Simply put, FEMA sucks!!

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Yeah the dept was made post 9/11. The agencies within though were all pre-exisiting though. There was no Homeland Security agency or dept before. I am sure that is totally Bush's fault.

Actually, the pieces that now make up DHS were formed from chunks of 22 other government agencies. They weren't operating on their own.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by mheisig

Perfectly stated.

It's the responsibility of the local government, not the Federal government, to take the first steps in responding to and preparing for such disasters. The local government in LA and New Orleans basically ignored all the warnings until it was too late, then tried to pin it on the Federal government.

Again, a complete inability for people to take responsibility for their actions. Even now the inability of the citizens to clean things up themselves even in minor ways is simply appalling. Everyone expects someone else to come and solve their problems.

You know they found a survey of the New Orleans people about who would leave if a hurricane of a certain size was going to hit. I think something like 75% said they would not leave and ride out the hurricane. A hurricane does not realy bother me but one of that size and living below sea level I would have benn out of there.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by Buster

The DHS is a great thing, and very necessary. Notice how many terrorism plots we've foiled since 09-11...a LOT of them, most unreported by the media.

L.A. Airport for one, would've been blown to smitherines.

Yep, Bush's fault.

Amazing how real [good] news doesn't get aired, isn't it?

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Thanks for the clarification. Yes, they pretty much took an alrady existing agency and put Tom Ridges' face on it and called it Homeland Security.

They took 22 different agencies and tried to have them coordinate efforts. Anyone who has ever been part of a corporate merger or departmental meger knows how well something like that goes. A bunch of independent agencies(in this case) trying to work together is bound to be a disaster. Especially when the agencies themselves(FEMA is the best example) barely function on their own.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

You're crazy man! You and your not blaming everything on Dubya. You have clearly lost it. You must be a card carrying Bushite.

No, I just don't call him Hitler and blame EVERYTHING on him because I hate him and want him out of office.

If you look at facts instead of agendas, you'll see the blame for Katrina is spread all around but mostly the local and state government was at fault.

The position of President doesn't even have legal jurisdiction to take over responsibilities that state and the federal Constitution have outlined as state responsibilities. Even if President Bush had wanted to push them out of the way and take over, he couldn't legally. He did what he could by making suggestions to get people out, but that's really all he was allowed to do. Look at Florida, they have 20 hurricanes a year and aren't in chaos by one in New Orleans that didn't even hit them directly.

Sign up for a civics course somewhere, it might help you understand. You can't rely on media reports for facts.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by firstdown

You know they found a survey of the New Orleans people about who would leave if a hurricane of a certain size was going to hit. I think something like 75% said they would not leave and ride out the hurricane. A hurricane does not realy bother me but one of that size and living below sea level I would have benn out of there.

My uncle lives 1 block from the French Quarter. He realized the need to evacuate on his own and got out a day or two before Katrina hit. Most of his junk was destroyed, but he thought about it enough to save himself.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

Amazing how real [good] news doesn't get aired, isn't it?

Well, if a story doesn't fit the media's agenda which is now to hurt the President and therefore the nation...they ignore it.

That's why we're not hearing all of the success stories from Iraq like little girls going to school for the first time, how they have better power and utilities and hospitals after the war than they EVER did under Saddam, how people go into the streets to hug and thank our troops, how people aren't being killed and tortured because they walked by a palace at the wrong time, even how their police and military forces helped us kill Zarqawi. They're afraid that publishing good news (facts) will help the President in public opinion.

[dmek25]

back in 1998( or somewhere around there) pres. clinton tried to establish a federal office that is now known as homeland security. the republican run congress laughed in his face saying there is no need to waste anymore tax dollars on something we dont need. the rest, as they say, is history

[dmek25]

as far as iraq, there is still places that pre strike had electricity, that are still dark. my whole beef with iraq is lets take care of our own here in the us before we branch out to help others

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Buster

No, I just don't call him Hitler and blame EVERYTHING on him because I hate him and want him out of office.

