Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success

Hail to the Redskins · 11-21-2011, 05:48 PM

OK, one thing I have learned over the years...

A) Putting down some one else's opinions doesn't automatically make you the smarter, wiser, or more intelligent person.

B) It's always best to actually READ everything that is written in someone's post before declaring someone is "right" or "wrong" with their OPINION.

... In the original post, I was talking about my impression of ROOKIE PERFORMANCE EXPECTATIONS BASED ON DRAFT POSITION... i.e. based on a CURVE as I was basing it on where we are right now, seeing as how it isn't 2013.

Grading Kerrigan an A+ pick does not mean that he is an A+ LB and is offically better than Sigletary, Urlacher & Ray Lewis combined. It means that he is performing as good as I could have possibly guessed through 10 games playing a new position as a rookie.

90% of my opinion is what I have seen with my own eyes, not stats...

Jenkins, Hankerson, Paul have been praised on numerous occasions by teammates & coaches about their performance in practice, and I've seen things that show they know what the hell they are doing already in certain key areas, FOR A ROOKIE.

As for "stats," DeJon Gomes and his "one game." Mr. "Google Babe Laufenburg" how about you tell me how many 5TH ROUND safeties have made 13 tackles in their first career start as a rookie? Also notice that I didn't give him an "A" and I DID MENTION that it was just one game... but that he already looked better than Reed Doughty (IMO).

And Hankerson... 2 starts, 12 catches for 140 yards and a 2-point conversion where he looked VERY comfortable working the CB off to open space for the back shoulder catch. After watching D. Thomas and M. Kelly, how can you say that he has shown already to be a MUCH better value than either, having picked him in the 3RD ROUND.

As for Helu... If you can't see the difference between how he finds and hits holes compared to Hightower, Torain, Choice, etc. then that's where we really differ. As far as his stats.... Over the past 6 games, Torain has 51 yards on 36 carries, Helu is something around 120 yards on 24 carries... behind the same line.

You don't think you need to see stats to see talent.

Again, let me make the original post clear... the grades aren't player grades as compared to everyone in the NFL. It's based on what I've seen vs what the expectations were for that player based on their draft position.

Why don't you just share YOUR opinion instead of trying to trash someone else's (like others have done in this thread)? It's like those parents that sit in the stands, talk about how their vast experience playing a sport (in rec or high school), coaching their 10 year-old and trashing everything a coach does just so it makes them seem like the supreme guru... makes me shake my head.

skinster · 11-21-2011, 06:17 PM

Disagree, I think its a little overly optimistic.

Kerrigan is an A-/B+ IMO. He's a solid pick, but not a stud. His stats I believe to be a little misleading. Pretty much every sack I've seen him make he is either untouched, or not being blocked by an O-linemen. Once he beats his first couple double team's then I'll conceed the A+

Jenkins was a pre-season A but now is TBD.

Hankerson is a TBD, but looks promising.

Helu is a C IMO. Nothing more than a guy that can play as the 3rd RB for a long time in the NFL. Most of his yards seem to come from draws on long downs. I don't see him being able to carry the load on any week. Not a bad guy to throw in the mix though.

That Guy · 11-26-2011, 07:13 AM

well, based on plasyer performance they did fine, but on origanizational roster building (ie not getting a good QB or OL guys) they failed miserably.

NC_Skins · 11-26-2011, 11:27 AM

Truthfully, it's way too soon to be grading this years draft.

Bucket · 11-26-2011, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinster

Disagree, I think its a little overly optimistic.

Kerrigan is an A-/B+ IMO. He's a solid pick, but not a stud. His stats I believe to be a little misleading. Pretty much every sack I've seen him make he is either untouched, or not being blocked by an O-linemen. Once he beats his first couple double team's then I'll conceed the A+

Jenkins was a pre-season A but now is TBD.

Hankerson is a TBD, but looks promising.

Helu is a C IMO. Nothing more than a guy that can play as the 3rd RB for a long time in the NFL. Most of his yards seem to come from draws on long downs. I don't see him being able to carry the load on any week. Not a bad guy to throw in the mix though.

So one Kerrigan beats a few double teams he's a A? I've seen Nield beat a few double teams this year. He's an A!

