D. Hall is our lone Pro Bowl selection

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by 44ever

Right perception is what you are demonstrating. Reality is D. Hall is "one of" the best CB's in the league. And a Pro Bowl MVP. Who leads the league in INT's and tackles among CB's.

But unfortunatly for Rogers, Hall is the better all around CB. Tipped balls don't change games momentum or turn into TD's as much as INT's do. Rogers is not even close to the CB Hall is. If he was then Rogers would be 2011 Pro Bowl MVP. Right?

I can tell you have very little knowledge of the game of football. I liked this article about the best CBs in the league when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Oakland's CB tandem No. 1? Insiders rank five better - NFL - CBSSports.com Football

As for their cornerbacks, they should make for a good tandem, and, yes, they could wind up being one of the league's best.

I said could. Because while Nnamdi Asomugha is terrific, Hall is erratic and unreliable -- a talented player who thinks he's better than he is and who is coming off two subpar seasons.

Notice what he said about talented player who thinks he's better than he is. Back up by a defensive coordinator who pretty much says the same thing.

"The only way the Raiders are the best pair of cornerbacks," said an AFC defensive coordinator, "is when Hall is doing the evaluating. It's like he's a self-proclaimed Muhammad Ali.

"But Oakland has its cornerbacks playing man-to-man most of the game, and that's tough. So you're going to notice them, just as you're going to notice cornerbacks in schemes that depend more on that position than in defenses like Indianapolis, Tampa Bay or Chicago."

Still, Hall and Asomugha are not in a league of their own. Not yet anyway, though one secondary coach conceded that "if Hall plays to his potential and (Asomugha) has a good year they might be the best."

Comments above from a AFC def coordinator back when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Not satisfied with people's opinion? Let's go to the stats. Below are stats from the 2008 season.

Updated CB power rankings - The Official San Diego Chargers Forum

This guy presents hard proof that D. Hall has and was been one of the worst rated CBs in the game.

1. Nnamdi Asomugha (1)
Last Week (vs. ATL): 0 attempts, 5 yards
Season Total: 11 attempts, 3.82 YPA, 54.55 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

2. Sheldon Brown (4)
Last Week (vs. SEA): 7 attempts, 7 yards, 4 INC forced
Season Total: 30 attempts, 3.10 YPA, 46.67 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

3. Corey Webster (2)
Last Week (vs. DAL): 6 attempts, 36 yards, 4 INC forced, 1 TD
Season Total: 34 attempts, 3.65 YPA, 55.88 Forced INC%, 1 TD

4. Charles Woodson (3)
Last Week (vs. TEN): 5 attempts, 26 yards, 2 INC forced
Season Total: 41 attempts, 4.37 YPA, 63.41 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

5. Al Harris (13)
Last Week (vs. TEN): 4 attempts, 0 yards, 4 INC forced
Season Total: 19 attempts, 3.58 YPA, 63.16 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

6. Darrelle Revis (10)
Last Week (vs. BUF): 1 attempt, 0 yards, 1 INC forced
Season Total: 35 attempts, 5.23 YPA, 51.43 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

7. Carlos Rogers (7)
Last Week (vs. PIT): 14 attempts, 87 yards, 9 INC forced, 1 TD
Season Total: 72 attempts, 5.51 YPA, 50.00 Forced INC%, 2 TDs

8. Ronald Bartell (5)
Last Week (vs. ARZ): 9 attempts, 68 yards, 3 INC forced
Season Total: 47 attempts, 5.85 YPA, 42.55 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

9. Cortland Finnegan (6)
Last Week (vs. GB): 10 attempts, 79 yards, 7 INC forced
Season Total: 50 attempts, 6.50 YPA, 46.00 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

10. Antoine Winfield (14)
Last Week (vs. HOU): 2 attempts, 7 yards, 1 INC forced
Season Total: 27 attempts, 5.26 YPA, 48.15 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

11. Jabari Greer (9)
Last Week (vs. NYJ): 5 attempts, 27 yards, 3 INC forced
Season Total: 45 attempts, 5.33 YPA, 44.44 Forced INC%, 2 TDs

12. Quentin Jammer (11)
Last Week: BYE
Season Total: 45 attempts, 5.49 YPA, 42.22 Forced INC%, 2 TDs

13. Nick Harper (8)
Last Week (vs. GB): 8 attempts, 90 yards, 2 INC forced
Season Total: 50 attempts, 5.56 YPA, 36.00 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

