NFL Network: Bears' Briggs, 31st Pick for Skins' 6th Pick?

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

yet another immature little ass. are you people seriously that insecure about your man hood that it requires you downgrade yourself to name calling?

Is the irony of this statement not lost on anybody?

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

also, that does not always ring true. I believe we have all had discussions regarding players drafted in later rounds that turn out to be great players. So, yes players taken in the top 10 typically are better than the bottom 10, but its not a guarantee. We could get a quality DE or DT with the 31st pick that could be just as good, if not better than the guy drafted 25 picks ahead of him.

Yeah, we COULD. And if a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his ass when he hops.

Bottom line: the 6th pick is worth so much more than the 31st because the chances of hitting on the player is so much higher.

Your argument makes no sense.

[724Skinsfan]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Is the irony of this statement not lost on anybody?

I believe the word is hypocrisy.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Is the irony of this statement not lost on anybody?

you like that. figured I would sink to their level for a few minutes.

[ArtMonkDrillz]

No offense, but it seems like everyone around here is a little testy.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

yet another immature little ass. are you people seriously that insecure about your man hood that it requires you downgrade yourself to name calling? When does "price" ever matter with this organization? oh, thats right.. Randel El's 30 million, Arch 30million, Lloyds 30 million, were all cost minded?? i forgot

Is, or is not your stance on the trade that we are giving up nothing? My statement wasn't an accusation at all, it was an honest conditional statement. I have a hard time believeing that you really believe what you wrote. It's ridiculous. I figured you were BSing us.

Chill.

[Schneed10]

56, just because I called you a moron doesn't mean I'm not capable of keeping this discussion civil. I don't think you're making a lick of sense, but I'm still willing to listen to what you have to say.

It's just that every opinion you've given so far doesn't pass any test of logic, and I felt you needed a little beatdown for not listening/reading others' posts.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

if you can read the point I made : franchise player require two first round picks - we are not losing a 1st round pick to aquire a franchised player. This is what I meant. 2nd, we were looking to trade down to aquire more picks. We essentially get to trade down to a late 1st and get a 26 year old LB which is worth a hole hell of a lot more than any 2nd or 3rd round player we would have drafted.

I think this is the main bone of contention. The value of Briggs and the #31 pick is less than the value of trading from the #6 to pick up a later first round pick (presumably higher than #31) and/or a 2nd and a 3rd rounder.

Not to mention that of the weaknesses we have on defense, linebacker is the most solid set of positions we have. The help we need at positions along the D-line and at cornerback and strong safety outweigh any contributions Briggs can give us.

Then there are the salary cap implications. Briggs will wind up costing way more than the pool of draft picks we would have been able to amass. And yes, our front office hasn't exactly hit homeruns with 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks in the past, but at least we're moving in the right direction by using the draft for player acquisition. If we miss out with the draft picks, at least they don't cost us as much.

Also, don't discount the possibility that Briggs could be the wrong fit for our defense. As we can all easily admit, there are no "sure things" in free agency either.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by ArtMonkDrillz

You say we're basically gaining an extra 1st round pick because we are getting a stud linebacker, but that's not what we need right now!
People around here want to trade down our pick so that we can get a defensive lineman, a guard, a safety, maybe a cornerback, maybe a tight end, and maybe another late round receiver. Another linebacker is one of the last positions that we feel like the team needs to fill right now, which means it would basically be a waste to pick/trade for one.

I am not saying we get an extra 1st round pick. I am saying we dont lose a 1st round pick. what we do lose is the potential to trade down and get additional picks, maybe 2nd and 3rd to draft DLINE, OLINE, CB whatever. My opinion is : we still have a 1st rounder - get a player that will be a TON better that what we would have drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round. Our 1st rounders take 2 or 3 years to get on the field with this staff. So why not get someone who is going to play now. We have signed depth to the Oline in the offseason, signed depth for the secondary, we have receivers. we could use some depth at TE. I just see this as a pretty good move for once.

[Skinny Tee]

Is something up with Marcus Washington that we don't know about. I heard about the hip surgery but I didn't hear that his hip was going to be a problem this coming year.

Marcus Washington is a leader on our defense and someone that fans consider a true Redskin. If his role is diminished if Briggs were to come here I DO NOT want to see the Briggs trade to happen.

DLine is the most imperative need and if we walk away with Briggs and no solution for the DLine that is a reckless decision.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I'm not sorry, my opinion of you hasn't changed, and I still don't find you to be very intelligent.

