The Santana Moss Catch

johnjaywilliams · 09-06-2008, 10:35 AM

yo man hucapn i agree moss lost his heart and the fact that he is small doesn't help. him and JC have never really being on the same page. JC already got a long wind up and Santana don't have faith in JC to put the ball where it need to be. JC is big QB he needs big WR that why every year since his bein our startin QB, Cooley and Randell el have being gettin the ball . I say trade Santana for a draft pick and let The rookie D.Thomas start cuz be honest the way how we started this season, i know its only one game, but it look like its goin to be a long one. Santana is still a very good WR but him and JC are just not workin out..

celts32 · 09-06-2008, 10:45 AM

Santana isn't worth much in trade. WR's as good as him are a dime a dozen. He's a good player but he's not worth a high pick.

SBXVII · 09-06-2008, 11:05 AM

The Skins have always been screwed when it comes to their WR's since Gibbs came back. Most teams have a tall WR as their #1 but the Skins have a small WR as their #1. That puts him up against the #1 CB who is usually faster and taller and able to bat the ball away if he can keep up. Moss should really be a #2 or #3 WR. He can still do the go routes when needed.

Our problem is our rookies are not ready yet. Zorn should be giving Thomas a hand full of plays to learn for the first few games and tell him to master them. Make one or two a go route to complement Moss on his go routes....one will be open. Randel El with his more bulky frame should be handling the over the middle routes slants and curls. They could use Cooley with the crossing patterns with Randel El.

I could not figure out why we went with Heyer instead of Jansen until I think game day when they said we would be using more zone blocking instead of man to man blocking. Apparently Jansen was not getting the zone blocking down correctly or his foot was an issue with his being able to get out of his stance fast enough for the speed rush.

I know I'm being a internet coach and it's something we already know but just felt it needed to be repeated. I think when Thomas starts becoming effective(however soon that will be) and Kelly starts playing we will continue to have the same issues.

celts32 · 09-06-2008, 11:45 AM

I don't think anyone around the league would consider Moss a #1 NFL WR. He is our best WR but that doesn't make him a true #1. There are probably only like 10-15 true #1 WR's in the league. A #1 WR is consistent and can draw a double team every week. The hope I think was that one of the rookies could develop into a #1 and make Moss the #2 where he could excel. Oh well...it's not Moss's fault he's not a #1 it's the skins fault for making him one.

JLW428 · 09-06-2008, 03:00 PM

Why is the first letter of every word a capital except the ones that are supposed to be? Just messing around.

Giantone · 09-06-2008, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duffman003

wasn't he still trying to gain control of the ball while the defensive back was celebrating?

Mute point,the ref blew the whistle,the play is dead,not reviewable.

Paintrain · 09-06-2008, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBXVII

The Skins have always been screwed when it comes to their WR's since Gibbs came back. Most teams have a tall WR as their #1 but the Skins have a small WR as their #1. That puts him up against the #1 CB who is usually faster and taller and able to bat the ball away if he can keep up. Moss should really be a #2 or #3 WR. He can still do the go routes when needed.

Our problem is our rookies are not ready yet. Zorn should be giving Thomas a hand full of plays to learn for the first few games and tell him to master them. Make one or two a go route to complement Moss on his go routes....one will be open. Randel El with his more bulky frame should be handling the over the middle routes slants and curls. They could use Cooley with the crossing patterns with Randel El.

I could not figure out why we went with Heyer instead of Jansen until I think game day when they said we would be using more zone blocking instead of man to man blocking. Apparently Jansen was not getting the zone blocking down correctly or his foot was an issue with his being able to get out of his stance fast enough for the speed rush.

I know I'm being a internet coach and it's something we already know but just felt it needed to be repeated. I think when Thomas starts becoming effective(however soon that will be) and Kelly starts playing we will continue to have the same issues.

Hence the 2008 Redskins draft. This wasn't a draft for opening day (as is lost on some people). Thomas projects to be a #1, Kelly is a prototypical #2 possession receiver, Moss and ARE would be deadly in the slot. As we get into October-November and these guys develop a little let's see what happens but for now we've got to deal with what we have.

rypper11 · 09-06-2008, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantone

Mute point,the ref blew the whistle,the play is dead,not reviewable.

Absolutely right. The catch was made after contact and Moss should have been able to run. The official was wrong, but it isn't reviewable and if one play (any play) is the reason between winning and losing than you didn't do enough the rest of the game to win. I would argue that slapping a player while standing next to the ref deserves an unnecessary roughness penalty and throwing a CB to the ground should be offensive PI too. The other side is that a Giant (don't remember who) was called for a facemask on Portis that didn't exist. Refs aren't perfect so you can't leave the game in their hands.

rypper11 · 09-06-2008, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Hence the 2008 Redskins draft. This wasn't a draft for opening day (as is lost on some people). Thomas projects to be a #1, Kelly is a prototypical #2 possession receiver, Moss and ARE would be deadly in the slot. As we get into October-November and these guys develop a little let's see what happens but for now we've got to deal with what we have.