14. Phillip Buchanon (12)
Last Week (vs. KC): 3 attempts, 56 yards, 1 INC forced
Season Total: 39 attempts, 5.67 YPA, 38.46 Forced INC%, 1 TD

15. Kelvin Hayden (15)
Last Week (vs. NE): Did not play (injured)
Season Total: 15 attempts, 4.00 YPA, 53.33 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

16. Rashean Mathis (16)
Last Week (vs. CIN): 7 attempts, 37 yards, 1 INC forced, 2 TDs
Season Total: 39 attempts, 6.23 YPA, 43.59 Forced INC%, 3 TDs

17. Bryant McFadden (17)
Last Week (vs. WAS): Did not play (injured)
Season Total: 41 attempts, 5.44 YPA, 31.71 Forced INC%, 1 TD

18. Antoine Cason (19)
Last Week: BYE
Season Total: 33 attempts, 5.30 YPA, 21.21 Forced INC%, 1 TD

19. Richard Marshall (22)
Last Week: BYE
Season Total: 18 attempts, 5.06 YPA, 22.22 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

20. Mike Jenkins (18)
Last Week (vs. NYG): 9 attempts, 52 yards, 2 INC forced, 1 TD
Season Total: 30 attempts, 5.57 YPA, 30.00 Forced INC%, 2 TDs

21. Kevin Dockery (20)
Last Week (vs. DAL): Did not play (injured)
Season Total: 26 attempts, 5.15 YPA, 26.92 Forced INC%, 0 TDs

22. Stanford Routt (21)
Last Week: 1 attempt, 27 yards, 1 TD
Season Total: 16 attempts, 5.00 YPA, 56.25 Forced INC%, 2 TDs

23. Asante Samuel (NR)
Last Week (vs. SEA): 4 attempts, 0 yards, 2 INC forced
Season Total: 43 attempts, 6.79 YPA, 39.53 Forced INC%, 3 TDs

24. Chris Houston (24)
Last Week (vs. OAK): 3 attempts, 7 yards, 1 INC forced
Season Total: 48 attempts, 6.69 YPA, 35.42 Forced INC%, 1 TD

25. Mike McKenzie (25)
Last Week: BYE
Season Total: 26 attempts, 7.12 YPA, 34.62 Forced INC%, 1 TD

Top 10 most thrown at CBs

1. Carlos Rogers (72)
2. DeAngelo Hall (64)
3. Charles Tillman (56)
4. Chris Gamble (53)
5. Andre Goodman (52)
6T. Antonio Cromartie (50)
6T. Cortland Finnegan (50)
6T. Nick Harper (50)
6T. Brent Grimes (50)
6T. Dwight Lowery (50)

2006:
DeAngelo Hall
Targeted: 87 times
Yards allowed: 798 (2nd worst in NFL)
YPA: 9.2 (76th in the NFL)

2007:
DeAngelo Hall
Targeted: 69 times
Yards allowed: 539
YPA: 7.8 (54th in the NFL)

Did Al Davis watch any game film before making the decision to bring him in? It seems like all he did was turn on Madden 08 to see that Hall was fast and rated highly. That was enough for him to give up the farm to bring him in. Hall has never had a good CB playing on the other side of the field, so you would think that would make QBs throw away from him, but that wasn’t the case. He was beat and beat often by average WRs. So how was he REALLY performing in Oakland?

2008:
DeAngelo Hall
Targeted: 64 times (2nd most in NFL)
Catches allowed: 41 (most in NFL)
Yards allowed: 581 (most in NFL)
YPA: 9.08 (13th worst amongst starters)
Forced Incompletion %: 20.31% (10th worst amongst qualifiers)

Guess what? I think he also led CBs this year in catches/yards allowed for a CB. So besides that precious Int number you are holding onto, you have any stats to back up your claim he's one of the best CBs in the game? Truthfully, nothing much has changed since those years either. He still gets a shareof INTs, but still gives up a ton of plays/TDs/Yards. Like I said, play maker that's unreliable and inconsistent.

