Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans?

MTK · 12-03-2007, 01:25 PM

The Bengals would probably be willing to part with Chad Johnson for the right price.

Just saying.

sportscurmudgeon · 12-03-2007, 01:32 PM

I happen to think that WR is one of the biggest weaknesses on the 2007 version of the Washington Redskins. Allow me to explain:

Brandon Lloyd is worthless. If the Redskins cut him the day after the season is over, he'll be sitting by his telephone waiting for it to ring for at least 6 weeks - - and even then it won't be an NFL GM calling, it will probably be a telemarketing call.

Antwaan Randle-El is a punt/kick returner and a #3 reciever. That's it; that's all. As soon as he got hurt and McCardell and Caldwell got more playing time, the passing game got more efficient. Yes, ARE gives the Skins the ability to run a gadget play once or twice a month but his meager productivity on the field in normal play situations doesn't make that worth it. By the way,on those gadget plays this year, ARE has 19 yards passing and a net of minus-3 yards rushing. Glad the team has that potential in its arsenal...

Santana Moss is fun to watch - - if you like 8-10 yard catches and his herky-jerky first down signal. The problem is that even though WRs are ranked on the basis of number of catches, that's not what makes the really good ones really good. There's this thing called "scoring touchdowns". At the moment, Moss has been in the end zone ONCE this year. Since he's been here he's played in 40 games and has 16 TDs. That's about 6.4 TDs per year. And that's not good enough for the "lead receiver" on a team that wants to be a "contender" for something other than taking a Caribbean cruise during the month of January. And don't anyone rhapsodize about how Moss caught those two bombs from Brunell a couple of years ago to beat Dallas. That's ancient history and there have been boatloads of games since then where the Skins could have used a big catch by a big time WR to win a game. He hasn't provided it...

James Thrash is the team's most versatile receiver and the most rounded player of the lot. He actually blocks people on every running play and usually the block is an effective one. There is no way you can say that about Moss or Lloyd or ARE. But Thrash is a #3 receiver at best. When he was in Philly and tried to assume the role of lead receiver he was a bust. He tries hard on every play, but his skills are limited. Nonetheless, of all the WRs on this team, he leads the team in TDs this year with TWO. And this is December ... Scary...

McCardell and Caldwell are better all around receivers than anything else on the roster at the moment unless you want to fantasize about the untapped and about-to-explode potential contained in Anthony Mix, Stephen Harris, Jimmy Farris, Mike Espy and Burl Toler.

The Redskins should definitely keep McCardell and Caldwell next year AND look for more talent at this position.

freddyg12 · 12-03-2007, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCSkin

What about Randy Moss? I'm putting him out there and I'm sure many will question picking him up. But the fact is he is having an outstanding season and compared to anyone we could possible get--he is a bonafide superstar Pro Bowl #1. Thoughts?

I thought about this too. It would be no surprise if Moss & his agent look to get him $20 mil guaranteed. I think if the Pats win the super bowl, they will be less likely to pay him big $.

I would hate to see the Danny reverting to his old tricks overpaying for an aging star. If he could be had for a reasonable amount that'd be cool, but I think the price will be too high.

Wouldn't be surprised if Minn. made a pitch for him to come back.

Beemnseven · 12-03-2007, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Bernard Berrian, Patrick Crayton, Bryant Johnson, maybe Matt Jones. Those are the first names that come to mind

Those guys all sound like more #2 and #3 receivers to me. We already have plenty of those.

Among many other things, this team needs a knockout punch at wideout -- a true star, a playmaker you can always count on in the clutch. Even Santana Moss doesn't fit that label.

memphisskin · 12-03-2007, 01:36 PM

I have argued with people for hours about our receiving corps, but the proof is in the pudding. Cooley without question is a beast. The rest, I love 'em all since they are Skins but there's a reason we were trying to get Calvin Johnson in the draft last year. We add a big strong wideout like him and I think our offense takes off. Part of the reason I think Cooley leads us in catches is because he's the tallest target we have.

Our receiving corps is serviceable, but they don't excel because for some reason we just can't get them in space.

