Donovan McNabb: The New Face of The Redskins

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

It will be interesting to see if this "Lovefest" for McNabb continues through the season.

Lovefest? This is practically a public riot. People think that just because we're trying to "win now" we're doing things the Vinny way. I think people had it set in their minds that we were going to be below .500 this year and now that it's clear that we're going to try to win people are uncomfortable because they immediately associate this with the old regime.

Yet at the same time people were begging for us to go O-Line first and with this trade we're practically guaranteed to get a franchise tackle, yet thats not good enough for some people, because they thought QB hungry people would accept simply drafting a Tony Pike or God forbid John Skelator. This is the compromise and it's a pretty damn good one if you ask me. Franchise tackle and QB in the same year.

This is a front office that has been proactive all the while displaying prudence and patience. I certainly don't agree with the Vinny comparisons though I do understand what would lead one to draw that conclusion.

And one more thing, Vinny would have basically thrown the bank at Peppers, Clifton, and Dansby. Drafted Clausen then traded for Gaither. Personally I don't mind the draft strategy but going after the first three free agents mentioned would have been overkill.

[TheSmurfs22]

Going to be weird seeing McNabb in the B and G. Already strange to see his face with the Skins emblem next to it.
I am really excited about the draft and what will happen and how the Campbell situation is going to play out.

[warpaint]

Originally Posted by saden1

McNabb is not and will never be the face of the Redskins. He may play for the Skins but he will always be the face of the Eagles.

You guys might not want him to be the face for the team, but I bet the front office will do all they can to make him the face for the team, love it or hate it, its pretty much a done deal.

Here is a good question so is the face of the team and dont say Shanny, because there is hardly ever a coach thats a face for certain team.

[SmootSmack]

McNabb, by the way, did not have a no trade clause in his contract with Philly

[saden1]

Originally Posted by warpaint

You guys might not want him to be the face for the team, but I bet the front office will do all they can to make him the face for the team, love it or hate it, its pretty much a done deal.

Here is a good question so is the face of the team and dont say Shanny, because there is hardly ever a coach thats a face for certain team.

The front office can sell me a loaf a shit in hot-dog bun but that doesn't mean I'll be buying. Clinton Portis is still the face of the Redskins and if he isn't well then the Redskins are faceless.

Don't try sell me no god damn McNabb as the face of the Skins...I won't buy that crap.

[warpaint]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

McNabb, by the way, did not have a no trade clause in his contract with Philly

So if he didn't have the no-trade clause. Then I take back what I said earlier, So is this our front office just doing their magic and pulling a rabbit out of the hat.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by saden1

The front office can sell me a loaf a shit in hot-dog bun but that doesn't mean I'll be buying. Clinton Portis is still the face of the Redskins and if he isn't well then the Redskins are faceless.

Don't try sell me no god damn McNabb as the face of the Skins...I won't buy that crap.

You don't think that McNabb will tell Janky Spanky to shut the eff up if he tries his prima donna crap?

I do. McNabb is Shanny's guy. Janky Spanky is fighting for a roster spot.

[warpaint]

Originally Posted by saden1

The front office can sell me a loaf a shit in hot-dog bun but that doesn't mean I'll be buying. Clinton Portis is still the face of the Redskins and if he isn't well then the Redskins are faceless.

Don't try sell me no god damn McNabb as the face of the Skins...I won't buy that crap.

C.P. really. I personally think he is a joke and quitter. I lean towards ORAKPO.

[SBXVII]

What I find funny is a month ago, two months ago or longer people defended JC like a bee's hive. I'd say he can't read defenses, he throws behind his WR's all the time, he over throws his WR's, he fails to go through his progressions, he has terrible clock management..... and I'd be met with all this statistical BS to prove JC was not that bad and how under Shanahan he will be awsome and I didn't know what I'm talking about because the statistics showed otherwise.

We pick up McNabb and some of us point out that although McNabb had better players, system and HC his stats were not far and above JC's and thats worry some and everyone quickly throws up that "stats are not everything." I find it funny how people count the stats when it helps them and discounts stats when it hurts their arguement.

I'll be the first to say under Shanahan I'm not as worried about the OL as most of you are. I'm pretty sure he will fix the problem. I think we have enough coach's who coached WR's prior to their current gig that the position coach won't be an issue. All the position coach's are on the same page and the HC is far and above better then Zorn.

Some people have argued that Shanahan only made the SB cause he had a HOF/franchise QB in Elway, but I'll remind you that when Shanahan took over in Denver Elway was considered washed up and 34 y/o. McNabb is considered a HOF/franchise QB and is 33 y/o as Shanahan is taking over the Skins now. I'll say I hope he can work his magic again, but I'm not enamoured with this trade, I don't see McNabb as the McNabb prior to 2004 form, I'm worried about McNabb having all the tools to do a better job then what he did but didn't according to his stats or JC did far and above better with lesser talent to work with and a shitty HC/system.

