Pro Bowl Bound - Samuels, Moss

[ST21]

Originally Posted by Southpaw

If Vick had Bledsoe's receivers or Washington's defense, he'd have more than eight wins.




I'm not actually defending him for the Pro Bowl, I'm just giving reasons why I can understand he was picked. You guys seem to forget that it's not just fans that pick the Pro Bowl, which is very apparent from the fact that Cooley didn't make it, in spite of being far and away the fan favorite. So obviously his peers and the coaches think he's worthy too.

Coaches gameplan for Vick and are always attempting to keep him contained. I highly doubt any coach in the league is saying to himself before a Dallas game, "How are we going to stop Bledsoe?".

Finally, Reason and Logic, Listen Ladies dont get it twisted (black terminology) I'm a Redskin fan...first, but this Idea that every QB has to stand in the pocket to be consider a regular QB is crazy, black or white, good is good and bad is bad, and Vick # don't state he should be there, but he does as much for his team as Peyton Manning..... Now everyone says I use race, and sometimes I do, because I can feel the hate for this one paticular QB, all you critics do are critize him,..... Respect what he can do, and give him time to grow, as far as I'm concerned....not just fans voted him in, and I didn't either...I voted for Brunell, Bled-hoe and Hasslebeck.....but this weekend I watch Peyton, look dazed and confused, and when he couldn't throw the ball those athletic abilitys didn't workout for him...........

[ST21]

Originally Posted by Southpaw

The Panthers and Bears are divison leading playoff teams. Brunell lost to the Raiders, and tried his best to lose to the Cardinals. Bledsoe also lost to the Raiders, and tried his best to lose to the Niners.

Good Ass point.....and everyone think Brunell has been great, he has, but only because Santana Moss has put him in that situation........

[ST21]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Your momma's overrated.

AND I'M CHILDISH.......

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by wewhite3

Finally, Reason and Logic, Listen Ladies dont get it twisted (black terminology) I'm a Redskin fan...first, but this Idea that every QB has to stand in the pocket to be consider a regular QB is crazy, black or white, good is good and bad is bad, and Vick # don't state he should be there, but he does as much for his team as Peyton Manning..... Now everyone says I use race, and sometimes I do, because I can feel the hate for this one paticular QB, all you critics do are critize him,..... Respect what he can do, and give him time to grow, as far as I'm concerned....not just fans voted him in, and I didn't either...I voted for Brunell, Bled-hoe and Hasslebeck.....but I watch Peyton, look dazed and confused, and when he did try to use those athletic abilitys to get out of the pocket............

If he still needs time to grow, how is he worthy of a Pro Bowl nod?

[skins052bgr8]

Vick could be getting the love because all the wins he has produced this year and he helps the Falcons win. Oh that is right they are also 8-6 and not going to the playoffs, so the Vick wins arguement is out the door, and the stats don't support the nod for Hawaii either. If anything he should have been put in the same situation as Cooley, what category do you put him in QB or RB, he beats teams with his legs and athletic ability. Oh yeah he should get the nod because he is fun and exciting to watch kind of like Mack Strong is more exciting to watch than Cooley, not. Even if Cooley was listed as a FB and it was wrong that is what they had him at and he definitely was the best player listed in that category statistically, and exciting.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

If he still needs time to grow, how is he worthy of a Pro Bowl nod?

EXACTLY!! Thank you Payne the Brain! And really has he grown much? I don't know if he's a better QB than he was when he entered the league.

And wewhite, why'd you vote for Hasselbeck and not Vick if just a few posts ago you called Hass overrated and you've gone so far as to change your avatar to a Falcons helmet in Vick's defense?

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by wewhite3

Good Ass point.....and everyone think Brunell has been great, he has, but only because Santana Moss has put him in that situation........

I would have to give both of them credit for both of their success. One could not have done it without the other. Credit should go 50/50.

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

EXACTLY!! Thank you Payne the Brain! And really has he grown much? I don't know if he's a better QB than he was when he entered the league.