I agree with you but think your timeline is still too aggressive. More reasonable would be to think that Thomas and Kelly will need offseason, OTA's and an injury-free training camp after watching this year and getting some spot duty.

onlydarksets · 09-06-2008, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantone

Mute point,the ref blew the whistle,the play is dead,not reviewable.

Not "mute" - it's "moo", like a cow's opinion, it doesn't matter.

Still, your point (as elaborated on by rypper11), is correct.

hucapn · 09-07-2008, 03:44 AM

Really, I only bring up the size issue to add to a concern about the lack of physical size in Santana Moss. I don't question his desire to win the game (even though that Seattle game made me want to trade him right then). It's just that his skill set is so one-dimensional. He's basically Devin Hester with an offensive mindset. So if we don't have other pieces, a la the possesion reciever who can get to the sticks and secure a hitch ( ah hem #12, his name will not be mentioned until he steps foot on to the field) or a true number one guy, Moss and his lack of chemistry makes his amazing speed and agility a hinderance to our team as far as throwing vertical.
All that to the side, Zorn just needs to run his offense. Too many times we lined up in two wide sets and ran the ball. If Zorn is going to lead this team anywhere, we need to hop out there and FULLY RUN THE WEST COAST OFFENSE! I went to a lot of sessions in Ashburn. I want to see those packages where they throw screens to Fred Davis when hes split wide left, ON FIRST DOWN. The West coast works by catching the defense off guard. Running the ball will never catch the Redskins opponents off guard because WE HAVE BEEN RUNNING THE DAMN BALL SINCE SPURRIER.(sorry to the fans like myself who blocked out the painful memory of that era. Trung Candidate, Shuler, ..tear) Zorn needs to make Jason Campbell throw that shit 30-40 times a game, good or bad. He needs to throw those interceptions and learn like everyone else. When coachs have faith in their quarterbacks they call throws when they need first downs in key situations. Quaterbacks know that too. It's third and anything inside of five Portis is getting the ball. NOT TO DOWN PORTIS.(he plays hard as hell, a little crazy with the costumes but did you see that block? JACKED UP!!!) His talents will be best suited running draws, screens, and counters out of a three or four receiver set. CAN FRED DAVIS GET ON THE FIELD? CAN WE THROW THE M@#$%F%$#@@ING BALL TO CHRIS COOLEY)
I guess I'm just disappointed, but we are mismanaging talents from the top down as an organization right now. I think Snyder just needs to pay a guy to make the decisions for him. Parcells would have been a good fit, as blasphemous as that is to say being a former coach of the two most dispicable teams in the NFL, besides Philadelphia who is equally dispicable. Let's just play football. On some levels its complicated, but on Sunday it's about our team wanting to win more than the other squad. The Giants are better and they were ready to execute their gameplan. Burress looked worth everything they paid him and he knew it. Brandon Jacobs DEMOLISHED our best defender. Eli went about his business with that stupid ass look like he always does. (His face looks like its stuck on the word "darn") Zorn was trying to get first downs with the starting offense. The "D" stood up but not really. We have problems to fix as a squad. They need to knight London Fletcher or something. GET MOTIVATED SKINS!! The city needs it!!

09-06-2008, 10:35 AM	#16
johnjaywilliams Camp Scrub Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 28	Re: The Santana Moss Catch yo man hucapn i agree moss lost his heart and the fact that he is small doesn't help. him and JC have never really being on the same page. JC already got a long wind up and Santana don't have faith in JC to put the ball where it need to be. JC is big QB he needs big WR that why every year since his bein our startin QB, Cooley and Randell el have being gettin the ball . I say trade Santana for a draft pick and let The rookie D.Thomas start cuz be honest the way how we started this season, i know its only one game, but it look like its goin to be a long one. Santana is still a very good WR but him and JC are just not workin out..

