Meet The Candidates: 2012 GOP Thread

[saden1]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Who is being slighted by the media? This guy for one.

Indecision 2012 - Corn Polled Edition - Ron Paul & the Top Tier - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 08/15/11 - Video Clip | Comedy Central


Who would make a good candidate? This guy.

Political Issues that Matter - Ralph Nader's Views on the Issues


I'll get back to you on the NC Gov/Senate.

You mean we should all give impractical people a forum? Maybe most of us have heard enough from these two clowns for the better part of two decades?

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by saden1

You mean we should all give impractical people a forum? Maybe most of us have heard enough from these two clowns for the better part of two decades?

Thank you.

If their message resonated with more than a portion of the public, their would be no obstacle to their election. Just b/c the vast majority see both of them as presenting agendas divorced from reality and lacking in practical solutions to complex issues they identify, doesn't mean they haven't been heard.

And, I'm not sure, but I think saden1 and I just agreed on something in the political forum. Way to bring people together NC_Skins!

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Who would make a good candidate? This guy.

Political Issues that Matter - Ralph Nader's Views on the Issues

Ralph Nader, who's never received over 3% of the vote in a National election, and normally less than 1%. The anti-corporate champion who's a multi-millionaire.....based off contributions to his non-profits and stock portfolio, including over $ 1M in Cisco stock. As a network engineer I'm sure you're aware of Cisco's heavy-handed corporate practices to dominate the market.

Archive | December 4, 2000 | Ralph Nader, Philanthropist: Is the anti-corporate crusader funding his own nonprofit network?

Ralph Nader (3) | Personal Finance Disclosure | OpenSecrets

Business | Nader discloses finances; net worth $3.8 million | Seattle Times Newspaper

And one of Nader's first claims about the Corsair having a defective rear suspension and rolling over were proved false. The Corsair went out of production...but Nader made money on his book.

Corvair Handling and Stability

But the rest of us are blind.

saden...good call, right on point.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Ralph Nader, who's never received over 3% of the vote in a National election, and normally less than 1%. The anti-corporate champion who's a multi-millionaire.....based off contributions to his non-profits and stock portfolio, including over $ 1M in Cisco stock. As a network engineer I'm sure you're aware of Cisco's heavy-handed corporate practices to dominate the market.

Archive | December 4, 2000 | Ralph Nader, Philanthropist: Is the anti-corporate crusader funding his own nonprofit network?

Ralph Nader (3) | Personal Finance Disclosure | OpenSecrets

Business | Nader discloses finances; net worth $3.8 million | Seattle Times Newspaper

And one of Nader's first claims about the Corsair having a defective rear suspension and rolling over were proved false. The Corsair went out of production...but Nader made money on his book.

Corvair Handling and Stability

But the rest of us are blind.

saden...good call, right on point.

I am always weary of people who utter the phrase "if you read my book [...]" when talking about their policy positions. I don't think I have ever seen an interview by Nadar where he doesn't mention his book. He is living the american dream selling his ideas.

[saden1]

Is Rick Perry drunk? I really can't tell if he is or he's just trying to be funny and let lose.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Yeah. For all his failings (and I believe them to be numerous), and despite my philosophical difference with his method of gov., I just don't see anyone being discussed by the Republicans as someone who will garner enough support to beat him.

I see a second trap for non-incumbents created by the "Apathy of the Center" - On one hand the majority of people are moderate (slightly left and right of center and philosophically tied to traditional liberal democracy - little "l", little "d") but are tired of the same old, same old. As a result, they don't want candidates representing the more extreme elements of the Reps or Dems (think Tea Party/OWS; Libertarian/Socialist) but view other centerist candidates as just "Obama in Red". As a result, any candidate from the right differentiating themselves from Obama is faced with the risk of differentiating too much and being seen as representative of the fringe OR not differentiating enough and being seen as just more of the same but in Red.

Obama's approval rating may be low, but I don't see anyone from the Rep. Party stepping out as someone who won't be viewed by the center as "same sh**, just in Red instead of Blue". Ultimately, I see it as an election of "Better the devil you know than the devil you don't".