I'm in no way endorsing JC. I'm glad we are trying to upgrade, I just wonder how much of an upgrade we made. The stats don't show we took a huge leap or bound to get better. If it was Payton Manning I'd say yes we did or Drew Brees I'd say yes we did. this feels like us making a lateral move with Cutler except it's McNabb instead. On top of that some of you are saying "are you crazy do you know what McNabb has done?" and I'm saying yes I do but do you know what he's done lately? Stop living in his past and look at his present and how his present will help us. He's only marginally better then JC according to his stats which means I hope Kyle Shanahan puts together one hell of a passing attack and Mike Shanahan builds one hell of a running attack and I'm proven wrong and McNabb thrives in this system and takes us to the SB. I'm just not sold on this deal as of yet. I was in "rebuild" mode. Our FO is one player away from the SB still.

[SBXVII]

[QUOTE=Dirtbag359;683854]Lovefest? This is practically a public riot. People think that just because we're trying to "win now" we're doing things the Vinny way. I think people had it set in their minds that we were going to be below .500 this year and now that it's clear that we're going to try to win people are uncomfortable because they immediately associate this with the old regime.

Yet at the same time people were begging for us to go O-Line first and with this trade we're practically guaranteed to get a franchise tackle, yet thats not good enough for some people, because they thought QB hungry people would accept simply drafting a Tony Pike or God forbid John Skelator. This is the compromise and it's a pretty damn good one if you ask me. Franchise tackle and QB in the same year.

This is a front office that has been proactive all the while displaying prudence and patience. I certainly don't agree with the Vinny comparisons though I do understand what would lead one to draw that conclusion.

And one more thing, Vinny would have basically thrown the bank at Peppers, Clifton, and Dansby. Drafted Clausen then traded for Gaither. Personally I don't mind the draft strategy but going after the first three free agents mentioned would have been overkill.[/QUOTE]

You are 100% talking about me. The first quote kinda speaks volumes as to how I feel. I'm doing my best to not draw comparisons but right after we let go of the aged players not producing we picked up other aged players. slight concern. The lower cost is the only positive.

The second quote I would disagree with. He only threw the bank at AH last yr. We picked up some cheap possibly prudent FA's although we are not getting younger, then we made our biggest move for McNabb throwing away draft picks.... multiple draft picks. I'd have rather picked up "our" Rookie franchise QB for the future (going with the getting younger theme) or kept JC with slightly lesser stats, put him in this better system and made him battle for whoever should be starter. We would not have thrown away draft picks. Especially since we were short by one and used one on a defensive player last yr in the supp. draft.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag359

Lovefest? This is practically a public riot. People think that just because we're trying to "win now" we're doing things the Vinny way. I think people had it set in their minds that we were going to be below .500 this year and now that it's clear that we're going to try to win people are uncomfortable because they immediately associate this with the old regime.

Yet at the same time people were begging for us to go O-Line first and with this trade we're practically guaranteed to get a franchise tackle, yet thats not good enough for some people, because they thought QB hungry people would accept simply drafting a Tony Pike or God forbid John Skelator. This is the compromise and it's a pretty damn good one if you ask me. Franchise tackle and QB in the same year.

This is a front office that has been proactive all the while displaying prudence and patience. I certainly don't agree with the Vinny comparisons though I do understand what would lead one to draw that conclusion.

And one more thing, Vinny would have basically thrown the bank at Peppers, Clifton, and Dansby. Drafted Clausen then traded for Gaither. Personally I don't mind the draft strategy but going after the first three free agents mentioned would have been overkill.

I personally don't give a damn what Vinny would have done, he's not here. GTripp basically got called out for saying if you want to judge Shanahan and Allen on this move alone, they were idiots. If I recall correctly, the Eagles at first wanted a 1rst round pick for McNabb. Then after not getting much action, lowered that to a top 42 pick. We gave them #37 and a 3rd or 4th next year. I call that idiotic. Not only did we draft IMO, an over rated 33 year old QB with a very high 2nd this year, we're drafting a 34 year old over rated QB with our 3rd or 4th next year. And one more thing. I would hardly call throwing draft picks at a 33 year old QB prudence and patience.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

McNabb, by the way, did not have a no trade clause in his contract with Philly

So why did Reid say that McNabb had to agree on the team they wanted to trade with? He said this in his presser Sun. night.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

What I find funny is a month ago, two months ago or longer people defended JC like a bee's hive. I'd say he can't read defenses, he throws behind his WR's all the time, he over throws his WR's, he fails to go through his progressions, he has terrible clock management..... and I'd be met with all this statistical BS to prove JC was not that bad and how under Shanahan he will be awsome and I didn't know what I'm talking about because the statistics showed otherwise.

