Campbell's numbers dont lie

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I don't know of any fantasy football league on the planet that uses completion percentage or quarterback rating to score it's players. Have we not played fantasy football?

If you can make an airtight statistical argument that Campbell is not getting it done when it matters (without using the 'it' cliche, because frankly, no one cares), I'll hat tip you and move on. Otherwise, you're just being a blowhard for everyone elses QB, who have not been as good as Jason Campbell this year.

Have you been watched them play? Sanchez is the real deal. Cutler is the real deal. Campbell got the vast majority of his yards in and both of his TDs when opposing defenses were holding on to a lead and playing prevent. Rodney Harrison called Campbell out for what he is - a backup QB who no one is afraid of. He's certainly the best QB on our roster now, but come 2010, he won't be a starter for this team or any other in the NFL.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Have you been watched them play? Sanchez is the real deal. Cutler is the real deal. Campbell got the vast majority of his yards in and both of his TDs when opposing defenses were holding on to a lead and playing prevent. Rodney Harrison called Campbell out for what he is - a backup QB who no one is afraid of. He's certainly the best QB on our roster now, but come 2010, he won't be a starter for this team or any other in the NFL.

Rodney Harrison is an expert now? I think your bullshit meter is broken.

I've watched Cutler play for a long time and he impresses me no more or less than Campbell has. And now he's going through a system transition for the first time in his career, and the results haven't been very good. Sanchez has amazing attention to detail in his work and a lot of really smart people think he's going to be really special, but I happen to not be one of those people. Plus right now, it's not even close. You'd take Campbell's production over Sanchez' produciton 100 out of 100 times.

Sanchez might end up having the better career, but as Paintrain pointed out, who cares? We were never in position to draft him, no matter how serious we were about liking him. Blame Zorn for beating up on Dallas and Philly last year -- if you must.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Have you been watched them play? Sanchez is the real deal. Cutler is the real deal. Campbell got the vast majority of his yards in and both of his TDs when opposing defenses were holding on to a lead and playing prevent. Rodney Harrison called Campbell out for what he is - a backup QB who no one is afraid of. He's certainly the best QB on our roster now, but come 2010, he won't be a starter for this team or any other in the NFL.

Yeah, Cutler looked like the real deal when he threw pass after pass to Green Bay defenders. Some of those passes were the fault of his receivers but some of them were Cutler's fault.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Bottomline to everything is - this team is Campbell's team (coming from his own words). Who do you hold accountable for the redskins performances given that Campbell has said he was taking responsibility for the redskins?

Let me know if I was reading into it more than I necessarily need to. When someone says something as strongly as this - to take responsibility for something as big as this, then I sit up and take notice - and I hold him to it.

The redskins are his team, but he is not held accountable. I just don't get it.

The only people who do actually get held accountable (i.e. are in danger of losing their job NOW) are those who have decent backups behind them (Horton/Doughty). Campbell is by far the best QB on the team right now. His play has done nothing to merit benching him, even if we had a viable backup behind him. The end of the season, thats another matter. If his play doesn't improve, he'll be held accountable then, when he's sent packing. At this point, it sure seems likely that we're headed for an uncapped year, and i would not be shocked at all to see A LOT of "untouchables" sent packing with him.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Yeah, Cutler looked like the real deal when he threw pass after pass to Green Bay defenders. Some of those passes were the fault of his receivers but some of them were Cutler's fault.