If you look at facts instead of agendas, you'll see the blame for Katrina is spread all around but mostly the local and state government was at fault.

The position of President doesn't even have legal jurisdiction to take over responsibilities that state and the federal Constitution have outlined as state responsibilities. Even if President Bush had wanted to push them out of the way and take over, he couldn't legally. He did what he could by making suggestions to get people out, but that's really all he was allowed to do. Look at Florida, they have 20 hurricanes a year and aren't in chaos by one in New Orleans that didn't even hit them directly.

Sign up for a civics course somewhere, it might help you understand. You can't rely on media reports for facts.

I was kidding. I agree with you. My sarcasm doesn't carry well over the net usually. I should know better.

On a different note in the same vein. Is it me or does someone basically throwing bombs about a subject totally rule the political landscape right now? I say this because That Guy, who isn't here right now but I hope he comes back and participates ome more, basically is obviously really anti-Bush. Which most of us can understand. Things are screwded up everywhere and blame lays with him on some. But when people make statements followed by logical and reasonable rebuttals and the original person making the statements justs yells and screams about it don't they invalidate themselves? That Guy come back and continue this!

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by dmek25

back in 1998( or somewhere around there) pres. clinton tried to establish a federal office that is now known as homeland security. the republican run congress laughed in his face saying there is no need to waste anymore tax dollars on something we dont need. the rest, as they say, is history

Clinton was also the President who wouldn't let the CIA or NSA share information with the FBI about a terrorist if they had evidence in hand that would stop something catostrophic. They just had to sit back and let it happen. Their hands where tied. I wonder how well his DHS would have worked.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I was kidding. I agree with you. My sarcasm doesn't carry well over the net usually. I should know better.

On a different note in the same vein. Is it me or does someone basically throwing bombs about a subject totally rule the political landscape right now? I say this because That Guy, who isn't here right now but I hope he comes back and participates ome more, basically is obviously really anti-Bush. Which most of us can understand. Things are screwded up everywhere and blame lays with him on some. But when people make statements followed by logical and reasonable rebuttals and the original person making the statements justs yells and screams about it don't they invalidate themselves? That Guy come back and continue this!

You forgot to set your sarcasm bit.

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

My uncle lives 1 block from the French Quarter. He realized the need to evacuate on his own and got out a day or two before Katrina hit. Most of his junk was destroyed, but he thought about it enough to save himself.

That's great that he had the common sense that most people there didn't.

Really, the hurricane passed by and it didn't do much damage at all, it was the levies breaking afterwards that caused pretty much all of the damage. They'd be warned for decades and they didn't even have the sense to know that Mother Nature always wins.

I feel sorry for the older people who wanted to leave but the Mayor didn't want to start the buses for some unknown reason, but most of the people who stayed were just playing Russian Roulette with their life.

It's a party town. You can't expect responsible people to live there for the most part. Look how they had their Mardi Gras boobie party a few months later when they could've been spending the funding on cleanup and getting people back into their homes. Personally, I don't think they should waste the money to rebuild the city, it will STILL be in a position below sea level that will leave it vulnerable to being flushed again. It's just NOT a place to build a city and since all of the port businesses have been leaving for years anyways, it's no longer useful for the purpose that it was built for in that toilet bowl-like position.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by dmek25

as far as iraq, there is still places that pre strike had electricity, that are still dark. my whole beef with iraq is lets take care of our own here in the us before we branch out to help others

Isolationist?

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I was kidding. I agree with you. My sarcasm doesn't carry well over the net usually. I should know better.

On a different note in the same vein. Is it me or does someone basically throwing bombs about a subject totally rule the political landscape right now? I say this because That Guy, who isn't here right now but I hope he comes back and participates ome more, basically is obviously really anti-Bush. Which most of us can understand. Things are screwded up everywhere and blame lays with him on some. But when people make statements followed by logical and reasonable rebuttals and the original person making the statements justs yells and screams about it don't they invalidate themselves? That Guy come back and continue this!

You would think so...