Nice grade system lol

skinster · 11-26-2011, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucket

So one Kerrigan beats a few double teams he's a A? I've seen Nield beat a few double teams this year. He's an A!

Nice grade system lol

I doubt that's true. All I'm saying is that to be an A plass rusher, you have to beat the double team, not get to the qb by beating tight ends and backs.

diehardskin2982 · 11-27-2011, 12:16 AM

IMO This draft class was significantly better draft then past seasons. We have 9 of 12 draft picks that have seen the field and made an impact in one form or another is huge. Not to mention that we obtained all of these players by trading down and not losing picks in this years draft.

Bucket · 11-27-2011, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinster

I doubt that's true. All I'm saying is that to be an A plass rusher, you have to beat the double team, not get to the qb by beating tight ends and backs.

3 of Kerrigans sacks this year have been when he's beaten the RT, 2 were from just hustle when the QB scrambled...

mooby · 11-27-2011, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinster

I doubt that's true. All I'm saying is that to be an A plass rusher, you have to beat the double team, not get to the qb by beating tight ends and backs.

Now when you say plass rusher, do you mean the loose Norwegian translation for place or are you referring to to the American automobile "the Plass", made by Reuben Plass in 1897? Just wanted to check before I respond to your post.

SkinzzFan · 11-27-2011, 11:45 AM

[QUOTE=Bucket;863137]3 of Kerrigans sacks this year have been when he's beaten the RT, 2 were from just hustle when the QB scrambled...[/QUOTE

2 "were just from hustle"? Seriously? I wish EVERY player who "just hustle" on every play.

Bucket · 11-27-2011, 03:34 PM

[quote=SkinzzFan;863155]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucket

3 of Kerrigans sacks this year have been when he's beaten the RT, 2 were from just hustle when the QB scrambled...[/QUOTE

2 "were just from hustle"? Seriously? I wish EVERY player who "just hustle" on every play.

How else, was I suppose to say that? Kerrigan has two sacks from relentless pace at the QB while the QB scrambled out of the pocket? lol.. I'm confused at your comment.

SkinzzFan · 11-27-2011, 08:40 PM

[quote=Bucket;863211]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkinzzFan

How else, was I suppose to say that? Kerrigan has two sacks from relentless pace at the QB while the QB scrambled out of the pocket? lol.. I'm confused at your comment.

Honestly I was confused by your comment...it seemed like you were saying because those were hustle plays they were somehow devalued and took away from his strong rookie season. Apparently I misinterpreted what you meant. LOL.

Bushead · 11-27-2011, 09:15 PM

I'm confused by "he has to consistently beat the double team." I can't think of anyone who beats a double team consistently.

ethat001 · 11-27-2011, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinster

Helu is a C IMO. Nothing more than a guy that can play as the 3rd RB for a long time in the NFL. Most of his yards seem to come from draws on long downs. I don't see him being able to carry the load on any week. Not a bad guy to throw in the mix though.

One game does not a player make. But Helu looked pretty impressive when he's gotten the start, and -- against a good run defense today vs. Seahawks. The jump-over-the-guy for TD is one of our few highlights for the season. Also had a decent presence in the passing game.

I think Helu gets an A given how low he was drafted, based on potential so far. We'll see in 3 years if this remains true.

mredskins · 11-28-2011, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ethat001

One game does not a player make. But Helu looked pretty impressive when he's gotten the start, and -- against a good run defense today vs. Seahawks. The jump-over-the-guy for TD is one of our few highlights for the season. Also had a decent presence in the passing game.

I think Helu gets an A given how low he was drafted, based on potential so far. We'll see in 3 years if this remains true.

Helu is my last hope to have any chance in Fantasy Football this year.