Campbell threw atleast 2, and probably 3 balls that absolutely should have been intercepted against the Lions. If we werent playing the 2nd-worst team in football, Campbell would be looking alot worse right now.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by MonkFan4Life

I'm making a point. So basically you're satisfied with him playing one way for 3 1/2 quarters and then a completely different way in the last 1/2. Really ? You are right that the West Coast offense is a lot of intermediate throws by why is it that Philly's West Coast has so many deep routes ? Why is it that there are always receiviers for this offense that run deep routes but the ball is never thrown to them ? Why is it that so many of the fade routes end up out of bounds ? Is that the receiviers are running the wrong route or that the ball is thrown to the wrong area ? I didn't say that Campbell was too dumb to call audibles but the fact that he doesn't. But why should I look for him to call an audible when he doesn't even want to call his own protections ? He does call an audible here or there. But why is it that teams will consistently keep and 8th or 9th man in the box ? The QB doesn't force them to stay back. That's why. I said that Campbell throws to an area and not to a spot which was a problem and you used Delhomme as an example to agree with me ? Come on now, don't twist up my words.

Be as sarcastic as you want but that's all you have is to try and drop a zinger. You know for yourself that in this league you don't have 6 years to become a good QB. I guess he deserves it because he's a good guy ? I don't know what it is that you have seen that gives you all this confidence in this guy. You're right that it is getting old, that's why I feel like he needs to go. You think he should stay I don't. But I'll ask you to do this, make a bet with one of your friends that Jason Campbell will throw 20 touchdowns by the time that the season is over. Your 50 to their 100 and see how you feel then. See if you are as faithful in him as you are now.

You want to make this bet with me? I could really use the 100 bucks.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

The only people who do actually get held accountable (i.e. are in danger of losing their job NOW) are those who have decent backups behind them (Horton/Doughty). Campbell is by far the best QB on the team right now. His play has done nothing to merit benching him, even if we had a viable backup behind him. The end of the season, thats another matter. If his play doesn't improve, he'll be held accountable then, when he's sent packing. At this point, it sure seems likely that we're headed for an uncapped year, and i would not be shocked at all to see A LOT of "untouchables" sent packing with him.

I still don't understand why you keep bringing up Cutler and Sanchez. We were closer to getting Cutler than Sanchez, but it's pretty obvious we would have been worse off for it, which is what we were all saying at the time.

No, Campbell can't get benched this season, and yes I'd probably trade him in to get rid of Blache as well at the end of the year. I feel like our team is fundamentally flawed, and the difference of opinion here is that some people feel that you have to replace the quarterback to get a better team, but it seems clear to me that when you have a team like the Redskins, it doesn't really matter who is at QB.

Campbell is keeping us in a lot of games, but I'm thinking that's only giving the illusion that we are closer than we actually are. Without him, we'd be getting blown out every week and then maybe it would be clear that the rest of the team is a major problem that can't be ignored.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Rodney Harrison is an expert now? I think your bullshit meter is broken.

I've watched Cutler play for a long time and he impresses me no more or less than Campbell has. And now he's going through a system transition for the first time in his career, and the results haven't been very good. Sanchez has amazing attention to detail in his work and a lot of really smart people think he's going to be really special, but I happen to not be one of those people. Plus right now, it's not even close. You'd take Campbell's production over Sanchez' produciton 100 out of 100 times.

Sanchez might end up having the better career, but as Paintrain pointed out, who cares? We were never in position to draft him, no matter how serious we were about liking him. Blame Zorn for beating up on Dallas and Philly last year -- if you must.

I'll take a recent elite defensive player with a superbowl rings opinion over most others any day of the week.

I don't see how you can actually watch Cutler and Campbell play and think theyre equal. Theyre most certainly not. And Josh McDaniels, a guy who coached the best QB in the league, a guy who knows more about QBs than anyone here wanted Kyle Orton over Jason Campbell. If that's not damning for Campbell, then I dont know what is.