For better or (more likely) for worse, I see four more years of Mr. Obama.

Truth is we like the devil we know when it comes to our elected officials. An even harder truth is we don't like too much change all at once. So by default, and at the end of the day, we feel more comfortable with the same old, same old. Most voters view candidates as radical or status quo, and we tend to like the latter.

Although Obama's poll numbers are starting to trend upwards over the past 30 days, I think it's immaterial right now considering the GOP has yet to choose their candidate. But what's troubling, if I'm a Republican voter, is that I've yet to hear a compelling reason why I should elect any of these guys to become president. Repealing Obamacare and kill the EPA just doesn't fly with most voters with all the other problems we're facing.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Truth is we like the devil we know when it comes to our elected officials. An even harder truth is we don't like too much change all at once. So by default, and at the end of the day, we feel more comfortable with the same old, same old. Most voters view candidates as radical or status quo, and we tend to like the latter.

Although Obama's poll numbers are starting to trend upwards over the past 30 days, I think it's immaterial right now considering the GOP has yet to choose their candidate. But what's troubling, if I'm a Republican voter, is that I've yet to hear a compelling reason why I should elect any of these guys to become president. Repealing Obamacare and kill the EPA just doesn't fly with most voters with all the other problems we're facing.

As a Republican voter, I would agree with this assessment.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Truth is we like the devil we know when it comes to our elected officials. An even harder truth is we don't like too much change all at once. So by default, and at the end of the day, we feel more comfortable with the same old, same old. Most voters view candidates as radical or status quo, and we tend to like the latter.

Although Obama's poll numbers are starting to trend upwards over the past 30 days, I think it's immaterial right now considering the GOP has yet to choose their candidate. But what's troubling, if I'm a Republican voter, is that I've yet to hear a compelling reason why I should elect any of these guys to become president. Repealing Obamacare and kill the EPA just doesn't fly with most voters with all the other problems we're facing.

While I agree with some of what you said its also less appealing to watch a pres spend 700 billion to creat jobs that never worked then tell us he needs another 500 billion to do what the 700 billion failed to do.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Who is being slighted by the media? This guy for one.

Indecision 2012 - Corn Polled Edition - Ron Paul & the Top Tier - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 08/15/11 - Video Clip | Comedy Central


Who would make a good candidate? This guy.

Political Issues that Matter - Ralph Nader's Views on the Issues


I'll get back to you on the NC Gov/Senate.

Sorry the problem with Nader is the more people see him the more he drops in the poles.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Ralph Nader, who's never received over 3% of the vote in a National election, and normally less than 1%. The anti-corporate champion who's a multi-millionaire.....based off contributions to his non-profits and stock portfolio, including over $ 1M in Cisco stock. As a network engineer I'm sure you're aware of Cisco's heavy-handed corporate practices to dominate the market.

Archive | December 4, 2000 | Ralph Nader, Philanthropist: Is the anti-corporate crusader funding his own nonprofit network?

Ralph Nader (3) | Personal Finance Disclosure | OpenSecrets

Business | Nader discloses finances; net worth $3.8 million | Seattle Times Newspaper

And one of Nader's first claims about the Corsair having a defective rear suspension and rolling over were proved false. The Corsair went out of production...but Nader made money on his book.

Corvair Handling and Stability

But the rest of us are blind.

saden...good call, right on point.

Typical Republican smear tactics. What you have shown me is nothing. Absolutely nothing. So what the guy is net worth at 3.8 million. Did you bother to read those articles? He gets his money from speeches and other works he does. He gives a ton of money away, and doesn't spend much either.

Nader, 66 and single, said he has made $200,000 to $300,000 a year just on speeches for 30 years. Income from writings, television appearances and interest is on top of that. But he said he lives on $25,000.

He last owned a car (a '49 Studebaker) in the late '50s. He went years without a television set but now has a tiny black-and-white; reception is an adventure. He rents an apartment near DuPont Circle and often stays at the family home in Winsted, Conn. He still taps out his books on what he calls a "perilous" Underwood. He keeps meaning to buy a new ribbon.

