Marshall Faulk's Top 5 RB's...No Portis?!

[irish]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Not even close? come on. Riggins could never out run anyone himself and where would you rank him?

Riggo was a power back, a bruiser that was used to pound the ball. He was never considered a breakaway threat. Thats why they called him The Diesel. CP is a speed back that can take a pounding. Big difference.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Not even close? come on. Riggins could never out run anyone himself and where would you rank him?

Kind of a bad argument. Riggo could really move especially for a big guy. He was a sprint champ in college too.

But I agree with the basic point. Even if CP is no longer a home run threat he still does many other things really well, and since when is being able to outrun people the main criteria for being a great back?

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Zerohero

It's hard not to like Portis even with all the stupid stuff he pulls, but he isn't even close to the top 5 runningbacks. Whens the last time you have seen him outrun anyone. He's not bad but dont get hurt hes not in top 5 list, maybe it will motivate him.

Kinda hard to say he's not even close considering he was 4th overall in the league in rushing last year.

[SC Skins Fan]

Also from NFL.com. Obviously any of these lists would be subjective.

As more teams split carries, these five backs stand above the rest

[firstdown]

Was CP ever a break away runner? The only time I remember hi breking away was his first run as a skin.

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Was CP ever a break away runner? The only time I remember hi breking away was his first run as a skin.

Lots of people like to talk about his "breakaway" ability from his time in Denver. If we measure that by 40+ runs (which is the easiest way since the NFL keeps that stat) those runs have tracked as follows:

2002 - 3
2003 - 6
2004 - 1
2005 - 2
2006 - 0
2007 - 0
2008 - 0

He also averaged 5.5 yds/carry both years in Denver and has never done better than 4.3 in Washington. That probably says more about the talent and system in D.C. than it does about Portis.

His 20+ runs also declined in Washington, though they spiked again last season.

2002 - 11
2003 - 13
2004 - 5
2005 - 6
2006 - 3
2007 - 3
2008 - 13

Maybe the fact that he was able to break the 20 yard runs last year, but not able to turn any of those into 40+ carries does suggest that he is no longer the same back that he was early in his career.

[Zerohero]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Not even close? come on. Riggins could never out run anyone himself and where would you rank him?

I can't speak about guys i didnt watch play, i'm just going by the great running backs i watched growing up and they outran the defenders on a consistant basis. I was a little strong in saying not even close, but when i watch portis i'm constantly thinking to myself "if that was peterson or williams he wouldnt have gone down.

[Zerohero]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Kinda hard to say he's not even close considering he was 4th overall in the league in rushing last year.

We were statistically the 4th best defense, do you think we had the 4th best defense last year? Yeah saying not even close was harsh, but if you could pick from any team right now who you want to start at running back, would portis be in yalls top 5?

[KingRaloIV]

Marshall Faulk is just rating his favorite runningbacks in the league. It is not to be taken serious. It is just another mans baseless opinion. He doesn't know what he is talking about. This doesn't mean anything to anybody but Marshall. He is just doing his job.

[an23dy]

I think there could be 20 guys you could create some argument for, given some would be a stretch but it's tough to say what makes a good RB and it's definitely tough to judge guys because it's so much based on the o-line. I think AP is able to do so much of what he does in open space because his o-line is very good at run blocking. No doubt he's real good, but put him behind the Lions o-line and he's not putting up the best stats in the NFL.

Adrian Peterson
Michael Turner
DeAngelo Williams
Clinton Portis
Steven Jackson
Brandon Jacobs
Thomas Jones
Chris Johnson
Steve Slaton
Matt Forte
Frank Gore
Willie Parker
Larry Johnson
Ladanian Tomlinson
Brian Westbrook
Marion Barber
Ronnie Brown
Maurice Jones-Drew
Jonathan Stewart
Derrick Ward

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by an23dy

I think there could be 20 guys you could create some argument for, given some would be a stretch but it's tough to say what makes a good RB and it's definitely tough to judge guys because it's so much based on the o-line. I think AP is able to do so much of what he does in open space because his o-line is very good at run blocking. No doubt he's real good, but put him behind the Lions o-line and he's not putting up the best stats in the NFL.