We pick up McNabb and some of us point out that although McNabb had better players, system and HC his stats were not far and above JC's and thats worry some and everyone quickly throws up that "stats are not everything." I find it funny how people count the stats when it helps them and discounts stats when it hurts their arguement.

I'll be the first to say under Shanahan I'm not as worried about the OL as most of you are. I'm pretty sure he will fix the problem. I think we have enough coach's who coached WR's prior to their current gig that the position coach won't be an issue. All the position coach's are on the same page and the HC is far and above better then Zorn.

Some people have argued that Shanahan only made the SB cause he had a HOF/franchise QB in Elway, but I'll remind you that when Shanahan took over in Denver Elway was considered washed up and 34 y/o. McNabb is considered a HOF/franchise QB and is 33 y/o as Shanahan is taking over the Skins now. I'll say I hope he can work his magic again, but I'm not enamoured with this trade, I don't see McNabb as the McNabb prior to 2004 form, I'm worried about McNabb having all the tools to do a better job then what he did but didn't according to his stats or JC did far and above better with lesser talent to work with and a shitty HC/system.

I'm in no way endorsing JC. I'm glad we are trying to upgrade, I just wonder how much of an upgrade we made. The stats don't show we took a huge leap or bound to get better. If it was Payton Manning I'd say yes we did or Drew Brees I'd say yes we did. this feels like us making a lateral move with Cutler except it's McNabb instead. On top of that some of you are saying "are you crazy do you know what McNabb has done?" and I'm saying yes I do but do you know what he's done lately? Stop living in his past and look at his present and how his present will help us. He's only marginally better then JC according to his stats which means I hope Kyle Shanahan puts together one hell of a passing attack and Mike Shanahan builds one hell of a running attack and I'm proven wrong and McNabb thrives in this system and takes us to the SB. I'm just not sold on this deal as of yet. I was in "rebuild" mode. Our FO is one player away from the SB still.

You make very valid points. I am not going to argue which is better statistically. I think that is a foolish argument. Stats can be massaged any way you want them to be.

There are two things that I am focusing on with this move. Wins and losses and the belief of the team in their QB.

The win loss records speak for themselves. McNabb is 82-45-1 and 9-7 in the playoffs.

JC is 16-20. I don't care about Zorn this, Saunders that, how many coordinators this blah blah blah. If JC was a "franchise" QB he would overcome all of it. JC is an average to above average QB statistically (win % excluded). There is nothing wrong with that for some teams but that isn't going to work for this team.

Rabach killed JC with his comments about McNabb. He wasn't trying to but his words spoke volumes. The team is ready for a new voice behind center.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

So why did Reid say that McNabb had to agree on the team they wanted to trade with? He said this in his presser Sun. night.

Because not many (read: none) teams would want to trade for him if McNabb refused to sign an extension.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

You are 100% talking about me. The first quote kinda speaks volumes as to how I feel. I'm doing my best to not draw comparisons but right after we let go of the aged players not producing we picked up other aged players. slight concern. The lower cost is the only positive.

The second quote I would disagree with. He only threw the bank at AH last yr. We picked up some cheap possibly prudent FA's although we are not getting younger, then we made our biggest move for McNabb throwing away draft picks.... multiple draft picks. I'd have rather picked up "our" Rookie franchise QB for the future (going with the getting younger theme) or kept JC with slightly lesser stats, put him in this better system and made him battle for whoever should be starter. We would not have thrown away draft picks. Especially since we were short by one and used one on a defensive player last yr in the supp. draft.

If I touched on your views it wasn't directly. Most of the time when I make a statement like that I don't really have someone in mind. If I do have someone in mind I quote them or use the trendy @username.

Originally Posted by 53Fan

I personally don't give a damn what Vinny would have done, he's not here. GTripp basically got called out for saying if you want to judge Shanahan and Allen on this move alone, they were idiots. If I recall correctly, the Eagles at first wanted a 1rst round pick for McNabb. Then after not getting much action, lowered that to a top 42 pick. We gave them #37 and a 3rd or 4th next year. I call that idiotic. Not only did we draft IMO, an over rated 33 year old QB with a very high 2nd this year, we're drafting a 34 year old over rated QB with our 3rd or 4th next year. And one more thing. I would hardly call throwing draft picks at a 33 year old QB prudence and patience.

Obviously our views on McNabb's ability differ. However what I see is a team that just went from having the worst QB in the division to having the best in the division and at the same time taking him away from a division rival.

I see a league were Kurt Warner revived his career at 36 years old and Brett Farve had his best season at 40. QB now more then ever is a mental position where while your physical skills may diminish, your ability to read and dissect defenses will be worth the trade off. And all this for a second round pick. Tell me would you have been happy if we just traded Rocky McIntosh for McNabb? I know we shouldn't give away all of our draft picks and we need to build through the draft but a second rounder for a guy like McNabb is insane if you ask me.