2022 Midterms thread

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Then have those red states put abortion up for vote.

No?

You dont want a repeat of what happened in Kansas .. where "we the people" spoke and supported reasonable access to abortions?

All democrats are more extreme then the extreme portion of republicans? Okay nonniey ... have a good one.

I think everyone wants that actually, legislation…people voices to be heard.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by Giantone

That is republican spin , it's simply not true. You seem fine that a republican president stack the court and changed existing law that was established 50 years ago.

Hey Giant proof is in the pudding the bill the Dems tried to pass (only 1 Dem opposed) and promises to pass in the future prevents any restrictions on elective abortions at anytime during pregnancy (and pays for them). That of course is way beyond what restrictions Roe prevented.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Th.....

All democrats are more extreme then the extreme portion of republicans? Okay nonniey ... have a good one.

Yeah, you are right there was 1 that voted against the bill. So almost all.

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Except Dems aren't proposing reasonable access to abortions they've taken the most unpopular position that the Americans have on abortion - legalized elective abortions at anytime during pregnancy. Only 10% of the population supports that position.

As for putting it up to a vote I have no issues - legalized unrestricted abortions up 15 weeks and banning elective abortions after that period would easily win (Even in the bluest states).

Nonniey i respect your opinion bc usually its based in reality and logical and you put up some non-extremist articles so when you say something I accept it as true ... but here man, I dont see anyone supporting late term abortions unless its medically necessary to save the women.

Conservatives position is life starts at conception so I also dont believe that conservatives would support a 15 week limit.

Can you provide some trusted articles on dems wanting elective late term abortions? Articles on the bluest states like Alabama going along w 15 weeks and only medically necessary abortions after that?

[SunnySide]

(Reuters) - Alabama’s state Senate passed a bill on Tuesday to outlaw nearly all abortions, creating exceptions only to protect the mother’s health, as part of a multistate effort to have the U.S. Supreme Court reconsider a woman’s constitutional right to an abortion.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1SK13E

JACKSON, Miss. — As attorneys argued about abortion laws across the South on Tuesday, a Mississippi judge rejected a request by the state’s only abortion clinic to temporarily block a law that would ban most abortions.

Without other developments in the Mississippi lawsuit, the clinic will close at the end of business Wednesday and the state law will take effect Thursday.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...judge-00044133

13 States (alabama, mississippi, missourri, idaho, oklahoma, s dakota, texas, louississiana, wisconsin) have total bans on abortion, most wout exceptions for rape or incest.

8 more states have total bans or bans after 6 weeks but that is blocked by court but i assume will pass.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...oe-v-wade.html

[SunnySide]

(8) A prohibition on abortion at any point or points in time prior to fetal viability, including a prohibition or restriction on a particular abortion procedure.

(9) A prohibition on abortion after fetal viability when, in the good-faith medical judgment of the treating health care provider, continuation of the pregnancy would pose a risk to the pregnant patient’s life or health.

(10) A limitation on a health care provider’s ability to provide immediate abortion services when that health care provider believes, based on the good-faith medical judgment of the provider, that delay would pose a risk to the patient’s health.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-...bill/3755/text

This is from the symbolic Bill dems tried to pass.

It does not seek to allow abortions at any time .. it says fetal viability which has always been the standard under Roe.

Maybe you were referring on another bill ..

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Nonniey i respect your opinion bc usually its based in reality and logical and you put up some non-extremist articles so when you say something I accept it as true ... but here man, I dont see anyone supporting late term abortions unless its medically necessary to save the women.

Conservatives position is life starts at conception so I also dont believe that conservatives would support a 15 week limit.

Can you provide some trusted articles on dems wanting elective late term abortions? Articles on the bluest states like Alabama going along w 15 weeks and only medically necessary abortions after that?

Except that is exactly what the Dems bill does- protects legalized elective abortions. They basically want to impose Vermont's law on the entire country. Roe versus Wade allowed states to put in limited restrictions after 24 weeks (in reality too limited in effect). The Dems want to prevent states from even those Roe permitted limitations. Less than 2% of all abortions are late term (after 15 weeks) or 10K-15K total. Unfortunately, it turns out most of those are elective. The Dems want to continue to allow those elective abortions to be done and specifically have drawn up legislation to protect that practice.

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by nonniey

Except that is exactly what the Dems bill does- protects legalized elective abortions. They basically want to impose Vermont's law on the entire country. Roe versus Wade allowed states to put in limited restrictions after 24 weeks (in reality too limited in effect). The Dems want to prevent states from even those Roe permitted limitations. Less than 2% of all abortions are late term (after 15 weeks) or 10K-15K total. Unfortunately, it turns out most of those are elective. The Dems want to continue to allow those elective abortions to be done and specifically have drawn up legislation to protect that practice.

You said Dems want abortion at any time. I showed you the bill language it was up to viability.

You said red states support a 15 week limit. I showed you that many red states have and want a total ban.

But yeah .. dems are the extreme ones.

Disappointed in your subjective opinionated response honestly. If you have trusted articles and facts .. post em and Ill read them and consider.

[SunnySide]

Wisconsin Republicans, who have had a viselike grip on the Legislature since enacting the nation’s most aggressive gerrymander after their 2010 sweep of the state’s elections, make no apologies for pressing their advantage to its limits. Michels, the party’s nominee for governor, told supporters this week, “Republicans will never lose another election in Wisconsin after I’m elected governor.”

