No indictment in the mike brown case

[Daseal]

I understand not bringing charges, but I am surprised. I expected them to consider the mixed testimony enough to take this to trial, if not just to appease the people. I understand not wanting that circus around. Not taking a stance on right or wrong, just a thought.

Joe, when it comes down to your advice in dealing with officers given to your son, I have one issue. Being a lawyer, I'd think you'd also make sure he understood his rights and when to refuse officers. Never let them search your car. Never tell them anything more than basic information. Never give them your phone passwords and I'd recommend encrypting and powering off your device.
(Note: The police can force a biometric (e.g. fingerprint) out of you for your phone, but cannot force a passcode. Additionally, if you use an android phone Google can provide law enforcement the pattern you use, even if encrypted. Go with the numeric pin.)

Lastly, I hope that this case is still the impetus for some real changes to our police force. Personally, it scares me that their word is always taken as the truth in a court of law. I want to see body cameras on every officer with hefty penalties for the device being "broken" or "malfunctioning" during a controversial stop. These cameras quell the crazy on both sides of it. It'll help the officers keep their cool during stressful situations and will reduce citizens being aggressive towards police officers. We've been spending decades militarizing our police force - it's time to bring them back to being public servants.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Daseal

I understand not bringing charges, but I am surprised. I expected them to consider the mixed testimony enough to take this to trial, if not just to appease the people. I understand not wanting that circus around. Not taking a stance on right or wrong, just a thought.
s.

If you understand why they are not bringing charges ,then why take it to court , just to sacrifice a police officer to keep the others happy ?

So you would be fine if the kid had gotten the cops gun and shot him ?

[Daseal]

Originally Posted by Giantone

If you understand why they are not bringing charges ,then why take it to court , just to sacrifice a police officer to keep the others happy ?

So you would be fine if the kid had gotten the cops gun and shot him ?

GiantOne - First of all, stop making huge jumps. He didn't get his gun. He didn't shoot him. Hopefully we can all agree that no one should die in these situations.

Second of all, I understand that there was evidence showing that perhaps the officer may have actually felt in legitimate fear for his life, however, there are other pieces of evidence that show perhaps he overstepped his bounds. I understand why they didn't, but could also see them bringing charges. I feel if there are two potential stories it's best to send it to court and allow the evidence to be viewed and questioned by both parties.

I don't trust eye witness accounts unless 85% of them are all consistent with each other. I also do not trust the officers word one lick. He's in self-preservation mode and we've shown a clear precedent for not going after officers that perjure themselves.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Daseal

GiantOne - First of all, stop making huge jumps. He didn't get his gun. He didn't shoot him. Hopefully we can all agree that no one should die in these situations.

Second of all, I understand that there was evidence showing that perhaps the officer may have actually felt in legitimate fear for his life, however, there are other pieces of evidence that show perhaps he overstepped his bounds. I understand why they didn't, but could also see them bringing charges. I feel if there are two potential stories it's best to send it to court and allow the evidence to be viewed and questioned by both parties.

I don't trust eye witness accounts unless 85% of them are all consistent with each other. I also do not trust the officers word one lick. He's in self-preservation mode and we've shown a clear precedent for not going after officers that perjure themselves.

So a man ,6'4 300 ,reaches into a police car and struggles with the Police Officer for his gun(there is no question about this) and proof that the gun was fired in the car (no question) you think there "might be a legitimate fear" for his life ?My question to you is if the cop was dead would you care or would you be talking about this right now .You say you don't trust eyewitness accounts all but one pretty much match the "physical evidence" ,do you trust that ?

[Daseal]

Originally Posted by Giantone

So a man ,6'4 300 ,reaches into a police car and struggles with the Police Officer for his gun(there is no question about this) and proof that the gun was fired in the car (no question) you think there "might be a legitimate fear" for his life ?My question to you is if the cop was dead would you care or would you be talking about this right now .You say you don't trust eyewitness accounts all but one pretty much match the "physical evidence" ,do you trust that ?

I have two points. One, I think there was enough to go to trial. I think the officer is let free on trial, but would have liked to see the opportunity for both sides to review and question the evidence at hand. We clearly don't agree there - that's okay.

Second. I want to use this as an impetus for change. I want every cop wearing a camera that's running at all times with a microphone. I want massive penalties to either the cop or his superiors if the cameras are not working or disabled at the time of any action. These are the types of technologies we have at our disposal and are generally pretty cheap. Stop buying assault vehicles for no-knock raids - and buy things to protect the vast majority of Americans. Our police forces are being militarized and they need to be brought back to being public defenders.

If the officer was shot, yes, I would feel bad for him and it wouldn't change my stance on changing oversight and documenting their actions. As I said, point one and point two are not directly related in this case. However, the more we see cases with differing eye witness reviews it would have easily shown the conflict through the eyes of the officer eliminating any potential issues with what happened.

