Ramsey wants to be traded (merged)

[irish]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

Bring on Jason Campbell. Brunell will never lead us to the playoffs. Ramsey is not going to want to be here or ever feel secure in this town. Why waste time, let's get the rook some experience...

That means another season gone by the wayside because rookie QBs just cannot win in this league. Maybe MB can get the team rolling but if the season is toast by Nov then I agree, let the rookie get some experience.

[BleedBurgundy]

I'm going on last year when I say that. I honestly feel like starting Brunell is a statement. And that statement is "We're not going to win a whole hell of alot this year."

[jbcjr14]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I'm going on last year when I say that. I honestly feel like starting Brunell is a statement. And that statement is "We're not going to win a whole hell of alot this year."

Well I agree with the statement, but I think its more like..."We are not going to keep turning the ball over due to poor QB decisions and throws".

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by jbcjr14

Well I agree with the statement, but I think its more like..."We are not going to keep turning the ball over due to poor QB decisions and throws".

Perhaps, but we're also not going to find the endzone either.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Remember, according to statements made last season by some Brunell's supporters, the defense isn't scoring enough points. We can't put all the blame on Brunell and the offense. I mean, why isn't the defense scoring more than 16 points per game!!!!

I expect to see more of the same sort of talk. People have put their pride on the line and will likely come up with any excuse NOT to blame Brunell (whereas they were right quick to blame Ramsey for everything).

[Joe Knows...]

Last year WAS Brunells fault. In my opinion, he had a lot to do with it. Of coarse much also lays on the recievers and backs for all of their dropped passes.

But that was LAST YEAR. Last year is OVER! This is THIS YEAR! It's a completely different season and there are a lot of variables from how one player performs from one season to the next. So far, I like what I've seen from Brunell THIS SEASON, and I do not from Patrick, THIS SEASON.

I can tell you how much I loved Patrick LAST YEAR and how much I thought he would be the guy LAST YEAR, but that wouldn't change a dang thing. It's past, it's over, and it's a new day. THIS YEAR has been a completely different story so far than what we saw last year.

[Daseal]

Many, Many QB's have been benched for substandard play (including Joe Theisman).

Substandard play? Ramsey had one turnover I blame him for. The hit Briggs put on him should have, by all accounts, been a penelty and I cant see anyone holding on to the ball after something like that. He also threw for more yards in 1 quarter than Brunell did for the rest of the game.

Here's the deal, I'd rather have a QB that can stretch the field, back the safeties off, and complete some long balls but turn it over more than someone who is a safer bet but makes small completions. Sorry, when you have a defense like ours you can afford turnovers from time to time. Ramsey gives us the best chance to score, and that's what we need.

[LadyT]

Thanks for the words of encouragement. The big boys on this board don't scare me at all. I've found that too many of them are willing to go whichever way Gibbs goes, without even thinking for themselves. Don't get me wrong, I used to love Gibbs and felt that he could do no wrong. I was so glad when Snyder brought him back. But my loyalty is not totally blind. At some point, you have to begin to think for yourself and stop following the leader, wherever he takes you, if you think the path he has chosen is wrong.

Never thought I would say this about Gibbs, but yesterday he lost a lot of the respect I always had in him. I am very disappointed in the shameful way he has treated Ramsey. It's now apparent that, despite what he said, Ramsey was never firmly his starting QB and that's what hurts the most - to realize you can no longer trust what Gibbs says. This is very detrimental to the team and its spirit.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by LadyT

Thanks for the words of encouragement. The big boys on this board don't scare me at all. I've found that too many of them are willing to go whichever way Gibbs goes, without even thinking for themselves.

To think you can make a better decision than Gibbs is insane. How many Super Bowl trophies have you won? Shoot, how many pop-warner trophies have you won? How many Skins meetings have you attended? How about practices? To say that you're more abreast of the situation than Gibbs is absolutely rediculous.

Big boy or not, every opinion matters, but I have take offense when opinions become intertwined with fuzzy stats and emotions.

I'm behind Gibbs 100%. Three Lombardi trophies don't lie.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by LadyT

Thanks for the words of encouragement. The big boys on this board don't scare me at all. I've found that too many of them are willing to go whichever way Gibbs goes, without even thinking for themselves. Don't get me wrong, I used to love Gibbs and felt that he could do no wrong. I was so glad when Snyder brought him back. But my loyalty is not totally blind. At some point, you have to begin to think for yourself and stop following the leader, wherever he takes you, if you think the path he has chosen is wrong.

Never thought I would say this about Gibbs, but yesterday he lost a lot of the respect I always had in him. I am very disappointed in the shameful way he has treated Ramsey. It's now apparent that, despite what he said, Ramsey was never firmly his starting QB and that's what hurts the most - to realize you can no longer trust what Gibbs says. This is very detrimental to the team and its spirit.