QBs are consistently throwing his direction for a reason.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

I can tell you have very little knowledge of the game of football. I liked this article about the best CBs in the league when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Oakland's CB tandem No. 1? Insiders rank five better - NFL - CBSSports.com Football



Notice what he said about talented player who thinks he's better than he is. Back up by a defensive coordinator who pretty much says the same thing.




Comments above from a AFC def coordinator back when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Not satisfied with people's opinion? Let's go to the stats. Below are stats from the 2008 season.

Updated CB power rankings - The Official San Diego Chargers Forum

This guy presents hard proof that D. Hall has and was been one of the worst rated CBs in the game.







Guess what? I think he also led CBs this year in catches/yards allowed for a CB. So besides that precious Int number you are holding onto, you have any stats to back up your claim he's one of the best CBs in the game? Truthfully, nothing much has changed since those years either. He still gets a shareof INTs, but still gives up a ton of plays/TDs/Yards. Like I said, play maker that's unreliable and inconsistent.

QBs are consistently throwing his direction for a reason.

How come your using old stats?

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

I'm seeing a lot of double speak. You're saying your not downing those who appreciate Redskins making the Pro Bowl, but you're also saying they're homers and unrealistic. Then you down the Pro Bowl game itself and then question whether or not a certain player deserves to play in it or not. Then you say you don't dislike the guy, but you continue putting the guy down as if he's dirt. Please, at least be consistent.

I'm very consistent. I suggest you reread what I said or ask for clarification.

I can cheer on my favorite team without being a clueless homer that believes that their players are more valuable or have no flaws.

First off, you complain that I'm saying something "negative" about our Pro-Bowl player. It's like you question our fan hood because we dont' chose to wear rose colored glasses like many homers. You guys were chirping about people and their views about D. Hall being overrated. If you don't want to be criticized, my suggestion to you is not to criticize the others. After all, they (including myself) have a valid point. You guys have your right to your opinion, and we have ours.

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Barry Sanders was not consistent with his running. He would get bottled up for 5 and 6 yards losses and then he might break a long one on the next down. DeAngelo Hall is similar (and NO I don't believe DeAngelo Hall is as good as Barry Sanders before you start that argument) in that he might get burned on a pass or two, but he might intercept the next one and take it to the house. He's a gambler, sometimes it pays off, sometimes it doesn't, but he's not trash.

Not even remotely in the same ball park, but thanks for coming out. That was a pathetic attempt at making a comparison.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

How come your using old stats?

Have they changed much in terms of him being high on the list of catches allowed, yards allowed, and TDs allowed? Has anything changed over the past 2 years that suddenly vaulted him into the elite category of corner backs? I'll retract that if you can prove it to be wrong.


ESPN 980 - Home of the Redskins

**DeAngelo Hall, has made a living out of getting burnt and creating plays at pretty much a 50/50 clip. Hall got burnt badly on a 92-yard TD and run by Mario Manningham. The Redskins blitzed on the 2nd-and-7 play, sending six rushers but getting no real pressure on Eli Manning. Hall mis-judged the ball and was torched by Manningham for a killer score to make it 17-7 Giants, a play that ultimately was the difference.

Doesn't look like they've changed much to me. Thought dude prior said his play hasn't cost us games?...lol

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Fox didn't even try with that broadcast team last night... just brutal. Just like the game I guess.

Why do you hate Carl Edwards?

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

I'm very consistent. I suggest you reread what I said or ask for clarification.

Yeah, you're very consistent at being inconsistent.

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

First off, you complain that I'm saying something "negative" about our Pro-Bowl player. It's like you question our fan hood because we dont' chose to wear rose colored glasses like many homers. You guys were chirping about people and their views about D. Hall being overrated. If you don't want to be criticized, my suggestion to you is not to criticize the others. After all, they (including myself) have a valid point. You guys have your right to your opinion, and we have ours.

See, there you go with the homer, rose-colored card that people who want to sit and moan always seem to want to pull out of the back their pants in order to look more "realistic". Here's something that's realistic. DeAngelo Hall is a Pro Bowl player. Deal with it.

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Not even remotely in the same ball park, but thanks for coming out. That was a pathetic attempt at making a comparison.

Oh, here we go! Talk about someone who can't read context clues. Hey buddy, you're going out of your way to make yourself look very "Offiss" like. And if you don't know what I'm talking about, ask someone who's been here since about '04.