Nader has plowed millions into his projects, including the establishment of Public Interest Research Groups in 22 states. He has established several research centers devoted to health and safety, taken on the standardized-test industry and championed Native American rights, child protection and solar-energy education.

More recently, he has put about $200,000 into organizing civic-action projects at Princeton University, from which he graduated in 1955, and Harvard Law School, from which he graduated in 1958.

...but lets not look at the issues he supports and lets go for the Republican mantra of...."OOOO LOOK AT THIS IRRELEVANT THING OVER HERE!!"...and find something he failed at and bring it to the forefront. Who gives a shit if he was wrong about some car. In fact, scanning the wikipedia (uggh..I know) of the event, "However, former GM executive John DeLorean asserted in On a Clear Day You Can See General Motors (1979) that Nader's criticisms were valid."

Jesus christ on a cracker. Stop watching Faux news please. It's rotting your brain. You debate exactly like they do. Ignore the issues and go after something irrelevant.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by saden1

I am always weary of people who utter the phrase "if you read my book [...]" when talking about their policy positions. I don't think I have ever seen an interview by Nadar where he doesn't mention his book. He is living the american dream selling his ideas.

You haven't seen many interviews then.

Ralph Nader "The Tea Party Now Is Basically The...

People see what they want to see.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Sorry the problem with Nader is the more people see him the more he drops in the poles.

He's not a pleasant looking guy, but who cares about looks if its not getting you anywhere. So now we care about one's looks than the issues they support.

/facepalm

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

He's not a pleasant looking guy, but who cares about looks if its not getting you anywhere. So now we care about one's looks than the issues they support.

/facepalm

Soory, so you didn't realize that when people see someone they have to also hear what he is saying? I was pointing out the more people hear him speake the more they are turned off by his far left leaning. Like some are too far right he is too far left.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Typical Republican smear tactics. What you have shown me is nothing. Absolutely nothing. So what the guy is net worth at 3.8 million. Did you bother to read those articles? He gets his money from speeches and other works he does. He gives a ton of money away, and doesn't spend much either.

Ah yes, whenever hit with facts that are counter to your position resort to the "Republican smear tactics" line. Maybe you should read the articles.

You don't find the hypocrisy of a guy who is the champion of anti-corporate policies, yet he's become a millionaire giving speeches that are paid for by corporate or special interests and he invests in corporate stock (as of 2000)....in particular Cisco, Wal-mart, Occidental Petroleum, General Dynamics, Bristoll Meyers Squibb.

You find no hypocrisy in a guy who says, In a June 2000 interview with the Washington Post, the stocks he chose were “the most neutral-type companies … No. 1, they’re not monopolists and No. 2, they don’t produce land mines, napalm, weapons.”....yet he's invested in Cisco, one of the worst monolpolists in the tech industry and General Dynamics (through Fidelity Magellan Fund) who certainly builds lots of weapons.

...but lets not look at the issues he supports and lets go for the Republican mantra of...."OOOO LOOK AT THIS IRRELEVANT THING OVER HERE!!"...and find something he failed at and bring it to the forefront. Who gives a shit if he was wrong about some car. In fact, scanning the wikipedia (uggh..I know) of the event, "However, former GM executive John DeLorean asserted in On a Clear Day You Can See General Motors (1979) that Nader's criticisms were valid."

I would say false accusations that led to a model line of car ending production is certainly not irrelevant to GM, or the workers supporting the Corvair. I would also say that making the serious level of accusations leveled at GM.....and then being PROVED wrong by not only the NHTSA, but an independent panel of engineers, irreparably damage Nader's objective credibility.

LOL at referencing DeLorean, certainly he had no ax to grind (or books to sell) with GM.

Jesus christ on a cracker. Stop watching Faux news please. It's rotting your brain. You debate exactly like they do. Ignore the issues and go after something irrelevant.

I'm sorry, I guess multiple, documented, factual, accounts from numerous sources is "Faux News". My brain must be too rotted to get that.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

You haven't seen many interviews then.

Ralph Nader "The Tea Party Now Is Basically The Corporatist Wing Of The Republican Party" - YouTube

People see what they want to see.

You absolutely right, I couldn't get past his incoherent speech.