So I guess you'd take Ramsey over Gibbs at this point?

[12thMan]

I just don't like the idea of Joe Gibbs taking so much heat for supposedly not being as loyal to Patrick as he is to Mark Brunell, as if he likes Brunell more as person. What a bunch of crock!! Listen, Gibbs wants to win. Period! He's so passionate about this organization and he's willing to take whatever heat and make whatever unpopular decisions it takes to get the Redskins winning.

Joe Gibbs doesn't owe anything to Mark Brunell or Ramsey for that matter. His loyalty ultimately lies to, first himself as a coach, then the organization, and the fans - not necessarily in that order. But let's make it clear Gibbs owes no loyalty or "second" chances to one particular player. I believe Gibbs is as integral as they come (like most of us here believe about him) and IMO he's just making the best decision that will ultimately put the Redskins in a better position to win games.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by LadyT

Thanks for the words of encouragement. The big boys on this board don't scare me at all. I've found that too many of them are willing to go whichever way Gibbs goes, without even thinking for themselves. Don't get me wrong, I used to love Gibbs and felt that he could do no wrong. I was so glad when Snyder brought him back. But my loyalty is not totally blind. At some point, you have to begin to think for yourself and stop following the leader, wherever he takes you, if you think the path he has chosen is wrong.

Never thought I would say this about Gibbs, but yesterday he lost a lot of the respect I always had in him. I am very disappointed in the shameful way he has treated Ramsey. It's now apparent that, despite what he said, Ramsey was never firmly his starting QB and that's what hurts the most - to realize you can no longer trust what Gibbs says. This is very detrimental to the team and its spirit.

What?? Trust me, Gibbs, after being enshrined in Canton and three Super Bowls, soon to be four Super Bowls, isn't after anyones respect.

Ultimatley Gibbs made this decision because whatever reason he had for benching Ramsey, Joe Gibbs had to sleep with Joe Gibbs at the end of the day and live or die with his own decisions as a coach. Look, the NFL is not about being loyal to any one player. Hell, if it were about loyalty Jerry Rice probably would have never ended up playing in Oakland or Seattle! They would have kept him around simply for the sake of 'loyalty'. ( I know we're talking about two different deals here, but you get my point.)

This is about winning games - and ultimately coach Gibbs has to be loyal to himself and the organization and the fans! We don't have to agree with everything he's doing. He wasn't brought here to be the most popular guy in town - he was brought here to win games.

This is the same Joe Gibbs that has released and benched players plenty of times in the past, this just happens to be a decision that he made more scrutnized because he publicly declared Patrick the starter. Well, guess what - Joe changed his mind in game two.

[LadyT]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

To think you can make a better decision than Gibbs is insane. How many Super Bowl trophies have you won? Shoot, how many pop-warner trophies have you won? How many Skins meetings have you attended? How about practices? To say that you're more abreast of the situation than Gibbs is absolutely rediculous.

Big boy or not, every opinion matters, but I have take offense when opinions become intertwined with fuzzy stats and emotions.

I'm behind Gibbs 100%. Three Lombardi trophies don't lie.

And where did I say that I'm more abreast of the situation than Gibbs?

What I DID say is that I'm not afraid to question his decisions, if I don't agree with them. Apparently, there are many on this board who are ready to cannonize Gibbs, regardless of how the team is now performing. Guess I'm not one of those people - I prefer to think for myself.

Gibbs' 3 rings were achieved many, many years ago. The game is very different now and so is this Redskins team. The glory years are but a distant memory, unfortunately.

I was hoping that Gibbs could lead us back to future days of glory, but he took a giant step backwards yesterday, in my opinion.

Will I always love and root for the Skins? Absolutely.

Does that mean that I can't question those decisions that are made by the staff? Of course not.

Gibbs is not infallible, but I guess the proof will be in the pudding. If Brunell suddenly takes us on a winning streak, I will be very happy. But, something tells me that this is not going to happen.

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted by LadyT

What I DID say is that I'm not afraid to question his decisions, if I don't agree with them. Apparently, there are many on this board who are ready to cannonize Gibbs, regardless of how the team is now performing. Guess I'm not one of those people - I prefer to think for myself.

The arrogance you display in 'thinking for yourself' and questioning Gibbs makes you sound like you think you could run a team better than Gibbs, which I'd like to see.

[Daseal]

I haven't seen any arrogance from Lady T at all. She's simply saying that it's better for you to have an opinion then to blindly follow Gibbs -- I think that's a lesson that can be asserted to every facet of life.