Former Rep. Reid Ribble, a Republican who served northeastern Wisconsin, said, “There’s a lot of complaining about gerrymandered House or state Assembly seats, and there’s some truth to that.”

“When you can win a majority of voters and have close to a third of the seats, it’s not true democracy,” said Greta Neubauer, the Democratic leader in the State Assembly. “We are very much at risk of people deciding that it’s not worthwhile for them to continue to engage because they see how rigged the system is against the people of the state in favor of Republican politicians.”

In northwest Wisconsin, the three incumbent Democratic legislators decided against running for reelection under new, more Republican-friendly maps. Under the old maps, Biden carried each of the districts, which are home to large numbers of unionized workers in paper mills, mines and shipyards. Under the new lines Republicans adopted last year, Trump would have won them all.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/wisconsin...125129138.html

Im feel like disengaging as well .. whats the point. States can have more democrat voters then republican but due to gerrymandering have no say.

Political system is broken.

[nonniey]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

You said Dems want abortion at any time. I showed you the bill language it was up to viability.

You said red states support a 15 week limit. I showed you that many red states have and want a total ban.

But yeah .. dems are the extreme ones.

Disappointed in your subjective opinionated response honestly. If you have trusted articles and facts .. post em and Ill read them and consider.

I said Dems have taken the most extreme position in the abortion debate and with only 10% supporting what they want to permit. Republicans have also taken the extreme positions as you have shown but a bit more of the population supports those positions than they do the Dems position.

As to late term abortions - here you go.

Under HR3577 Section 4 Permitted services
A1-9

These restrictions essentially eliminate any limitations states can impose. It turns late term abortions to strictly between the woman and the abortion provider (Same as Vermont).

Example current Virginia law generally prohibits abortion after viability, unless performed by a licensed physician in a licensed hospital with three physicians certifying that the continuation of the pregnancy will result in death of the pregnant person or impair their mental or physical health.[1] It also prohibits the D&X method of abortion.[2] Virginia also limits public funding for abortion.[3] Virginia law generally requires that a parent or “authorized person” be notified prior to a minor’s abortion[4] and consent to it.[5] Alternatively, a judge can approve a minor’s petition.

HR 3577 bars all those restrictions.

This is key as well.
"A prohibition on abortion after fetal viability when, in the good-faith medical judgment of the treating health care provider, continuation of the pregnancy would pose a risk to the pregnant patient’s life or health." The bolded above is not a “meaningful limitation” on late-term abortion and would effectively allow abortions until birth (and has).

That combined with the restrictions listed section 4 means the woman and the abortion provider alone is all that is needed to perform late term abortions. As has been shown in the board on multiple occasions (Guttmacher studies) the majority of 10-15k late term abortions are elective - so we already know some abortion providers are willing to do this. This bill just further frees them up. Need I remind you that Dr. Gosnell was an abortion health care provider.

There really isn't a question that late term elective abortions are being done - this bill prevents any road blocks states might impose to limit those abortions (Even removing the limitations some States already had in place under Roe ie Virginia's).

[mooby]

Lets be honest nonniey, how many women do you think exist in America that would carry a pregnancy for 6+ months dealing with all the daily issues and then decide on a whim they don't want the baby anymore? Most of all third trimester abortions are due to fetus viability or the life of the mother being at risk.

You're talking about women who have spent 6+ months preparing their home for a child, spending lots of money on doctor visits making sure the pregnancy is going to plan, getting emotionally attached/picking names/etc. only to decide in the 4th quarter they would kill an innocent child with no health issues? You can make the most legitimate argument you want this is a scenario that happens too often in America and I'd still think you're fucking crazy. It's an argument that is not based in reality. Feel free to keep trying though.

[MTK]

Farewell democracy

https://reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/...ocracy_before/

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by mooby

Lets be honest nonniey, how many women do you think exist in America that would carry a pregnancy for 6+ months dealing with all the daily issues and then decide on a whim they don't want the baby anymore? Most of all third trimester abortions are due to fetus viability or the life of the mother being at risk.

You're talking about women who have spent 6+ months preparing their home for a child, spending lots of money on doctor visits making sure the pregnancy is going to plan, getting emotionally attached/picking names/etc. only to decide in the 4th quarter they would kill an innocent child with no health issues? You can make the most legitimate argument you want this is a scenario that happens too often in America and I'd still think you're fucking crazy. It's an argument that is not based in reality. Feel free to keep trying though.

But honestly Mooby most abortion, 94%, happen 15 weeks or prior. So with with the same logic: 15 weeks ban makes perfect sense then with the exception a mother life is in danger there after with 2 doctors signing off.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by MTK

Farewell democracy

https://reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/...ocracy_before/

Democrats have no one to blame but themselves and their terrible policies which have lead us here.

You went too left…too woke and you went broke, and broke the middle, working class folks with their energy, economy polices. And focusing too much on trannies, green energy and defund to the police.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Democrats have no one to blame but themselves and their terrible policies which have lead us here.

You went too left…too woke and you went broke, and broke the middle, working class folks with their energy, economy polices. And focusing too much on trannies, green energy and defund to the police.

STFU!