What is wrong with Santana Moss? (merged)

[GusFrerotte]

It is not like the stats have lied to us at all. We have the most overpaid WR Corp in the NFL for what we have received in terms of production the past few years. Remember David Patten? If Moss catches that bomb from JC on the Pack 15 game over. I opt not to resign him personally and not because of todays off day for him. I rather have a taller, more physical guy like TO or Randy Moss, Stallworth, etc that an undersized speedster. Santana isn't 100 % yet in his defense, but without the speed what is the upside with an undersized guy?

[JWsleep]

Moss's strengths are his hands and his speed. The injury can account for the speed (though he seems pretty fast getting behind folks), but the hands is something mental. Hope he works it out, because we need him.

To be fair, JC missed at least two crucial passes today--one the overthrow to Lloyd, the other a missed read throwing to Sellers instead of MacCardell on the short slant. But that's going to happen with a young QB. The vet WRs out there need to help him out until he fully gets the timing and touch of a seasoned NFL QB.

Oh, and that "interception"--Moss bounces it up in the air, and then both the defender and ARE come down with it. What a weak call that it was an INT. And so not JC's fault.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Moss's strengths are his hands and his speed. The injury can account for the speed (though he seems pretty fast getting behind folks), but the hands is something mental. Hope he works it out, because we need him.

To be fair, JC missed at least two crucial passes today--one the overthrow to Lloyd, the other a missed read throwing to Sellers instead of MacCardell on the short slant. But that's going to happen with a young QB. The vet WRs out there need to help him out until he fully gets the timing and touch of a seasoned NFL QB.

Oh, and that "interception"--Moss bounces it up in the air, and then both the defender and ARE come down with it. What a weak call that it was an INT. And so not JC's fault.

Agreed that the INT should've been ruled a completion to ARE for simultaneous posession with the defender.

I'm a little concerned that unless Campbell learns to put more touch on deep balls, he will continue to miss wide open opportunities. Elite QBs do not miss the throw that Lloyd couldn't quite pull in. Campbell also missed Cooley on a fairly deep throw in the first half. Until he starts making those type of plays with more consistency, I don't believe you can characterize Campbell as a great deep passer. Hopefully the coaches are addressing his touch on deeper throws in practice. Of course the deep throw to Moss was pretty damn solid, and that could have turned the game in the Skins favor.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

This is what I find slightly irritating:

Person A: "Man, Player X really had a bad game today. I wonder what his problem is?"

Person B: "Hey, let's not cut the guy just because he had a bad game."

To criticize a player for a bad game does not automatically mean that person thinks he should cut.

This is what I find irritating:

Poster A: "Man, I want to keep whining about how our team losing games they should've won. The sky is falling and blah blah blah.

Poster B: "Man, I know we lost today, but there is still much of the season left to play so stop focusing on the whining and start thinking about next week against the Cards.

And really, if you had paid attention, you'd realize I actually said (although maybe in another thread) "what was wrong with Moss today?"

But anyways, my thought on Moss being cut was tongue in cheek, but you continued to pick it part like boogers from your nose. And it really was just an expression. My biggest point was Moss played like crap today, but ya know, there is still 11 games left in the season for us. So, stop whining and focus on what is next for us.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

I opt not to resign him personally and not because of todays off day for him. I rather have a taller, more physical guy like TO or Randy Moss, Stallworth, etc that an undersized speedster. Santana isn't 100 % yet in his defense, but without the speed what is the upside with an undersized guy?

I believe the guy you are speaking of is Brandon Lloyd, to a certain degree. Unfortunately he obviously hasn't played anywhere near those expectations.

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by RJ2kWJ

Oh he definitely isn't getting cut... But he definitely cost us this game. BIG TIME. He didn't seem like he even gave a crap about it either.

Moss was on post game (Comcast) with B. Mitch and Ray Brown- seemed genuinely contrite about the game he had today. I was actually suprised that he even played today because of that groin injury that's been troubling him the last few weeks. It may have been better had he not played at all. His injury problems started back in the spring during OTA's (no contact) and I mentioned then that I was concerned about his seemingly history of injury problems. Groin injuries can be lasting if you're not careful, I just don't think he's completely healthy, and his play today was indicative of that fact.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by Gmanc711

Man I really really really want to give Santana the benifit of the doubt...but the guy hasent played well all season. He has made a couple of nice catches but overall, he just isnt the player he has been the past couple years up to this point.