That said, I love McCardell, but if our 2008 plans include depending on McCardell then we're already sunk. He's crafty, but the fact that he came in and played right away is an indictment on our receiving corps.

SC Skins Fan · 12-03-2007, 01:38 PM

I watch Berrian whenever I get the chance and he seems to get open a lot, and then Rex Grossman throws some awful pass. He's probably not a bonafide #1 and maybe too inconsistent to really be a game changer. He's sort of the deep guy in Chicago (I'd have to watch more of him to make a more educated assessment). He might be too much like Moss (though taller 6-1) too be worth the money. I know SmootSmack was pimping him a couple of weeks ago and I've tried to take a look at him on the ticket when I've had the chance and he just looks like a real good player who is held back by horrible QB play. I think he may have had issues with dropped balls in the past so again, there are probably some downsides that I haven't gotten the opportunity to see.

freddyg12 · 12-03-2007, 01:40 PM

S. Moss has done a lot for the team, not just the 05 dallas game. But he's hobbled all the time & is obviously not in the class of those few great wr's that get open despite everyone knowing their qb is looking for them all the time.

ARE is a good slot reciever, but can't beat many db's down field.

I would love to see the Skins draft a wr that could earn a starting job but I would hope we wouldn't use a 1st or 2nd rnd. pick.

gibbs et al are certainly going to be looking in the offseason, just as they were late this offseason and into the reg. season.

SmootSmack · 12-03-2007, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

I watch Berrian whenever I get the chance and he seems to get open a lot, and then Rex Grossman throws some awful pass. He's probably not a bonafide #1 and maybe too inconsistent to really be a game changer. He's sort of the deep guy in Chicago (I'd have to watch more of him to make a more educated assessment). He might be too much like Moss (though taller 6-1) too be worth the money. I know SmootSmack was pimping him a couple of weeks ago and I've tried to take a look at him on the ticket when I've had the chance and he just looks like a real good player who is held back by horrible QB play. I think he may have had issues with dropped balls in the past so again, there are probably some downsides that I haven't gotten the opportunity to see.

I do like Berrian, but I think if we commit to Caldwell he can be as effective as Berrian.

MTK · 12-03-2007, 01:41 PM

Berrian is a speed guy and not much else in my opinion.

We need a true go to guy, a guy that can be counted on for crucial possession type catches, but someone that can also stretch the field.

Beemnseven · 12-03-2007, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddyg12

I would love to see the Skins draft a wr that could earn a starting job but I would hope we wouldn't use a 1st or 2nd rnd. pick.

I used to think that too, but this team has so many holes, just about any position you pick in the first round won't hurt at this point.

The way I see it, with next year's draft, the areas we seem to have covered are QB, RB, and LB. In every other position, we could use some help.

SC Skins Fan · 12-03-2007, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

The Bengals would probably be willing to part with Chad Johnson for the right price.

Just saying.

Do you think that price would include a #1 pick? Probably if the Redskins are doing the trading it would. But Javon Walker went for a #2 (coming off the ACL and after refusing to play for GB again, plus he did not have the resume Ocho Cinco has and also hasn't worked out too well in Denver). Moss went for a 4th (don't see any bargains like this coming down the pike, the first time he was traded it was for Nap Harris and the #7 overall pick), Welker went for a 2nd and 7th (I think). Since Ocho hasn't begged out of Cincy yet it wouldn't seem like the Skins would be getting any bargains. I also wonder about such having a such a dominant personality (and I like Chad) with Jason, I wonder how that would play.

It'd nice to have a guy start here in DC and grow up with Jason, though the WR development process is often a painful one and even the "can't miss" Calvin Johnson hasn't contributed all that much to this point.

SC Skins Fan · 12-03-2007, 02:02 PM

Not sure if all the info is 100% accurate, but it seems pretty good. Here is a list of potential Free Agents. The list looks pretty bare to me. Looks like any real development is going to have to come through the draft. Jared Allen is the one really big name, but he'll get hit with the Franchise tag for sure or else get extended in KC. Justin Smith is also out there, though the Bengals franchised him this year so might they again? Asante Samuel will command too much $$$ and no other DBs look all that tempting.