Adrian Peterson
Michael Turner
DeAngelo Williams
Clinton Portis
Steven Jackson
Brandon Jacobs
Thomas Jones
Chris Johnson
Steve Slaton
Matt Forte
Frank Gore
Willie Parker
Larry Johnson
Ladanian Tomlinson
Brian Westbrook
Marion Barber
Ronnie Brown
Maurice Jones-Drew
Jonathan Stewart
Derrick Ward

18th? You have Jones-Drew ranked 18th? Seriously? I think this post belongs on the epic fail thread. This is a guy that has 34 rushing tds, 38 rush/rec tds, and 40 total tds in 3 seasons as a PART TIMER (he's only started 4 games in his career). Portis over that same span has only 28 total tds despite having 794 carries to Jones-Drew's 530. Jones Drew also averages 4.8 yards per carry. In the last 3 years, only Westbrook, Bush, Jackson, Tomlinson and Gore have more receptions that Jones-Drew and only Bush and Jones Drew were not starters.
Now that Jones-Drew is a starter, he is CERTAINLY worthy of a top 10 at the least, I have him top 5.
FYI, sporting news fantasy football mag has Portis ranked 8th, and Jones-Drew ranked 6th. NFL.com fantasy football magazine has Portis ranked 12th and Jones-Drew ranked 4th.

My top 5:
1- Peterson
2- Turner
3- Jones-Drew
4- Jackson*
5- Forte

Jackson is my only hesitation due to his injuries. He started only 11 games last year (although still managed to get 1042 yards and 8 total tds) and 12 games back in 2007 (although had 1002 yards and 7 total tds)
If healthy, his numbers would be pretty darn good...assuming he played a full season both of the last two years, he would have had these numbers:
2008- 1392 yds, 11tds, 51 receptions, 505 rec yds (1897 total yards)
2007- 1344 yds, 9 tds, 53 receptions, 361 rec yds (1705 total yards)
Keep in mind the numbers would be higher if he didn't get injured and miss time in games in both 08 and 07.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Lots of people like to talk about his "breakaway" ability from his time in Denver. If we measure that by 40+ runs (which is the easiest way since the NFL keeps that stat) those runs have tracked as follows:

2002 - 3
2003 - 6
2004 - 1
2005 - 2
2006 - 0
2007 - 0
2008 - 0

He also averaged 5.5 yds/carry both years in Denver and has never done better than 4.3 in Washington. That probably says more about the talent and system in D.C. than it does about Portis.

His 20+ runs also declined in Washington, though they spiked again last season.

2002 - 11
2003 - 13
2004 - 5
2005 - 6
2006 - 3
2007 - 3
2008 - 13

Maybe the fact that he was able to break the 20 yard runs last year, but not able to turn any of those into 40+ carries does suggest that he is no longer the same back that he was early in his career.

I wonder how much of that is due to Denver's zone blocking and cut blocking vs. the Skins (Gibbs) man-to-man blocking. Last yr they used some zone blocking.

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I wonder how much of that is due to Denver's zone blocking and cut blocking vs. the Skins (Gibbs) man-to-man blocking. Last yr they used some zone blocking.

I think a lot (all?) of it has to do with different schemes. That he was able to match his career high (from Denver) in 20+ runs might also support that. But that he was not able to turn any 20+ runs into 40+ runs might also suggest that the years of grinding (and vicious pass pro) has taken some toll. I really don't say any of that as a knock on Portis, I was just trying to answer the "was Portis ever a break away runner" question.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Zerohero

We were statistically the 4th best defense, do you think we had the 4th best defense last year? Yeah saying not even close was harsh, but if you could pick from any team right now who you want to start at running back, would portis be in yalls top 5?

Along with being 4th in rushing yards, he was 4th in total yards (1,705), and 4th in 100 yard games (6). I don't think it's that unrealstic to call him a top 5 back.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I wonder how much of that is due to Denver's zone blocking and cut blocking vs. the Skins (Gibbs) man-to-man blocking. Last yr they used some zone blocking.

This is a good question but to me it is somewhat irrelevant. When you are already 20 yards beyond the line of scrimmage, the blocking scheme from that point on really doesn't matter.

Put differently: CP had several runs last year where he had just one last defender to beat and then CP was takin' it to the house. In these situations it was a one-on-one: could CP make that last guy miss or not? Sadly, the answer again and again was "not," i.e., CP did not make that last man miss. Hence no runs over 40 yards.

My own subjective memory of his first couple of years in Denver was that he did, in fact, make that last man miss. Hence the 40+ yard runs reflected in the numbers posted above.