I have no problem with your opinion in and of itself. It's fine to state it. But if I address it in a post, and then you repeat yourself again as if you never even read what I said, well that to me isn't very responsible on a board aimed at "discussion for the knowledgeable fan." If you're not addressing my point and you're just repeating yourself, you're not having much of a discussion, are you? You're just blowing hot air onto the boards without listening to the opinions of others.

Now, as for your clarified point, I addressed that one as well earlier in the thread. No franchised player is actually worth 2 first rounders. Just because the CBA says that's the price, that doesn't make the underlying player actually worth that much.

I tried to address you point in the 2nd post, maybe i didn't. as far as the franchise and what they are worth, I am referring to the CBA that says a team can ask for 2 first rounders, or a frachise player is worth 2 first rounders. Do I think franchise players are worth two 1st rounders, NO. never have. I was using that as a reference for what most teams originally expect when designating a player as franchised.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

hey, I agree. You will alway hear me saying the same thing. I just thing Briggs is a complete stud LB. We get the guy for nothing, when franchise players cost you 2 first round picks. We get him and keep a 1st round pick. I just think its one of those deals you can not pass up, no matter what you need. Rocky is unproven, he could provide great depth with Marshall. We always say our team has no depth, this could give us some depth there. we only had 1 pick anyway. We were going to trade down and take a DL anyway, why not upgrade and still pick a DL late in the 1st round, which is what we were going to do anyway

You don't trade away a 2nd rounder to move up to take a guy in the 2nd round to be a back-up. That makes no sense what so ever. That's like trading for Drew Brees, making him your starter and telling JC to be the back-up. Too much is invested in Rocky to make him a back-up. Plus we have Marshall to play weak side. Didn't Marshall play real well filling in for lavar in 04? Don't our silly ass coaches already know this?

I know Briggs is real good. But how is he going to play in our system with a line that's not as good as the Bears? I bet his play slips if he comes here. How is he going to play after he gets a new deal? It's like we always chase other teams players. When are we ever going to draft a guy, let him grow in our system, and reward that player? All of our own guys that we draft walk out the door. It's such bullshit! This is why we never make the playoffs.

The smart thing to do is give our players new deals before they hit the market. We already let Dock walk. We should be signing Cooley to a long term deal right now. Instead of chasing some crybaby bitch who goes on ESPN/NFL Network ( and whoever else will listen to him) and says he's not playing for 7.2 million.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Yeah, we COULD. And if a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his ass when he hops.

Bottom line: the 6th pick is worth so much more than the 31st because the chances of hitting on the player is so much higher.

Your argument makes no sense.

do you think I am putting the same weight on the 6th and 31st pick? I know the difference between the two.

Let me ask you this :
scenario 1 - we trade the 6th pick for a lower round 1st, 3rd, maybe a 2nd. we draft a DE or DT later in the 1st, probably between the 11th and 15th rounds. 2nd round - Oline, Safety, corner? 3rd, same needs. is that what you feel we need to do??

in the above it is not known or fact that we get more than two picks for our 6th pick. We may get a 1st and only a 2nd, at best. So, that player chosen in the 2nd, are they going to start? if we draft an Oline man - he isn't starting, corner? he isnt' starting, safety - nope not starting. nor would any 3rd round player selected.

in the trade with Chicago - we move down to the 31st and could select the same position as we would have with the 11th to 15th pick. maybe not as good, but still a 1st rounder, should be a decent player. We also get Briggs - an impact player who ultimately is way better than anyone we would have drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round. Plus, he plays right now. Gibbs isn't going to be around to watch our 2nd 3rd and 4th round players develop into stars, he wants to win now. He is going to do what ever it takes to win now.
I am not arguing with anyone. I respect all of your opinions or theories. I think you all add a different side to these discussions. I apologize to whomever it was I called an ass. that was out of line.
I just thought I should try and clear up why I think this deal is good for us. Although some of you may have shot it down earlier, i thought i would explain my thinking a little more.

or, maybe I am mentally challenged who knows.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

I am not saying we get an extra 1st round pick. I am saying we dont lose a 1st round pick.

This statement and what it infers is that all 1st round picks are equal, which they clearly are not. It doesn't matter that we are keeping a 1st rounder. We are losing value there plain and simple. Now the relative values of those picks you can debate but don't try and say there are no differences between the 6th pick and the 31st pick. That is what you inferring with your statement and it is wrong.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

When I hear people asking about Washington, in regards to this trade, it makes me worry. I worry because I can't help but remember the Duckett trade.

I could see us making this bad trade, simply because we want some sort of insurance policy for Washington. It seems like just another case of getting the wrong player for the wrong reasons (and sacrificing too much to do it).