because it was so windy. I also remember Moss making a great adjustment on the ball and beating Vikings CB Marcus McCauley for a TD.

Moss undoubtedly has the initial explosiveness off the line, the straight-line speed, and agility you'd like to see from a burner. Moss is excellent at adjusting to the ball. Moss' only real problem is that he has trouble staying healthy (which is, admittedly, a big problem).

That's the key point right there. People want to keep pointing to 2005 to say what Moss is capable of but the reality is the guy has serious problems staying on the field. ARE was also dinged at times last year and I think most agree he's best suited for the slot role anyway.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

If Zorn intends on using a lot of 3 and 4 WR sets and rotating these guys in and out depending on the packages it makes sense. Not sure how you can have overkill when you look at the mediocre WR production we had last year. I think this draft indicates the shift in philosophy from Gibbs run first mentality to Zorn's offense which looks like it's going to be pass heavy.

Yeah, but if that is the philosophy, then the Fred Davis pick makes no sense.

Irregardless of the talent we got, there were a few dissenting opinions making the decisions, and it created overkill. If we had just drafted Thomas, and then Davis (one TE, and one WR), can you come up with a potential scenario where we wouldn't have it covered with the personnel we had?

Kelly was a good value, but his only role on this team comes if he can beat out Devin Thomas.

I suppose that 4 years down the road, the team is planning to have Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly at the receivers, but in the next three seasons, Moss and/or ARE are still going to be here, and that means that one of those guys is nothing more than a 4th receiver for the time being.

That would be the very definition of overkill.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

GTripp,

Do you think we took Thomas because of the hype? Thomas is 6'2", has 4.4 speed, is very strong and agile, has good hands, is tough, and puts up excellent stats in 2007. It sounds like he's unpolished and it might not work out, but that's probably why we passed on him @ 21. We used our #2 pick to draft a boom/bust wideout.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

That's the key point right there. People want to keep pointing to 2005 to say what Moss is capable of but the reality is the guy has serious problems staying on the field.

I wasn't attacking the Redskins' decision to draft 2 wideouts and a TE. I was simply disagreeing with the statement that Moss is an average receiver at best when healthy.

[NYCskinfan82]

It is what it is, the Skins have made their picks i was not fond of them at first but the more i think about it i like it i like it alot, make defenses really have to plan for us.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

If Zorn intends on using a lot of 3 and 4 WR sets and rotating these guys in and out depending on the packages it makes sense. Not sure how you can have overkill when you look at the mediocre WR production we had last year. I think this draft indicates the shift in philosophy from Gibbs run first mentality to Zorn's offense which looks like it's going to be pass heavy.

Well I don't mind the offense being more wide open and aggresive. But I wonder if we're going to be able to pull this off without getting JC killed. Time will tell.

[NYCskinfan82]

i'm tired of goal line situations run run run and everyone knows it what do you think we will do now exactly the possibilites are endless you don't know just like other defenses won't know