2008 NFL Free Agents

theJBexperience · 12-03-2007, 02:19 PM

[quote=Bill B;388123]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I really started thinking yesterday that we need to go out this offseason and get a big time WR in here.

Sorry, but Moss just isn't a go to guy you can count on game in and game out. We need a true star at WR, a guy that Campbell can grow with and have that special chemistry with. Right now we have a bunch of #2 and #3 WRs.

We do have a go to guy at TE in Cooley, but we need a go to guy at WR to really make this offense dangerous.

Put me on the WR bandwagon for this offseason.

Does anyone know what free agents will be available?[/quote]

Andre Johnson of the Houston Texans is a free agent this offseason (we seem to like the Miami thing and Johnson is a flat out stud). Only thing is I don't we have the cap room flexilibity with all the impending things with both sides of the line getting old and Andre Johnson will probably be getting somewhere in the range of a $10 million bonus.

Johnson is a free agent? I'd go after him. He's big and has been getting better each year. I'd think he'd stay in Houston though. He and schaub have a good thing going.

SC Skins Fan · 12-03-2007, 02:24 PM

[quote=theJBexperience;388198]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill B

Johnson is a free agent? I'd go after him. He's big and has been getting better each year. I'd think he'd stay in Houston though. He and schaub have a good thing going.

Johnson is a stud, and the sort of player the Redskins need. I'm fairly certain, however, that he is not a Free Agent. This is his fifth season in the league and since high first round picks typically sign for 6-7 years he's almost certainly got time left on his contract. Houston won't let him get away either.

Bill B · 12-03-2007, 02:28 PM

[quote=SC Skins Fan;388205]

Quote:

Originally Posted by theJBexperience

Johnson is a stud, and the sort of player the Redskins need. I'm fairly certain, however, that he is not a Free Agent. This is his fifth season in the league and since high first round picks typically sign for 6-7 years he's almost certainly got time left on his contract. Houston won't let him get away either.

SC Skins fan - you are correct - my bad - Andre Johnson's contract expires next year and he will be a free agent in 2009. I got mixed up with Andre Davis of the Texans being a free agent this offseason.

You are right about Houston not letting him go - the Skins would have to throw the bank at him to get him and I just don't think we have the cap flexibility to sign him for what he probably will get from either Houton or a team with a lot more cap room than us. Plus Houton could use the franchise tag on Johnson as well if negotiations go sour between the two parties.

12-03-2007, 01:25 PM	#16
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,462	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? The Bengals would probably be willing to part with Chad Johnson for the right price. Just saying. __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

12-03-2007, 01:32 PM	#17
sportscurmudgeon Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,159	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? I happen to think that WR is one of the biggest weaknesses on the 2007 version of the Washington Redskins. Allow me to explain: Brandon Lloyd is worthless. If the Redskins cut him the day after the season is over, he'll be sitting by his telephone waiting for it to ring for at least 6 weeks - - and even then it won't be an NFL GM calling, it will probably be a telemarketing call. Antwaan Randle-El is a punt/kick returner and a #3 reciever. That's it; that's all. As soon as he got hurt and McCardell and Caldwell got more playing time, the passing game got more efficient. Yes, ARE gives the Skins the ability to run a gadget play once or twice a month but his meager productivity on the field in normal play situations doesn't make that worth it. By the way,on those gadget plays this year, ARE has 19 yards passing and a net of minus-3 yards rushing. Glad the team has that potential in its arsenal... Santana Moss is fun to watch - - if you like 8-10 yard catches and his herky-jerky first down signal. The problem is that even though WRs are ranked on the basis of number of catches, that's not what makes the really good ones really good. There's this thing called "scoring touchdowns". At the moment, Moss has been in the end zone ONCE this year. Since he's been here he's played in 40 games and has 16 TDs. That's about 6.4 TDs per year. And that's not good enough for the "lead receiver" on a team that wants to be a "contender" for something other than taking a Caribbean cruise during the month of January. And don't anyone rhapsodize about how Moss caught those two bombs from Brunell a couple of years ago to beat Dallas. That's ancient history and there have been boatloads of games since then where the Skins could have used a big catch by a big time WR to win a game. He hasn't provided it... James Thrash is the team's most versatile receiver and the most rounded player of the lot. He actually blocks people on every running play and usually the block is an effective one. There is no way you can say that about Moss or Lloyd or ARE. But Thrash is a #3 receiver at best. When he was in Philly and tried to assume the role of lead receiver he was a bust. He tries hard on every play, but his skills are limited. Nonetheless, of all the WRs on this team, he leads the team in TDs this year with TWO. And this is December ... Scary... McCardell and Caldwell are better all around receivers than anything else on the roster at the moment unless you want to fantasize about the untapped and about-to-explode potential contained in Anthony Mix, Stephen Harris, Jimmy Farris, Mike Espy and Burl Toler. The Redskins should definitely keep McCardell and Caldwell next year AND look for more talent at this position. __________________ The Sports Curmudgeon www.sportscurmudgeon.com But don't get me wrong, I love sports...