And wewhite, why'd you vote for Hasselbeck and not Vick if just a few posts ago you called Hass overrated and you've gone so far as to change your avatar to a Falcons helmet in Vick's defense?

I'm SO not down with people picking due to race. We're ALL humans here, that's when you look at the stats and Vick just didn't have them.

[EXoffender]

Originally Posted by wewhite3

...dont get it twisted (black terminology)...

You've been watching too many episodes of America's Next Top Model.

[Cooley 350Z]

Vick is a commodity at quarterback, a glorified running back who happens to line up behind center & look off one receiver before he tucks the ball to run. He is essentially the same quarterback today as he was when he came into the league.

Base it on the receivers he has around him, the number of wins his team has, or the numbers he puts up, none of which merit a slot. Black, White, Asian or Redneck, the guy is overrated & does not deserve the distinction of being named a Pro-Bowl quarterback.

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by Cooley 350Z

Base it on the receivers he has around him, the number of wins his team has, or the numbers he puts up, none of which merit a slot. Black, White, Asian or Redneck, the guy is overrated & does not deserve the distinction of being named a Pro-Bowl quarterback.

The bottom line is, if his peers and the coaches that have to play against him every week thought he was as overrated as you guys seem to think he is, he wouldn't have gotten in. As I said before, Cooley was by far the fan favorite at the fullback position, but didn't get in, so it's a lot more than just a matter of a lot uneducated fans drooling over Michael Vick that got him into the Pro Bowl.

The funny thing is, this wouldn't even be a discussion if Brunell had gotten the nod.

[CrazyCanuck]

I'm glad some of our guys made it, but the ProBowl is overrated. It's become more about the NFL showcasing its stars, rather than a legitmate award based on performance. In other words it's just like all the other "all-star" games.

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by Southpaw

The bottom line is, if his peers and the coaches that have to play against him every week thought he was as overrated as you guys seem to think he is, he wouldn't have gotten in. As I said before, Cooley was by far the fan favorite at the fullback position, but didn't get in, so it's a lot more than just a matter of a lot uneducated fans drooling over Michael Vick that got him into the Pro Bowl.

The funny thing is, this wouldn't even be a discussion if Brunell had gotten the nod.

Exactly! Vick's peers think that he's a Pro Bowler and their votes are the ones that really matter. If people in the league didn't vote for him he wouldn't be going.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by jdlea

Exactly! Vick's peers think that he's a Pro Bowler and their votes are the ones that really matter. If people in the league didn't vote for him he wouldn't be going.

Players in the locker room usually don't put much thought into who they vote for. They often just fill out names just based on previous year's performance or simply name recognition. It's sort of an afterthought for them....or so I've been told.

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

This year Brady is putting up monster numbers, he's on pace for over 4000 yards and over 25 TDs. Those are big numbers worthy of the Pro Bowl IMO.

As for his previous years I'm not sure what you're talking about, he's always had the numbers.

Look at his yardage and TD-INT ratio over the past 3 years

2002: 3764, 28-14
2003: 3620, 23-12
2004: 3692, 28-14

I don't know where you come from, but where I come from those are pretty damn good numbers. Add in completion percentages all over 60% during those years and there's just no denying what Brady has done stats wise along with the wins.

Vick doesn't even touch these numbers. He's not even in the ball park. Their situations aren't similar in the least bit.

In 03 and 04, the last 2 times the Pats won Super Bowls he was in the top 10 with those passing numbers. If we're going to use stats to justify Pro Bowlers then he probably shouldn't have gone because there were 2 or 3 other QB's from the AFC who had more yards or TD's than him each year.

Brady wins games that's why it's similar to Vick. I even said that I wasn't comparing their numbers. All I said was they don't jump off the page. IMO they don't. I don't look at Tom Brady's stats and wonder how he did that. I did that with Manning and Culpepper last year, not Brady, but Brady is the one who took home the Lombardi Trophy. Brady's most important stat is 3, as in Super Bowl rings. I like QB's who win...that's what Vick does.