09-06-2008, 10:45 AM	#17
celts32 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Hackettstown NJ Age: 53 Posts: 2,665	Re: The Santana Moss Catch Santana isn't worth much in trade. WR's as good as him are a dime a dozen. He's a good player but he's not worth a high pick. __________________ Section 116 Row 19 “Goal line, goal line. I-left, tight wing, 70 chip on white.” www.facebook.com/HackettstownBeerClub

09-06-2008, 11:05 AM	#18
SBXVII Franchise Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 7,766	Re: The Santana Moss Catch The Skins have always been screwed when it comes to their WR's since Gibbs came back. Most teams have a tall WR as their #1 but the Skins have a small WR as their #1. That puts him up against the #1 CB who is usually faster and taller and able to bat the ball away if he can keep up. Moss should really be a #2 or #3 WR. He can still do the go routes when needed. Our problem is our rookies are not ready yet. Zorn should be giving Thomas a hand full of plays to learn for the first few games and tell him to master them. Make one or two a go route to complement Moss on his go routes....one will be open. Randel El with his more bulky frame should be handling the over the middle routes slants and curls. They could use Cooley with the crossing patterns with Randel El. I could not figure out why we went with Heyer instead of Jansen until I think game day when they said we would be using more zone blocking instead of man to man blocking. Apparently Jansen was not getting the zone blocking down correctly or his foot was an issue with his being able to get out of his stance fast enough for the speed rush. I know I'm being a internet coach and it's something we already know but just felt it needed to be repeated. I think when Thomas starts becoming effective(however soon that will be) and Kelly starts playing we will continue to have the same issues.

09-06-2008, 11:45 AM	#19
celts32 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Hackettstown NJ Age: 53 Posts: 2,665	Re: The Santana Moss Catch I don't think anyone around the league would consider Moss a #1 NFL WR. He is our best WR but that doesn't make him a true #1. There are probably only like 10-15 true #1 WR's in the league. A #1 WR is consistent and can draw a double team every week. The hope I think was that one of the rookies could develop into a #1 and make Moss the #2 where he could excel. Oh well...it's not Moss's fault he's not a #1 it's the skins fault for making him one. __________________ Section 116 Row 19 “Goal line, goal line. I-left, tight wing, 70 chip on white.” www.facebook.com/HackettstownBeerClub

09-06-2008, 03:00 PM	#20
JLW428 Special Teams Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Rockville, MD Posts: 422	Re: The Santana Moss Catch Why is the first letter of every word a capital except the ones that are supposed to be? Just messing around.

09-07-2008, 03:44 AM	#26
hucapn Camp Scrub Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 24	Re: The Santana Moss Catch Really, I only bring up the size issue to add to a concern about the lack of physical size in Santana Moss. I don't question his desire to win the game (even though that Seattle game made me want to trade him right then). It's just that his skill set is so one-dimensional. He's basically Devin Hester with an offensive mindset. So if we don't have other pieces, a la the possesion reciever who can get to the sticks and secure a hitch ( ah hem #12, his name will not be mentioned until he steps foot on to the field) or a true number one guy, Moss and his lack of chemistry makes his amazing speed and agility a hinderance to our team as far as throwing vertical. All that to the side, Zorn just needs to run his offense. Too many times we lined up in two wide sets and ran the ball. If Zorn is going to lead this team anywhere, we need to hop out there and FULLY RUN THE WEST COAST OFFENSE! I went to a lot of sessions in Ashburn. I want to see those packages where they throw screens to Fred Davis when hes split wide left, ON FIRST DOWN. The West coast works by catching the defense off guard. Running the ball will never catch the Redskins opponents off guard because WE HAVE BEEN RUNNING THE DAMN BALL SINCE SPURRIER.(sorry to the fans like myself who blocked out the painful memory of that era. Trung Candidate, Shuler, ..tear) Zorn needs to make Jason Campbell throw that shit 30-40 times a game, good or bad. He needs to throw those interceptions and learn like everyone else. When coachs have faith in their quarterbacks they call throws when they need first downs in key situations. Quaterbacks know that too. It's third and anything inside of five Portis is getting the ball. NOT TO DOWN PORTIS.(he plays hard as hell, a little crazy with the costumes but did you see that block? JACKED UP!!!) His talents will be best suited running draws, screens, and counters out of a three or four receiver set. CAN FRED DAVIS GET ON THE FIELD? CAN WE THROW THE M@#$%F%$#@@ING BALL TO CHRIS COOLEY) I guess I'm just disappointed, but we are mismanaging talents from the top down as an organization right now. I think Snyder just needs to pay a guy to make the decisions for him. Parcells would have been a good fit, as blasphemous as that is to say being a former coach of the two most dispicable teams in the NFL, besides Philadelphia who is equally dispicable. Let's just play football. On some levels its complicated, but on Sunday it's about our team wanting to win more than the other squad. The Giants are better and they were ready to execute their gameplan. Burress looked worth everything they paid him and he knew it. Brandon Jacobs DEMOLISHED our best defender. Eli went about his business with that stupid ass look like he always does. (His face looks like its stuck on the word "darn") Zorn was trying to get first downs with the starting offense. The "D" stood up but not really. We have problems to fix as a squad. They need to knight London Fletcher or something. GET MOTIVATED SKINS!! The city needs it!!

The Santana Moss Catch

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