11-21-2011, 05:48 PM	#16
Hail to the Redskins The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,687	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success OK, one thing I have learned over the years... A) Putting down some one else's opinions doesn't automatically make you the smarter, wiser, or more intelligent person. B) It's always best to actually READ everything that is written in someone's post before declaring someone is "right" or "wrong" with their OPINION. ... In the original post, I was talking about my impression of ROOKIE PERFORMANCE EXPECTATIONS BASED ON DRAFT POSITION... i.e. based on a CURVE as I was basing it on where we are right now, seeing as how it isn't 2013. Grading Kerrigan an A+ pick does not mean that he is an A+ LB and is offically better than Sigletary, Urlacher & Ray Lewis combined. It means that he is performing as good as I could have possibly guessed through 10 games playing a new position as a rookie. 90% of my opinion is what I have seen with my own eyes, not stats... Jenkins, Hankerson, Paul have been praised on numerous occasions by teammates & coaches about their performance in practice, and I've seen things that show they know what the hell they are doing already in certain key areas, FOR A ROOKIE. As for "stats," DeJon Gomes and his "one game." Mr. "Google Babe Laufenburg" how about you tell me how many 5TH ROUND safeties have made 13 tackles in their first career start as a rookie? Also notice that I didn't give him an "A" and I DID MENTION that it was just one game... but that he already looked better than Reed Doughty (IMO). And Hankerson... 2 starts, 12 catches for 140 yards and a 2-point conversion where he looked VERY comfortable working the CB off to open space for the back shoulder catch. After watching D. Thomas and M. Kelly, how can you say that he has shown already to be a MUCH better value than either, having picked him in the 3RD ROUND. As for Helu... If you can't see the difference between how he finds and hits holes compared to Hightower, Torain, Choice, etc. then that's where we really differ. As far as his stats.... Over the past 6 games, Torain has 51 yards on 36 carries, Helu is something around 120 yards on 24 carries... behind the same line. You don't think you need to see stats to see talent. Again, let me make the original post clear... the grades aren't player grades as compared to everyone in the NFL. It's based on what I've seen vs what the expectations were for that player based on their draft position. Why don't you just share YOUR opinion instead of trying to trash someone else's (like others have done in this thread)? It's like those parents that sit in the stands, talk about how their vast experience playing a sport (in rec or high school), coaching their 10 year-old and trashing everything a coach does just so it makes them seem like the supreme guru... makes me shake my head. __________________ “Sometimes it is not enough to our best; we must do what is required.” - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965) Last edited by Hail to the Redskins; 11-21-2011 at 05:54 PM.

11-21-2011, 06:17 PM	#17
skinster Impact Rookie Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 754	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success Disagree, I think its a little overly optimistic. Kerrigan is an A-/B+ IMO. He's a solid pick, but not a stud. His stats I believe to be a little misleading. Pretty much every sack I've seen him make he is either untouched, or not being blocked by an O-linemen. Once he beats his first couple double team's then I'll conceed the A+ Jenkins was a pre-season A but now is TBD. Hankerson is a TBD, but looks promising. Helu is a C IMO. Nothing more than a guy that can play as the 3rd RB for a long time in the NFL. Most of his yards seem to come from draws on long downs. I don't see him being able to carry the load on any week. Not a bad guy to throw in the mix though.

11-26-2011, 07:13 AM	#18
That Guy Living Legend Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: VA Age: 41 Posts: 17,511	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success well, based on plasyer performance they did fine, but on origanizational roster building (ie not getting a good QB or OL guys) they failed miserably.

11-26-2011, 11:27 AM	#19
NC_Skins Gamebreaker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 14,258	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success Truthfully, it's way too soon to be grading this years draft. __________________ "So let me get this straight. We have the event of the year on TV with millions watching around the world... and people want a punt, pass, and kick competition to be the halftime entertainment?? Folks, don't quit your day jobs."- Matty

11-27-2011, 12:16 AM	#22
diehardskin2982 Another Year, another mess. Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,581	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success IMO This draft class was significantly better draft then past seasons. We have 9 of 12 draft picks that have seen the field and made an impact in one form or another is huge. Not to mention that we obtained all of these players by trading down and not losing picks in this years draft. __________________ That got ugly fast

11-27-2011, 11:45 AM	#25
SkinzzFan Special Teams Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Queensbury, NY Posts: 273	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success [QUOTE=Bucket;863137]3 of Kerrigans sacks this year have been when he's beaten the RT, 2 were from just hustle when the QB scrambled...[/QUOTE 2 "were just from hustle"? Seriously? I wish EVERY player who "just hustle" on every play. __________________ "Baseball is what we were, football is what we have become"

11-27-2011, 09:15 PM	#28
Bushead Impact Rookie Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 782	Re: Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success I'm confused by "he has to consistently beat the double team." I can't think of anyone who beats a double team consistently.

Redskins 2011 Draft = Big Success

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