12-03-2007, 01:36 PM	#20
memphisskin Impact Rookie Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Nashville, TN Age: 53 Posts: 960	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? I have argued with people for hours about our receiving corps, but the proof is in the pudding. Cooley without question is a beast. The rest, I love 'em all since they are Skins but there's a reason we were trying to get Calvin Johnson in the draft last year. We add a big strong wideout like him and I think our offense takes off. Part of the reason I think Cooley leads us in catches is because he's the tallest target we have. Our receiving corps is serviceable, but they don't excel because for some reason we just can't get them in space. That said, I love McCardell, but if our 2008 plans include depending on McCardell then we're already sunk. He's crafty, but the fact that he came in and played right away is an indictment on our receiving corps.

12-03-2007, 01:38 PM	#21
SC Skins Fan The Starter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,555	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? I watch Berrian whenever I get the chance and he seems to get open a lot, and then Rex Grossman throws some awful pass. He's probably not a bonafide #1 and maybe too inconsistent to really be a game changer. He's sort of the deep guy in Chicago (I'd have to watch more of him to make a more educated assessment). He might be too much like Moss (though taller 6-1) too be worth the money. I know SmootSmack was pimping him a couple of weeks ago and I've tried to take a look at him on the ticket when I've had the chance and he just looks like a real good player who is held back by horrible QB play. I think he may have had issues with dropped balls in the past so again, there are probably some downsides that I haven't gotten the opportunity to see. __________________ It has taken a long time, but I have finally realized that nothing I say about the Redskins will have any effect upon anything the Redskins do.

12-03-2007, 01:40 PM	#22
freddyg12 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 4,540	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? S. Moss has done a lot for the team, not just the 05 dallas game. But he's hobbled all the time & is obviously not in the class of those few great wr's that get open despite everyone knowing their qb is looking for them all the time. ARE is a good slot reciever, but can't beat many db's down field. I would love to see the Skins draft a wr that could earn a starting job but I would hope we wouldn't use a 1st or 2nd rnd. pick. gibbs et al are certainly going to be looking in the offseason, just as they were late this offseason and into the reg. season.

12-03-2007, 01:41 PM	#24
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,462	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? Berrian is a speed guy and not much else in my opinion. We need a true go to guy, a guy that can be counted on for crucial possession type catches, but someone that can also stretch the field. __________________ Support The Warpath! \| Warpath Shop

12-03-2007, 02:02 PM	#27
SC Skins Fan The Starter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,555	Re: Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans? Not sure if all the info is 100% accurate, but it seems pretty good. Here is a list of potential Free Agents. The list looks pretty bare to me. Looks like any real development is going to have to come through the draft. Jared Allen is the one really big name, but he'll get hit with the Franchise tag for sure or else get extended in KC. Justin Smith is also out there, though the Bengals franchised him this year so might they again? Asante Samuel will command too much $$$ and no other DBs look all that tempting. 2008 NFL Free Agents __________________ It has taken a long time, but I have finally realized that nothing I say about the Redskins will have any effect upon anything the Redskins do.

Reche Caldwell and Keenan McCardell: 2008 Plans?

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