[Monkeydad]

DeAngelo Hall Named Pro Bowl MVP For Very DeAngelo Hall-ish Performance


Vid of TD there.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

I can tell you have very little knowledge of the game of football. I liked this article about the best CBs in the league when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Oakland's CB tandem No. 1? Insiders rank five better - NFL - CBSSports.com Football



Notice what he said about talented player who thinks he's better than he is. Back up by a defensive coordinator who pretty much says the same thing.




Comments above from a AFC def coordinator back when D. Hall was with Oakland.

Not satisfied with people's opinion? Let's go to the stats. Below are stats from the 2008 season.

Updated CB power rankings - The Official San Diego Chargers Forum

This guy presents hard proof that D. Hall has and was been one of the worst rated CBs in the game.







Guess what? I think he also led CBs this year in catches/yards allowed for a CB. So besides that precious Int number you are holding onto, you have any stats to back up your claim he's one of the best CBs in the game? Truthfully, nothing much has changed since those years either. He still gets a shareof INTs, but still gives up a ton of plays/TDs/Yards. Like I said, play maker that's unreliable and inconsistent.

QBs are consistently throwing his direction for a reason.

You do know that it is the year 2011 and D. Hall plays on the Washington Redskins right?

Tell you what, since you exposed my lack of football knowledge with your bias articles from 2006-2008. I will just keep ignorantly watching as DeAngelo Hall makes game changing plays next season as a Redskin in 2011 and ends up back in another Pro Bowl. As for your boy Rogers, who you say is a better CB than Hall, not so sure.

But your the expert.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

See, there you go with the homer, rose-colored card that people who want to sit and moan always seem to want to pull out of the back their pants in order to look more "realistic". Here's something that's realistic. DeAngelo Hall is a Pro Bowl player. Deal with it.

You confuse me with somebody who cares? I'm happy for D. Hall, and all the guys that made the pro-bowl. If you want to bitch and complain about us making comments in regards to our players, then expect homer comments. You can cheer on who you like and be happy for them. That doesn't give you the right to question my opinion of such player. That doesn't mean I'm any less of a fan than you are. You chose to see things how you want to, and I chose to see the common view that most people see outside of Redskins nation.

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Oh, here we go! Talk about someone who can't read context clues. Hey buddy, you're going out of your way to make yourself look very "Offiss" like. And if you don't know what I'm talking about, ask someone who's been here since about '04.

Not the "I've been here since 2004" card. Your comparison wasn't remotely in the same ball park, but I guess it is if it suits your argument. A CB that gambles and gets burned/rewarded on a 50/50 basis, isn't the same as a runner that uses the best option each play but can only do so much. D. Hall isn't dependent on 5-7 guys to cover his guy. Barry Sanders relied on 5-7 guys each down to make those runs. It's not the same, and any person with a half a brain knows it.

[Chico23231]

Wow I had no clue that there was this much hate for our only playmaker on the team.

Finger point to a probowler who happened to make the organization at least proud one day in a otherwise miserable season.

U need to be running stats on our DL, LBs, OL, RBs, and QB play and then compare with the rest of the league to show our where the real issues of our team lie.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by 44ever

You do know that it is the year 2011 and D. Hall plays on the Washington Redskins right?

Tell you what, since you exposed my lack of football knowledge with your bias articles from 2006-2008. I will just keep ignorantly watching as DeAngelo Hall makes game changing plays next season as a Redskin in 2011 and ends up back in another Pro Bowl. As for your boy Rogers, who you say is a better CB than Hall, not so sure.

But your the expert.

Rogers certainly is a better cover corner in terms of consistency, but he DOES NOT MAKE PLAYS due to his stone hands. D. Hall may get beat more, but he also makes game changing plays. He made the key plays that won the Dallas and Chicago games. For the life of me, I don't recall a single play that Rogers has ever made that tipped a game in the balance our way.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister;781506[B

]Rogers certainly is a better cover corner in terms of consistency[/B], but he DOES NOT MAKE PLAYS due to his stone hands. D. Hall may get beat more, but he also makes game changing plays. He made the key plays that won the Dallas and Chicago games. For the life of me, I don't recall a single play that Rogers has ever made that tipped a game in the balance our way.