[over the mountain]

Originally Posted by Giantone

So a man ,6'4 300 ,reaches into a police car and struggles with the Police Officer for his gun(there is no question about this) and proof that the gun was fired in the car (no question) you think there "might be a legitimate fear" for his life ?My question to you is if the cop was dead would you care or would you be talking about this right now .You say you don't trust eyewitness accounts all but one pretty much match the "physical evidence" ,do you trust that ?

the lethal force was used when mike brown was 100 to 150 yards (or feet?) away.

if a person has a stick, an officer gets "in fear of their life" and kills the stick holder with 15 shots.

is a black guy holding a stick objectively more dangerous than a white guy?

the stats say overwhelmingly yes when we know common sense says it should absolutely not matter.

but race does matter in this country with all races contributing to the problem. with all races also contributing to trying to make a positive change.

from what little i know of this particular incident, i dont think the office should have been indicted. in a confrontational situation, i dont know how i would react and dont want to play judge and think i would be calm and rational. of course i havent been trained to handle high stress confrontations and how to use a hand gun and dont get paid good money to do so day-in-day-out but .. .

imo the protests arent necessarily about the facts of mike brown but the alarming statistic of black men/teens killed by police officers.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

the lethal force was used when mike brown was 100 to 150 yards (or feet?) away.

if a person has a stick, an officer gets "in fear of their life" and kills the stick holder with 15 shots.

is a black guy holding a stick objectively more dangerous than a white guy?

the stats say overwhelmingly yes when we know common sense says it should absolutely not matter.

but race does matter in this country with all races contributing to the problem. with all races also contributing to trying to make a positive change.

from what little i know of this particular incident, i dont think the office should have been indicted. in a confrontational situation, i dont know how i would react and dont want to play judge and think i would be calm and rational. of course i havent been trained to handle high stress confrontations and how to use a hand gun and dont get paid good money to do so day-in-day-out but .. .

imo the protests arent necessarily about the facts of mike brown but the alarming statistic of black men/teens killed by police officers.

If the cop shot Brown from 100 yds away with a handgun, sign that man up to our olympic team in biathlon or any shooting competition! LOL.

[Chico23231]

N.Y. cop not indicted in choke hold death - CNN.com

Un-f*cking-belivable

If i was up in staten isl...i wouldnt hit the steet protesting...id just get a crew of people and about 3am tonight, get a bunch of molatov cocktails, light them, and proceed to firebomb multiple police stations around the area.

[over the mountain]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

If the cop shot Brown from 100 yds away with a handgun, sign that man up to our olympic team in biathlon or any shooting competition! LOL.

he took about 8 shots ...

chico -- that is unbelievable. these prosecutors can get an indictment or not get an indictment if they want. sealed proceedings, any info comes in even if it would be inadmissible at trial, no right to counsel inside the doors etc ...

that NY case is what should be leading this discussion, not mike browns (with all due respect) .. id love to hear what rush, palin etc say about that one.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

he took about 8 shots ...

Do you think Brown ran 100 yards away from the cop? LINK

And hitting someone once from 100 yds away with a 8 shots of a normal handgun would still be impressive.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Giantone

So a man ,6'4 300 ,reaches into a police car and struggles with the Police Officer for his gun(there is no question about this) and proof that the gun was fired in the car (no question) you think there "might be a legitimate fear" for his life ? My question to you is if the cop was dead would you care or would you be talking about this right now .You say you don't trust eyewitness accounts all but one pretty much match the "physical evidence" ,do you trust that ?

If the cop was dead, Mike Brown would be on death row right now.

[HailGreen28]

Also, is anyone still sure that Brown had his hands up when he was shot? Or could the whole "hands up, don't shoot" thing have been a lie?

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

Also, is anyone still sure that Brown had his hands up when he was shot? Or could the whole "hands up, don't shoot" thing have been a lie?

U think its ok for the police to choke a man to death on the sidewalk for selling cigarettes? I hope those folks burn down every police station in nyc.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

U think its ok for the police to choke a man to death on the sidewalk for selling cigarettes? I hope those folks burn down every police station in nyc.

Another strawman argument, like the Micheal Brown "100 yds away" and "hands up don't shoot". Garner was a big fat ashmatic guy saying "I can't breathe" while being held down and handcuffed. This is after the chokehold/headlock was used when officer in question was trying to take him down like a lion hanging off a buffalo.

The issue should be over taking care of a suspect after being handcuffed, not whether the chokehold/head lock was needed. But so many things seem to get distorted so easy, smh.

And c'mon Chico, you seemed better than your last sentence.

edit: LINK

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

U think its ok for the police to choke a man to death on the sidewalk for selling cigarettes?

.........and resisting arrest ,had he not done that he would have been out of jail in hours and still alive .