Our Current status at the WR position

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Imo our team has too many holes and we have limited resources draft picks and FA to try and upgrade a player/position where we got top 10 production.

Add a returning Malcolm Kelly and a developing Austin i think our WRs corps is one area that we can leave alone while we fix other areas.

Letting Tana walk is digging an hole to fill a hole.

Imo the struggles in our passing game are less b/c of Tana then of misuse of personnel, QB play and coaching/gameplanning/playcalling.


o Joey Galloway slowed/stunted the development of several players
Joey Galloway and Tana often ran in breaking routes that require physicality like slants and digs and square ins

o Fred Davis imo was woefully underused he was the most efficient pass catcher on the team yet was barely on the field more then our ineffective 3rd WRs and also received fewer targets then our 3rd WRs and our most of RBs and FB.

o our QB and OC couldn't get on the same page which limited the passing offense

o very limited use of the screen game

o lack of creativity (we couldn't get Tana/Banks the ball in space?)

I think our passing game has enough talent to be competitive especially if Kelly, Austin and Banks can be worked into the offense.
(imagine what the Pats would do w/ a player like Banks?)

I don't disagree with any of your reasons for the passing game struggles, I'm just talking about the struggles of the offense isolated to plays when Moss gets the ball, i.e. about 1/4 of our entire passing offense. Moving Moss isn't going to affect the other 3/4 of our passes, and we have plenty of work to do in those aspects.

I think Moss was a nice system fit this year, I just happen to feel that he did about as well as he could have given his skill set. Letting Moss walk isn't really creating a new hole because an upgrade is already a need, but more directly, he's not under contract for next season. Put in perspective, we could let Moss walk and sign James Jones (GB) and place him in the same role, and we'd more or less have the same strengths and weaknesses with a younger player. Not advocating Jones here or that you'd throw a guy like Jones 145 balls in a season...but of course we shouldn't do the same with Moss again.

I think Moss will get picked up fairly quickly when he hits the market because he's still a very good route runner and he's good around the goal line and he's tough to tackle in space and that's all very valuable receiver stuff. I just don't think it makes much sense for the Redskins to bring him back. I don't see a contract extension to be filling any sort of hole in our offense, instead it just holds the status quo.

I would not scramble frantically to replace Santana Moss' role in the offense, I think it opens up more natural looks for guys like Davis.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

...you'd throw a guy like Jones 145 balls in a season...but of course we shouldn't do the same with Moss again.

I actually agree w/ the general idea that good WRs given enough targets can have a solid production. (idk about Jones though)
And in that light i view Moss production as solid.
You sighted his yds/target stat in a previous thread being around 7ish.
But, 7ish isn't bad for a primary WR.

Here are some other primary target WRs around the same yds/target number as Moss:
Roddy White 179 targets/1389 yards=7.76
Moss 146/1115=7.64
Reggie Wayne 173/1355=7.83
Colston 133/1023=7.70
*Larry Fitz=6.54 (but he had a horrible group of QB limit his production)

I don't see a contract extension to be filling any sort of hole in our offense, instead it just holds the status quo.

Moss's production isn't bad in my view.
And the status quo might get better as Kyle learns how to make better use of his skills i.e. running him deep more and not wasting him running slants and in breaking routes that require physicality and good hands. (Kelly should help in this area)

I think upgrading the passing game can more easily w/ lower risk by getting more production/upgrading our 3rd WR then by letting Moss go and hoping to find an improvement.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I don't disagree with any of your reasons for the passing game struggles, I'm just talking about the struggles of the offense isolated to plays when Moss gets the ball, i.e. about 1/4 of our entire passing offense. Moving Moss isn't going to affect the other 3/4 of our passes, and we have plenty of work to do in those aspects.

I think Moss was a nice system fit this year, I just happen to feel that he did about as well as he could have given his skill set. Letting Moss walk isn't really creating a new hole because an upgrade is already a need, but more directly, he's not under contract for next season. Put in perspective, we could let Moss walk and sign James Jones (GB) and place him in the same role, and we'd more or less have the same strengths and weaknesses with a younger player. Not advocating Jones here or that you'd throw a guy like Jones 145 balls in a season...but of course we shouldn't do the same with Moss again.

I think Moss will get picked up fairly quickly when he hits the market because he's still a very good route runner and he's good around the goal line and he's tough to tackle in space and that's all very valuable receiver stuff. I just don't think it makes much sense for the Redskins to bring him back. I don't see a contract extension to be filling any sort of hole in our offense, instead it just holds the status quo.

I would not scramble frantically to replace Santana Moss' role in the offense, I think it opens up more natural looks for guys like Davis.

GT, as noted earlier I understand your argument. I also applaud you for the analysis & looking into his stats rather than simply relying on those #s as a sole determination of his value. At the same time, where I disagree w/you is that Moss has a year under this system & is a known commodity. Unless they find a reciever from Houston or another former Shanahan player that can step in & knows the offense, the learning curve has to be taken into account. Aside from the offense, just adjusting to a new team, teamates,etc. is another factor.

With all of the issues this team has, I'd prefer to keep what little stability there is & I see Moss as part of it. The only way I would agree w/you is if the team had enough draft picks to land some wr's or they thought Austin would take that role. i.e. if this is a true clean-house rebuilding why not get rid of Moss? I know this is a rebuilding, call it whatever, but I don't think Shanahan wants to get rid of productive vets that are good for team chemistry. They may need Moss to help build the 'buy in' to the system if nothing else.

[JLee9718]

Fix the offensive line first, then get a wr.