Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

[soccercycbk]

What if, after problems in player personnel since his return, the Redskins decide that a traditional general manager -- such as Bobby Beathard or Charley Casserly in the old days -- is needed? "I have no problems with any of that. I changed a lot last year," said Gibbs, who in essence fired himself after last season as the Redskins' play-caller and hired Al Saunders as associate head coach, handing over a task for which Gibbs was famous. "I'm not afraid of new ideas."

[mooby]

Getting Scott Pioli would basically be what the Redskins do on the free agent market, which would be go out, and get the best player available in their minds. That, as we all know doesn't work out. I'd rather see the Redskins go after some blue collar guy that does a consistently good job.

[Bill B]

I would think most on the board would agree the moves the FO have made under Gibbs 2 have been made so the Redskins can win now - handing over huge signing bonuses, trading away multiple draft picks, etc. and this is a sign of a team gunning for the super bowl trophy at all costs.

I believe this philiosphy is due to the fact (as Wilbon wrote in his column this week) that the coach is also the GM and therefore is mostly thinking about winning next week and is not worried about the long term future of the franchise with regard to draft picks, salary cap structure, etc.

I am not trying to run Gibbs the coach out of town - the guy is an amazing coach who knows what he is doing in this department and is second to none in my book.
But as far as having him the GM as well - I think this is similar to goverment with no checks and balances. We need these positions to be seperate so the long-term viability of on field success can be sustained.

Does anyone else get tired of the team having to rip apart the roster when all the salaries escalate in the 3rd/4th year and having to rebuild? What about all the dead cap space the team will have to contend with as well as releasing fees? To me this is why the Patriots have been able to field a team that wins over the course of the decade (not just one or two years. Pioli understands that huge bonuses should only be given to a select few and many parts are replaceable if you got a scouting department that can find young, hungry cheap talent in the draft.

Say what you want about the current regime and that things will turn around, but wait till the team has to renegotiate just to get under the cap, cut some other guys and again be the leaders in dead cap space.

Will the team ever learn you sustain long term success by biulding within through the draft and you plug an expensive free agent or two at most?

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

- Passing on Jevon Kearse to sign Marcus Washington AND Cornelius Griffin.

- Trading picks to move up and obtain Cooley (Would he have been available? It's a crap shoot - but given his ability, certainly worth what we traded).

- Sean Taylor over Kellen Winslow.

- No signings last year except Rabach who has been a solid, if not stellar, player.

- Finding Golston in the latter rounds.

While I agree that it seems the misses have far outnumbered the hits, the hits have been pretty solid. Without a team by team analysis, its kinda unfair to say "We suck" in the personnel dept. The "Patriot Model" has been successful b/c they have had solid personnel and good coaching - but what about the other 30 teams? What is their track record (and PLEASE don't cite me the Eagles - When they win a Superbowl, let's talk).

Well, I would disagree on several of your points:

-- It's beginning to look like we might have already squeazed out the best that Cornelius Griffin has to offer. He’s not getting nearly the penetration he used to, and his career appears to be going exactly the way it went in NY; strong early on, but fading fast. Of all the acquisitions though, he’s been the one that the front office got right. Well just have to see how much longer the right decision lasts. Marcus Washington looks good when the defensive line is performing well, but like everyone else this season, he’s practically nowhere to be found.

–- Chris Cooley -- this one’s going to put me in the doghouse here at The Warpath, but I’m not quite ready to start carving his bust for the Hall of Fame the way others apparently are. Was he worth two picks? I don’t think so. He’s a good player, but why is it that this team has to give up two picks for one player, and wind up with marginal overall results?

Sean Taylor over Kellen Winslow? Okaaay. That was a flip of the coin for most teams, and we weren’t really looking for a tight end anyway. If winning on a 50/50 shot represents an astute player personnel move, I guess we should take all the positives we can with this crowd.

–- I wouldn’t call Rabach “stellar” by any stretch. He’s usually the culprit when the flags start flying on holding calls. He’s serviceable, but don’t get your hopes up for any Pro Bowl votes. As far as I can tell, it’s ‘ho-hum’ on Rabach.

–- Golston -– I’d love to think we’ve found a diamond in the rough on a late, 2nd day pick. I think we’ll have to wait and see. He’s gotten a fair amount of playing time this year, but only because of the annual neglect this front office pays to the D-line. But hey, Rock Cartwright was the last late 2nd day pick that panned out – so even broken clocks are right twice a day.

The only measure of good personnel decision making is Super Bowl wins? That’s a bit unfair don’t you think? Four straight NFC Championship games mean nothing in your mind? In Gibbs' first go round, he won 3 Super Bowls in 12 years – but you also have to count the other seasons where his teams were consistently competitive, and bound for the playoffs at the very least. I’d say the Chargers have done a pretty darn good job “building through the draft”. It took a while for the Bengals, and they might have taken a step back this season, but at least they’re in the right direction. It pains me to include the Cowboys, but that defensive front seven will be a nightmare to deal with for years to come, and they’re getting the job done with young players, farmed from the college ranks, with very manageable contracts. Julius Jones and Marion Barber come to mind.

The thing is, all you have to do is point to the score board with the Skins. In the three years Gibbs has been calling the shots, he’s 20-24. And the needle is pointed south. How many 8-8 seasons or worse will it take to prove that high priced free agents looking for their golden parachutes aren’t translating into success?

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by backrow

MB saved HOF Coach Gibbs life the night they first met. HOF Saved!