Yep, I agree Rogers is a better cover guy but IMO thats only because he is not as aggressive as Hall. Hall certainly has the speed, height and ball awareness to shut down WR's But, because of his style and aggressive play he tends to get burnt more often than a pure cover guy.

The other thing I take into account when accessing Hall is the projected player he is becoming. I like what I see from him and only see more and more success as he continues to mature.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by 44ever

You do know that it is the year 2011 and D. Hall plays on the Washington Redskins right?

Tell you what, since you exposed my lack of football knowledge with your bias articles from 2006-2008. I will just keep ignorantly watching as DeAngelo Hall makes game changing plays next season as a Redskin in 2011 and ends up back in another Pro Bowl. As for your boy Rogers, who you say is a better CB than Hall, not so sure.

But your the expert.

You are right, it is 2011. So let's review some 2011 games.

ESPN 980 - Home of the Redskins

**One week after Redskins Pro Bowl CB DeAngelo Hall said he wanted to be on the # 1 pass-catching option for the opposing team, regardless of field sides -- Hall and others, got lit up by young Sam Bradford who threw short, quick release timing passes. Several plays stick out in my mind, such as smoke screen in which Hall slipped in coverage on, and a big pass down to the Redskins-1 yard line that set up a score.

**DeAngelo Hall continued his torrid interception pace by stepping in front of Calvin Johnson in the back corner of the end zone for his 5th pick in just over one game. Hall however was responsible for two of Calvin Johnson's three scores on the day. Hall was beaten on a stop route, and then was unable to tackle Johnson along with two other Redskin defenders before the end-zone for one score, and was also beaten on a slant score by Johnson after giving way too much cushion.

Everyone remembers Peyton Manning playing under the Sunday Night Lights and carving up DeAngelo Hall and LaRon Landry on the first play from scrimmage (a 57 yard TD to Pierre Garcon)

**DeAngelo Hall, has made a living out of getting burnt and creating plays at pretty much a 50/50 clip. Hall got burnt badly on a 92-yard TD and run by Mario Manningham. The Redskins blitzed on the 2nd-and-7 play, sending six rushers but getting no real pressure on Eli Manning. Hall mis-judged the ball and was torched by Manningham for a killer score to make it 17-7 Giants, a play that ultimately was the difference.

Yup, keep ignoring those facts. But it's ok, he led a lot of INTs!!!! (4 in one and 2 over the course of 15 games??...yup, consistent...lol)


I want you to get this straight and stop putting words in my mouth. I never said that Rogers was better than Hall. Let's review what I said.

I'm not a D. Hall hater, I just see D. Hall for what he is. A play maker who's also unreliable and inconsistent. Truth be told, Carlos Rogers plays the CB position better than D. Hall in terms of coverage. Too bad that kid has hands of stone or he'd be starting at CB in the pro-bowl OVER D. Hall.

Now if you equate that to me saying Rogers is better than D. Hall, then by all means continue to be delusional. Pretty much the same thing this guy said.

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

Rogers certainly is a better cover corner in terms of consistency, but he DOES NOT MAKE PLAYS due to his stone hands. D. Hall may get beat more, but he also makes game changing plays. He made the key plays that won the Dallas and Chicago games. For the life of me, I don't recall a single play that Rogers has ever made that tipped a game in the balance our way.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Wow I had no clue that there was this much hate for our only playmaker on the team.

Finger point to a probowler who happened to make the organization at least proud one day in a otherwise miserable season.

U need to be running stats on our DL, LBs, OL, RBs, and QB play and then compare with the rest of the league to show our where the real issues of our team lie.

I've never stated that CB was a priority concern on this team, just pointing out DHall is overrated. That said, I believe our biggest concerns are this:


1) QB
2) OL (interior to be exact..rabach is garbage)
3) DL (NT/DE) crucial to 3-4
4) LBs need to fit the 3-4 scheme
5) WR (move moss to slot)
6) FS


QB will always be in the #1 slot till it's fixed. This will never change and why it's the most important position on the field. (and highest paid)

[Ruhskins]

I don't get why people go so much out of their way to bash a player in their favorite team. Especially since the reason D.Hall went to the Pro Bowl, is because someone backed out. Even still, shouldn't fans of a team be happy that their team is somewhat represented in the Pro Bowl? If I didn't know better, by the way some of these comments are sounding, you'd think that Hall was playing for the Cowboys.