I mean Moss is one of my favorite players, hell his was the jersey I choose to wear for the game today....but man I've never seen one single player cost us a game the way he did today. Two plays just stick out to me, the fumble (obviously)...and when he had the chance to turn things around and make a big play with that catch, he drops it. That is a minimum of 3 points for us and ties us at 17......I really hope he has a good game next week because he's a guy I really like cheering for, but damn he needs to pick it up

Moss will bounce back. He was a stand-up guy during postgame interviews. I believe that his performance today will be motivation to make plays for his teammates going forward. I still say that the reverse was a LOUSY call on a wet field.

[Chief X_Phackter]

I think Moss and Rogers secretly switched jerseys during the bye week.

Jokes over, switch back please!

[RobH4413]

Moss will be fine. He need to heal, and his hands will be back.


I'm concerned about 1/1000th as much about Moss than I am about our o-line.

[crawfish]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

Agreed that the INT should've been ruled a completion to ARE for simultaneous posession with the defender.

I'm a little concerned that unless Campbell learns to put more touch on deep balls, he will continue to miss wide open opportunities. Elite QBs do not miss the throw that Lloyd couldn't quite pull in. Campbell also missed Cooley on a fairly deep throw in the first half. Until he starts making those type of plays with more consistency, I don't believe you can characterize Campbell as a great deep passer. Hopefully the coaches are addressing his touch on deeper throws in practice. Of course the deep throw to Moss was pretty damn solid, and that could have turned the game in the Skins favor.

Yeah JC misses some but he also puts some right on the money that guys are dropping. I would say JC played well enough for us to easily win this game. Problem is when we loose everyone tends to nit pick.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by RobH4413

Moss will be fine. He need to heal, and his hands will be back.


I'm concerned about 1/1000th as much about Moss than I am about our o-line.

Totally agree on the O-line. Gibbs may have to move away from his total commitment to establish the run when the O-line is in shambles. As for the passing attack, the fact that Cooley was fully utilized underneath should only open up more plays downfield. Frankly, with the nice route that Lloyd ran on that deep ball, I hope he gets some chances moving forward. Working him back into the rotation will help keep ARE and Moss fresh, and perhaps help all of them to perform that much better as a unit.

[dgack]

Count me in the "doubting Santana" category, but I'd love to eat those words. He hasn't looked like the same guy since he hurt himself last year.

[ArcticRed]

Moss will be fine. I agree with some of the others that the rain cause a huge problem for Moss. Everytime I see it raining I just know we are screwed. In the past, the Skins have been horrible on the rainy games that I can remember while Gibbs has been coach. The denver game in 2005 and I believe the playoff game against Seattle. Just like today, they dominated in each of the games but just cant seem to completely adjust to the hostile terrain and lose in the end.

My question is what the team did to adjust to the slippery ball and field. The packers showed that it effected their team, but were able to adjust to the conditions. What the hell did we do? From the looks nothing. We were slipping all over the field till the last snap of the game. We need this win damn it!

[jamf]

I think the field condition got into Moss' head. If you are coming back from a groin/hamstring injury, the last thing you want to do is play on a sloppy field. You saw Heyer slip and do the splits causing a serious injury. Randle El had a drop or two. I think Moss was thinking about his next cut before he caught the ball. Unfortunate but anyone who's had an injury to his legs knows that the next time you go out and try to play ball, it's in your head. hopefully with a full week of practice he will build confidence in himself.


My one problem with moss today, He was quoted as saying he took himself out of the game because he didn't want to continue to hurt the team. He need to fight through his problems. Even as a decoy, he has value to the offense. He gave up...

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by jamf

He was quoted as saying he took himself out of the game because he didn't want to continue to hurt the team. He need to fight through his problems. Even as a decoy, he has value to the offense. He gave up...

If he said that, that's total BS. What kind of a message does that send to the rest of the team? That you aren't willing to go to battle with them because your pu$$y hurts? BS.