CP - In excess of 1500 yards each of his first two seasons, with a PO win last year.

BL aka. Jr., give me a break, it's LDS's money! His team!

ARE - See BL above.

Rocky - He's a rook! Give the FO and GW a break. GW spots the rooks.
(Exception: Goldston, due to injuries)

AA was displaced by a rook on his last team. I knew it when the FO signed him in error. NO GM running the B&G ranch, however, and again, it's LDS's money. OK, a mistake on this one, but I knew it then in FA. Now we all know it.

D needs to be healthy all year. Problem solved. With Goldston, Montgomery, Rogers, and ST, we have youth. Health is needed, not gutting.

How do you "overestimate" a three time SB Champion, HOF Coach?

Portis' 1500 yards got us what, exactly?

And nobody questions that it's LDS's money, or that it's his team. But that money does count against the cap. Could that have something to do with why there's no one we can turn to in the secondary but Mike Rumph and Ade Jimoh? Or why someone named Todd Wade might play in place of Jon Jansen this weekend? Meanwhile, Randle El, David Patten, and James Thrash will be keeping the seats warm when the offense is in 2 wideout formations (which is usually the case, except when it's time for a 5-yard loss on a double reverse?)

Sure it's his money. But can we at least demand that he be more smart about spending it?

[SmootSmack]

Doesn't look like Pioli will be available anyway

LancasterOnline.com: Key Patriots Exec Signs Contract Extension

[bigSkinsfan61]

the reason for joe gibbs superbowl teams was not only joe's expertise in coaching but bobby beathards expertise in player talent evaluation . not taking anything away from joe at all he had a gm in the 80's bobby beatherd was the man then charley casserly followed and made some good moves but over all he was waaaayyyy lesss that bobby was...

[budw38]

Originally Posted by mooby

Getting Scott Pioli would basically be what the Redskins do on the free agent market, which would be go out, and get the best player available in their minds. That, as we all know doesn't work out. I'd rather see the Redskins go after some blue collar guy that does a consistently good job.

Good point . But ,, the problem is GM Gibbs likes the " Flashy " guys too much . He did mention after he retired that he would make a move for Deion like the Saints did for R. Williams . I really like Gibbs , but he is too willing to trade the ranch for one guy , and unless that guy really is a franchise player you get burned . We traded two 1st rd picks for Riggs < way too steep > and threw away two 1st rounders for Desmond . I agree with the BLUE COLLAR players and I think a GM would work well with coach .

[dmek25]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

Doesn't look like Pioli will be available anyway

LancasterOnline.com: Key Patriots Exec Signs Contract Extension

tafkas, i love you quoting my local newspaper

[Bill B]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

Doesn't look like Pioli will be available anyway

LancasterOnline.com: Key Patriots Exec Signs Contract Extension

It be interesting to see when that extension expires since the article was in July 2005. I would love to see him here but one thing to also consider is not only would a new GM have to work with Gibbs, but he would also have to be able to work with Synder - no easy task considering the patience (or lack of) that Synder shows with most of his employees.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Portis' 1500 yards got us what, exactly?

The playoffs.

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by Bill B

I have not been able to find any information on the net other than Pioli's contract was set to expire after the 2006 draft.

Does anyone know if he signed a long term extension with the Patriots?

If not is there any way the Redskins can get him?

Joe Gibbs has mentioned in one of his latest interviews that he would be open and supseptible to any idea or change that would help the Redskins win Football games. I believe him. However, I also believe that any discussion regarding a GM would have to come at the behest of someone else in the organization with authority comparable to that of Gibbs. I say that because he has also, on more than one ocasion maintained he is satisfied with the current structure, and if that be the case, he obviously sees no need to change from the status quo.
While I do not feel in all cases a GM is neccessary, most NFL FO's have a head personel manager, and based on some of the recent decisions being made by the decision makers of the Redskins, lend credence to the fact a GM is something that should be given more than a glance at consideration.
Joe Gibbs is a Football coach, this is his area of expertize, and where his success was derived. He gained that measure of success because he had one of the best personel men in football at that time, gathering the players for him to coach. Our situation at present has too many different people making the decisions, or at least having input, the Adam Archuleta deal is a prime example, that was a GW decision, not Gibbs or Snyder. The both of them obviously signed off on the deal, but was the player in particular, their choice?
I have always felt that attempting to be a head coach, and GM simultaneously is far too much responsibility for one man . A coach primarily is only looking to win his next football game. Having a GM means having someone with a long range plan, and enough creative insight to know how he want's to build a team, and what the finished product will look like. Our current structure is obsessed with that win now at all cost attitude and that mentality hampers the growth,as well as the future of a team built to compete for a sustained period of time. If Joe Gibbs is serious about the possible implementation of a GM, he need only to convince Dan Snyder, and I'm convinced it could happen. I have the utmost respect for Joe Gibbs, and I think he should take a stand, and stick to it, either he'll be the head coach or GM, not both.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

The playoffs.

Oh, please. It was bad opponents at just the right time, a punt return for a touchdown by a player the team didn't even want and the defense that got us to the playoffs.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Oh, please. It was bad opponents at just the right time, a punt return for a touchdown by a player the team didn't even want and the defense that got us to the playoffs.

Right... I guess his 5 straight 100+ yard games and 6 TDs down the stretch had nothing to do with the playoff run.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Right... I guess his 5 straight 100+ yard games and 6 TDs down the stretch had nothing to do with the playoff run.

We went to the playoffs in 2004? I must have missed that.