Redskins at Bears Post Game Thoughts

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Wow, um my bad dude.
Here I thought we're 2 fans that are football nerds talking about a specific play.
But, if you feel that I'm arguing just to argue and I do this continually then I won't waste your time with my response.
There are plenty of Skip Bayless posts that you can respond to.

We're still nerds talking about football

I just can't stand it when something is obvious, black and white, and available from myriad sources to verify no less, but you want to agree to disagree lol. Davis was open from the snap.

But whoever said the play may have been designed to hit Moss using Davis as a decoy is probably right. I just meant that come regular season you want to see your QB adjust during the play and hit the open receiver for the 1st down...and I think RGIII will. That was my whole friggin point from the beginning.

[Monksdown]

Originally Posted by The Goat

LOL no offense intended dude but I did get a laught out of it. Route progressions and decoys are no harder concept than getting the ball to the open receiver

Yes, Davis is without question the best downfield target on the roster, especially in redzone. Moss is our best receiver at finding open space but his size doesn't allow him to break tackles the way Davis can. But Moss should have the most yards among our WR corp this season if coaches/QB play to our strengths ala Brady to Welker in New England. Hankerson and Morgan are good help but neither can find the open space consistently. Garcon isn't going to beat many DBs or even safeties when it comes to straight line speed, nor is a big/strong enough to overpower most. From all the video I can find he often struggles in space, whether it's working underneath the linebackers or the secondary. On the flip side Garcon has good hands and doesn't mind crossing the middle. Indy set him up w/ lots of quick slants and YAC, with some deep routes mixed in though the DB typically had to get fooled for Garcon take those passes down.

I think you're going to find that the tight end position this year will find themselves pass blocking more than in the past. In order of targets this year: 1-Garcon; 2-Davis; 3-Moss. You are way over-valuing Moss. Cooley isnt worth his contract i hate to say at this point. He's a 2nd string tight end and full back with durability issues. Find another player on any team with those responsibilities and his salary.

You wont. Not to put too much credence into analysis or anything. Fantasy football experts arent football experts per say, but as close to football statistics experts as you'll probably find when you compile the per quantity of analysis they work through and report on. No one is drafting Moss, nobody. Pierre is getting drafted ahead of Davis even when value based drafting analysis is designed. (weighted)

Bottom line, Moss wont be targeted 60 times this year, and Garcon will be looked at over 100 times. Book it.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

I think you're going to find that the tight end position this year will find themselves pass blocking more than in the past. In order of targets this year: 1-Garcon; 2-Davis; 3-Moss. You are way over-valuing Moss. Cooley isnt worth his contract i hate to say at this point. He's a 2nd string tight end and full back with durability issues. Find another player on any team with those responsibilities and his salary.

You wont. Not to put too much credence into analysis or anything. Fantasy football experts arent football experts per say, but as close to football statistics experts as you'll probably find when you compile the per quantity of analysis they work through and report on. No one is drafting Moss, nobody. Pierre is getting drafted ahead of Davis even when value based drafting analysis is designed. (weighted)

Bottom line, Moss wont be targeted 60 times this year, and Garcon will be looked at over 100 times. Book it.

My fear is your prediction is accurate i.e. too many passes will be forced toward Garcon, missing the open receivers. I'm sad to see Cooley go but it seems to be the case.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by The Goat

We're still nerds talking about football

I just can't stand it when something is obvious, black and white, and available from myriad sources to verify no less, but you want to agree to disagree lol. Davis was open from the snap.

But whoever said the play may have been designed to hit Moss using Davis as a decoy is probably right. I just meant that come regular season you want to see your QB adjust during the play and hit the open receiver for the 1st down...and I think RGIII will. That was my whole friggin point from the beginning.

Case in point from John Keim (best on the beat IMO) on where a 'good' play by Cousins was the wrong play.. Just because we think we see what we see, we may not be seeing the entire picture..

Redskins QB Cousins learns from risky throw | WashingtonExaminer.com

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by 30gut

All very true.

I think Davis is kinda open but certainly not 'wide open'.
He's short of the 1st and would need RAC or break a tackle to convert the 1st down.
But, it is probably a safer play then throwing to a double covered Moss.

Here's how I see it:
3rd and 4
There are 2 linebackers dropping back with full view of Davis and Griffin, there is one LB #52? who is definetely keying on Davis and would have a great jump on ball thrown to Davis and since the other linebacker is also watching Griffin they would both break towards Davis upon Griffin's release of the pass.
Imo that does not constitute being 'wide open', and throwing this pass to Davis is akin to throwing a checkdown as Davis is running about 2 yards short and parrallel to the 1st down marker.

That's what I saw *shrugs*

-btw
Are you the same paintrain from extremeskins?

Yes, but it's been years since I posted over there. Has someone assumed my virtual identity?

[30gut]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Yes, but it's been years since I posted over there. Has someone assumed my virtual identity?

Nah, talking about this play reminds me of the thread awhile back where a group of us did breakdown/discussion of the Skins vs Cowboys game, I thought you were one of them.
One of the best threads ever on extremeskins.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Case in point from John Keim (best on the beat IMO) on where a 'good' play by Cousins was the wrong play.. Just because we think we see what we see, we may not be seeing the entire picture..

Redskins QB Cousins learns from risky throw | WashingtonExaminer.com

Good read for sure. I appreciate your posts and insight btw...

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by The Goat

Good read for sure. I appreciate your posts and insight btw...

Thanks bro, likewise.. Ready for some real football!!

[CrustyRedskin]

Originally Posted by Monksdown

I think you're going to find that the tight end position this year will find themselves pass blocking more than in the past. In order of targets this year: 1-Garcon; 2-Davis; 3-Moss. You are way over-valuing Moss. Cooley isnt worth his contract i hate to say at this point. He's a 2nd string tight end and full back with durability issues. Find another player on any team with those responsibilities and his salary.

You wont. Not to put too much credence into analysis or anything. Fantasy football experts arent football experts per say, but as close to football statistics experts as you'll probably find when you compile the per quantity of analysis they work through and report on. No one is drafting Moss, nobody. Pierre is getting drafted ahead of Davis even when value based drafting analysis is designed. (weighted)

Bottom line, Moss wont be targeted 60 times this year, and Garcon will be looked at over 100 times. Book it.

I wana see RGIII throw one to Moss as far as he can in both games against Dallas !!!!

[Paintrain]

** Sorry-double post **

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by The Goat

We're still nerds talking about football

I just can't stand it when something is obvious, black and white, and available from myriad sources to verify no less, but you want to agree to disagree lol. Davis was open from the snap.

But whoever said the play may have been designed to hit Moss using Davis as a decoy is probably right. I just meant that come regular season you want to see your QB adjust during the play and hit the open receiver for the 1st down...and I think RGIII will. That was my whole friggin point from the beginning.

Edit it

[mooby]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So here we go again its now a black and white issue. RG III threw the ball to Moss because he is also black and black QB's look for their black WR's first.

Just putting this out there, this is a pretty weak joke FD.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by mooby

Just putting this out there, this is a pretty weak joke FD.

Actually I thought it was funny but I came back in to delete because I worried some might not no I was joking.

[Jak101]

It was looking dismal for a while, but they picked it up. Super glad it wasn't a blow out!

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by mooby

Just putting this out there, this is a pretty weak joke FD.

Originally Posted by firstdown
So here we go again its now a black and white issue. RG III threw the ball to Moss because he is also black and black QB's look for their black WR's first.



Was this not in the spirit of one Skip Bayless' recent comments??? Because than its funny.