As to Sanchez, the Jets have far less talent on Offense than we do. That, combined with the fact that he's a rookie, makes his performance that more impressive. I'm impressed when i watch him and I respect Trent Diflers opinion on QBs and he's very high on Sanchez. In 5 years, or whenever Manning and Brady retire, Sanchez will be one of the top 3 QBs in the league. No, we were not in a position to draft him, but we should have tried harder to put ourselves in a position to be. Now we're gonna be stuck drafting one of the overrated QBs in the 2010 draft. On the bright side, atleast whoever we hire to replace Zorn will get to pick his own QB.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

The only people who do actually get held accountable (i.e. are in danger of losing their job NOW) are those who have decent backups behind them (Horton/Doughty). Campbell is by far the best QB on the team right now. His play has done nothing to merit benching him, even if we had a viable backup behind him. The end of the season, thats another matter. If his play doesn't improve, he'll be held accountable then, when he's sent packing. At this point, it sure seems likely that we're headed for an uncapped year, and i would not be shocked at all to see A LOT of "untouchables" sent packing with him.

Not really talking about benching him. And it goes beyond just X's and O's. I would have really liked him to step up and become the leader he said he was and just take some blame and responsibility for some things. God knows that's what the redskins need right now. Blache has started it. And Zorn to a lesser extent and to a reaction of what Blache has said. But now the players really need to man up - especially Campbell.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I'll take a recent elite defensive player with a superbowl rings opinion over most others any day of the week.

I don't see how you can actually watch Cutler and Campbell play and think theyre equal. Theyre most certainly not. And Josh McDaniels, a guy who coached the best QB in the league, a guy who knows more about QBs than anyone here wanted Kyle Orton over Jason Campbell. If that's not damning for Campbell, then I dont know what is.

As to Sanchez, the Jets have far less talent on Offense than we do. That, combined with the fact that he's a rookie, makes his performance that more impressive. I'm impressed when i watch him and I respect Trent Diflers opinion on QBs and he's very high on Sanchez. In 5 years, or whenever Manning and Brady retire, Sanchez will be one of the top 3 QBs in the league. No, we were not in a position to draft him, but we should have tried harder to put ourselves in a position to be. Now we're gonna be stuck drafting one of the overrated QBs in the 2010 draft.

Even if that player talks bullshit every time he opens his mouth? Or, wait, let me guess, you didn't pay attention to Rodney Harrison before you heard he said this.

Fine, they're not equal. Campbell is a lot better this year. Or so the statistics say. Ridiculousness of the Kyle Orton fiasco aside, the guy (Orton) is badly outproducing Cutler this year. And well, since he's only completing 57% of his passes, no, that probably won't last.

It's not true to say that Sanchez doesn't have as much talent on offense as we do. Sanchez is playing behind the best, or second best OL in the AFC. That's a huge advanage over our line which lost our most veteran interior lineman a week ago. They have the best center in the league, we have one of the worst. In fact, the only position we are actually better at is LT.

The receivers are pretty comprable (Cotchery > Moss, Kelly > Stuckey, ARE > Clowney, Cooley > Keller, and all those matchups are pretty close), but don't you look longingly at that running game and wish you could get a piece of it?

Sanchez is working with more than either Cutler or Campbell, and now that Cutler has no OL, he's got a career high sack rate and 5 INT in 3 games. In many ways his early development was a complete product of the offensive environment in Denver, and he might be 3 years away from being a pro bowl QB for the Bears. I wonder if they will have the patience to wait him out :yeahright.

Your ability to selectively defer to the knowledge of only those who agree with you never ceases to amaze.

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

The receivers are pretty comprable (Cotchery > Moss, Kelly > Stuckey, ARE > Clowney, Cooley > Keller, and all those matchups are pretty close), but don't you look longingly at that running game and wish you could get a piece of it?

Not to mention they have Leon Washington and Thomas Jones. Also a rookie with promise in S Greene.

[MonkFan4Life]

For you guys that feel like Jason is the real deal should his contract be extended today ?

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by MonkFan4Life

For you guys that feel like Jason is the real deal should his contract be extended today ?

Yes.

[MonkFan4Life]

Please explain GTripp.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by MonkFan4Life

For you guys that feel like Jason is the real deal should his contract be extended today ?

No. Wait 'til the bye week, then make a better decision.